Himmat Singh ji,
Guru fateh.
Thanks for the response.
So do you mean the above is your own personal opinion and nothing more?
If it is something beyond that then I would like your to elaborate that by stating your theological reasons or facts.
What in your opinion is a difference between theology and pragmatism?
Isn't theology a part of dogmas that Sikhi rejects?
I will wait for your response but just to simplify and focus on what Sikhi is based on, we have to understand Mool Mantar first which describes what Ik Ong Kaar IS, which is totally different than "God" which involves a deity and a dogma. The rest of the names which are more than a few mentioned above compliment Ik Ong Kaar in a poetic manner but for a Sikh it is a must to understand and grasp the distinction between Ik Ong Kaar and "God" otherwise all discussions become futile and become tugs of wars of egos. Nothing more. Mool Mantar is the blue print of Sikhi. In fact, you can find my little essay about it in the forum.
Well, if your above statement is true than it contradicts with your claim that Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji is based on theological reasons because as mentioned before any theology requires dogmas.
So, which is it?
Here, you are once again confusing yourself between the pragmatic Sikhi and the rules, regulations and archaic laws of the Indian constitution. These have nothing to do with the spiritual side of Sikhi but just the political side. You must be very much aware that there is a quota system for people to enter into the universities in India. SGPC which sponsors and manages many Sikh colleges wanted the court to decide how to define a Sikh for this very purpose so that the preferences are given to the Sikhs and the court decided what a Sikh is. It is your right to disagree with the court's decision but it has nothing to do with the thread you have started. This is a separate matter all together. I do not understand your resentment towards Sikhs and Sikhi when the decision was made by the High court.
Hopefully, one day when we get rid of the caste systems from all aspects including in Sikhi and the quota system is eliminated, then we will not have to go to the courts to decide who is a Sikh or not, however the purpose of this was very narrow and it has nothing to do with you or with me as we are not seeking the admission to any Sikh college in Punjab. So, this resentment is unfounded and irrelevant in our discussion about Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji.
Once again, for me Lord has nothing to do with Ik Ong Kaar in Sikhi. As the original translators were non Sikhs and were Christians, they gave Sikhi a Biblical slant and many of their Sikh students who translated the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji carried on with the same. Bhai Manmohan Singh is one of them.
In the fear of tooting my own horn and immersing into me-ism while talking about One-ism, I do apologise in advance and would like to share with you that I did write a little piece which can be also found in this forum." Lord as Ik Ong Kaar", which in my opinion is an insult and distortion of the true meaning of Ik Ong Kaar.
If I am not mistaken, I think you are confused about the word "unknowable" in Gurbani and used this as part of the definition of an opinion by our Gurus.
Unknowable talks about the immensity of Ik Ong Kaar. It has nothing to do with, But to the contrary.
Secondly, there is nothing called Absolute "Truth" in Sikhi like in the dogmatic religions, however Truth is absolute and it is explained very well in the first pauri of Jap by Guru Nanak.
This couplet is repeated 4 times at the end of Pauri 12 to 15. Pauri number 12 has the word ਮੰਨੇ Manei which means one who understands and accepts which is different from Pauris 13 to 15 where the word is ਮੰਨੈ Maneiei meaning one who has understood and accepted. This is nothing to do with faith as you claim. As mentioned before Mool Mantar is the Blue print of Sikhi, Jap ji is the foundation of Sikhi and the rest of the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji leaves us to our own individual endeavours of what kinds of buildings we want to construct with the help of the blue print and the foundation.
Lastly, before these 4 pauris, there are pauris that show us how to be good listeners. Gurbani shows us the steps how to breed goodness within and gives us the tools to become better as beings. It has nothing to do with faith. Hence, we do injustice to Gurbani and to our visionary Gurus when we pick a couple of lines just to prove our point. It is like the ends justifying the means rather than the other way around.
Now, you are contradicting yourself. Here is your original statement:
You know it very well that all other Scriptures except Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji are based on hearsays which are akin to rumours especially when something is written 60 to 120 years after the words had been supposedly uttered. These are like "Chinese Whispers", using your terminology.
I have said repeatedly that if the oral traditions and the oral history like Sakhis contradict Gurmat ideals of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji then they should be rejected vehemently and can not be made part of the Miri-Piri concept of Sikhi.
Pardon my ignorance but what is in bold seems like more a dogmatic babble with a Biblical slant. Would you be kind enough to elaborate what you mean by the above?
Everything is written and expressed by men unless the "God" you believe in is a deity and dogmatic. I would also like you to express this distinction that you have in your mind.
You have to explain how you have come to the conclusions that the compositions are opinions rather than visions. What made you conclude that? Aren't you a Sikh as well? Are you directing the above to yourself?
Once again you have shown your dogmatic trait in the above. There is nothing called Guru worship in Sikhi. I have no idea where you got that from. Guru means a teacher and Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji is our only teacher. Do you bow or matha tek to your elders who have been your teachers? This is nothing but a sign of respect in our tradition as is kissing the Bible or putting one's forehead on it.
More after hearing from you. I must confess that I am learning a lot through our interaction and I want to thank you for that.
Regards
Tejwant Singh
