Can You Expalin What Is Happening In This Video?

BlazinSikh · Oct 29, 2012

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji Ka Fateh,

The Question say it all here is the video link:

Fake Religion ( Sikhism) - YouTube

Please explain what in waheguru name is going on?

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji Ka Fateh.

prakash.s.bagga · Oct 29, 2012

What explanation does this vedio require?

What is going on is self explanatory.?

Prakash.s.Bagga

TigerStyleZ · Oct 29, 2012

What do you want to hear? They are doing Jhatka for Thilak. This is Hazoor Sahib, where they serve it as "Maahaa Parshaad". Everything is obvious, just the title is misleading! You want to rise the "meat issue" ? There is always a thread labelld "Fools who wranlge over flesh", just search for it in the engine. This is a Nihang practice.

BlazinSikh · Oct 29, 2012

TigerStyleZ ji and Prakash.s.Bagga ji, Thank you for replying.

As i am still studying sikhi, this practise and video was very new to me, i had just discovered this video today to be honest. By briefly explaing what the nihangs were doing i was able to do a lil reseach my self, so thank you.

However this practise does raise some question for me:
1) What is the purpose of doing "Jhatka for Thilak"?

2) In Sikhism we are told that rituals like these are useless, to me doing "Jhatka for Thilak" is like a useless ritual/practise. So why do nihangs do these rituals/practise?

P.S

TigerStyleZ said:
You want to rise the "meat issue" ? There is always a thread labelld "Fools who wranlge over flesh", just search for it in the engine. This is a Nihang practice.

I did/do not want to "rise the "meat issue""

TigerStyleZ · Oct 29, 2012

Yes, you are right, there are no rituals in Sikhi, i recommend you to visit.

http://www.sikhs.org

or
http://www.nihangsingh.org/website/trad-jhatka.html

and please refer to the post "fools who wrangle over flesh", because many things were discussed there as well. You can rise the meat issue, if you want. There is nothing wrong in questioning. ( I am telling this to you because of my experience.)

hope some other members can help as well.

kds1980 · Oct 29, 2012

BlazinSikh said:
TigerStyleZ ji and Prakash.s.Bagga ji, Thank you for replying.

As i am still studying sikhi, this practise and video was very new to me, i had just discovered this video today to be honest. By briefly explaing what the nihangs were doing i was able to do a lil reseach my self, so thank you.

However this practise does raise some question for me:
1) What is the purpose of doing "Jhatka for Thilak"?

2) In Sikhism we are told that rituals like these are useless, to me doing "Jhatka for Thilak" is like a useless ritual/practise. So why do nihangs do these rituals/practise?

P.S

I did/do not want to "rise the "meat issue""

Lol Sikhs are already doing lot of meaningless rituals.E.G AKJ amritdharis don't eat food cooked by others in the name of rehat nobody question them

BhagatSingh · Oct 29, 2012

Waheguru ji ka khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh
Read In the Master's Presence, the Sikhs of Hazoor Sahib Vol 1. That book explains what is happening here.

Tilak in general, outside of tilak on weapons has been done for a long time.
Guru Arjan GurGaddi | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

Luckysingh · Oct 29, 2012

Good responses!!
It does come as a little shock to some at first, but then you have more reason to learn as well.
:noticekudi:I was just standing back to let everyone else respond first until someone tried to blame the Dasam granth!!!.lolpeacesignlol

Kanwaljit.Singh · Oct 30, 2012

On some other thread people are questioning if Muslims should kill goats for Eid

Ambarsaria · Oct 30, 2012

Kanwaljit Singh ji thanks for your post.

Kanwaljit Singh said:
On some other thread people are questioning if Muslims should kill goats for Eid

I don't think this is sacrificial. The food will be consumed. Doing it the way these guys have organized the Jhatka probably keeps the crowd and others from being bothersome. The meat I am sure gets consumed and I am sure the arrows don't absorb any blood as they will be pretty fat by now :sippingcoffeemunda:.

The other issue we need to recognize is that "Sikhi" must be allowed or encouraged to grow from inside out. This allows for tolerance and personal growth. In this case perhaps the participants have not latched on to all aspects of Guru ji's teachings. I wonder if all of us have! So I think one needs to take such in stride while encouraging good.

Jhatka probably pre-dates any organized religion that we know of today though forms and styles may be different.

Sat Sri Akal.

Kanwaljit.Singh · Oct 30, 2012

The same is done with Eid meat too I guess. The idea is giving animal butchering a religious twist. This Jhatka was done on the premises of Hazur Sahib.

I was with Hazoori Sikhs for much time but avoided this argument anyhow.

prakash.s.bagga · Oct 31, 2012

I Think it may be worth considering such a ritual as SYMBOLIC reminder for the fact that even killing requires approval of the CREATOR.

Prakash.s.Bagga

BlazinSikh · Oct 31, 2012

Thanks you for your replies sangant,

TigerStylez Ji, Thanks for the link, i've read it not fully but briefly to get the understanding of doing Jhatka, but i will read it fully later on.

BhagatSingh cheer's for the book reccommendation i will definetly purchase it, i would be very greatfull if there are any book on sikh history that you can reccommend for me?

kds1980, i know that some sikh practise certain ritual, like the fanning of the SGGS, but these "ritual" are more to show love and respect to the SGGS, rather than doing it because some so called Gyiani tell us to do it. Most of these "ritual" are done from love, but doing Jhatka to me is just a stupid "ritual" (forgive me if i offend anyone), what i mean is that fine if Jhatka is something Nihangs do then fine, but why on Hazoor Sahib, such a holy place with a blood of an innocent animal, i mean not even muslims conduct Halal at a mosque, so why Hazoor sahib.:whatzpointkudi:

Luckysingh, your post quite intrigues me

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[/FONT]I was just standing back to let everyone else respond first until someone tried to blame the Dasam granth!!!.

I mean what respones would anyone make blaming the Dasam Granth? peacesignkaur

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji Ke Fateh

Randip Singh · Oct 31, 2012

Let me tackle this issue:

Jhatka = One Blow - It is a method not a ritual. Jhatka is the prescribed methd for killing an animal if an Amritdhari Sikh chooses to eat meat. Jhatka can be used as part of a ritual however.

Shastar Tilak comes from Rajputs who annointed their blood with the weapons of an animal killed in one blow (Jhatka). Shastar Tilak is a ritual.

Rajputs rituals entered some Sikh quarters when they were freed (Bandhi Chor Diwas) by the 6th Master. It was these Rajputs that taught Guru Hargobinds warriors the art of warfare. In teaching this warfare some of the rituals of the Rajputs became adopted.

Hazoori Sikhs are the direct descendents of the Sikhs that accopanied the 10th Master to the Deccan. It is their ancetors that cremated the 10th Masters body. They still carry on the traditions from the time of the 10th Master. Shaster Tilak used to occur in Harmandhir Sahib up until 1920, when Vaishnav orientated Sikhs objected alongside the Gurudwara Reform movement.

In many senses, Hazoori Sikhi is probably more closer to the original Sikhs of our 6th Master onwards.

kds1980 · Oct 31, 2012

BlazinSikh said:
kds1980, i know that some sikh practise certain ritual, like the fanning of the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, but these "ritual" are more to show love and respect to the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, rather than doing it because some so called Gyiani tell us to do it. Most of these "ritual" are done from love, but doing Jhatka to me is just a stupid "ritual" (forgive me if i offend anyone), what i mean is that fine if Jhatka is something Nihangs do then fine, but why on Hazoor Sahib, such a holy place with a blood of an innocent animal, i mean not even muslims conduct Halal at a mosque, so why Hazoor sahib.:whatzpointkudi:

A lot of people in world may believe that sikhs are following meaningless rituals like wearing kirpan, wearing turban etc but the sikhs who keep them believe they are following hukam of Guru Gobind singh ji.Similarly hazoori sikhs also believe that they are following hukam of Guru ji.To preserve the unity in Sikhism all Sikhs should respect each others rituals even if they don't like

BlazinSikh · Oct 31, 2012

Similarly hazoori sikhs also believe that they are following hukam of Guru ji

But that is the thing though it is the fact that they "believe" and not "know", now the fact is that i can not complain on what the nihangs are doing is right or wrong, however if they "believe" in what they are doing is right, why is it done on the ground of Hazoor Sahib. A sikh following the 5K's is not just your ordinary sikh like some that label sikhs themselves today, these sikhs are either Gursikh, or Amritdhari sikhs, and what they do is not on that they believe what they follow is a belife, but what they follow is the truth of sikhi.

Jhatka is something that has been done before sikhi, so it's not technically a "tradition" or "ritual" for sikhs/nihangs to do. However i say, i cannot complain whether it is right or wrong the fact is Jhatka should not be conducted at Hazoor Sahib, for the sake of respect.

Sorry if this debate starts to get annoying i do know where you are coming from these i just my opinions.

WJKK WJKF.peacesign

kds1980 · Oct 31, 2012

why is it done on the ground of Hazoor Sahib.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.worldsikhnews.com/21 January 2009/Goat Sacrifice at Hazur Sahib Myth & Truth.htm

It is not fair to presume that Jhatka of goat is a sacrificial act at Hazur Sahib and other Unit Gurdwaras of the Deccani Sikhs. Since thousands of years, it is a custom of warriors of India to put the Tilak of blood to their weaponry on the occasion of Dashara and Holi. In these Gurdwaras, the tilak of blood is put to the weapons, not to Guru Granth Sahib or any other idol or photograph.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Now if they want to put blood on ancient Shastars then they have to do jhatka in hazur sahib

what they follow is the truth of sikhi.

What is truth and what is false is very difficult to define.If you read more of sikh history you may start questioning that ,what people are doing is right? For example there is hardly any mention of 1 inch or 4 inch kirpan which sikh wear these days.Also the essence of being khalsa was to be martial and protect yourself and others.How many 5k wearing Sikhs
these days wear sharpened kirpan and know how to actually use them? there is good chance that some street thug may end up beating a Sikh with 5 ks.

Jhatka is something that has been done before sikhi, so it's not technically a "tradition" or "ritual" for sikhs/nihangs to do.

So what if it was done before Sikhism? .Singh surname was used by Rajputs before Sikhi.Kirpan was worn by them.there are many other things which were done before Sikhi.

BlazinSikh · Nov 1, 2012

Umm i guess you right, due to my little knowlegde on history before sikhism, and sikh history i don't believe i should continue with this topic, and also i don't have an issue with the Jhatka at Hazoor Sahib.

Good discussion though

WJKK WJKF

Harry Haller · Nov 2, 2012

I blame the Dasam Granth

prakash.s.bagga · Nov 2, 2012

In the context of the subject it would be better to analyse the overall composition of
Khalsaa Brotherhood.
This type of ritual was common even before creation of Khalsaa by GuRu Gobind Singh ji.
Most of the persons who accepted and became Khalsaa were from Communities
who were perforning this riyual since long.
I think it is this class of people being Khalsaa still carry on such rituals as part of
their practice to keep this alive.

It should also be clear that any ritual activity as part of religion once started is very difficult to discontinue.It always stays depending upon circumstances but it never ends.
This is very dominant aspect of rituals.Then rituals grow faster under ignorance .

Prakash.S.Bagga

Can You Expalin What Is Happening In This Video?

BlazinSikh

prakash.s.bagga

TigerStyleZ

BlazinSikh

TigerStyleZ

kds1980

BhagatSingh

Luckysingh

Kanwaljit.Singh

Ambarsaria

ੴ / Ik▫oaŉkār

Kanwaljit.Singh

prakash.s.bagga

BlazinSikh

Randip Singh

kds1980

BlazinSikh

kds1980

BlazinSikh

Harry Haller

prakash.s.bagga

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