New posts

Welcome to all New Sikh Philosophy Network Forums!

Explore Sikh Sikhi Sikhism...
Sign up Log in

Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="spnadmin" data-source="post: 192786" data-attributes="member: 35">I think some of us need to get over the notion that Sikhs are claiming Baba Farid and Kabir ji "as their own." Apologies for having to repeat what has already been stated! There have been however a continuing string of red-herrings regarding the connection between Baba Farid and Kabir and Sikhism.Only those aspects of the hymns of Farid and Kabir that are consistent with the Sikh idea of one, all pervading creator, have been included in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. It does not follow that anyone and everyone Sikh is claiming Farid and Kabir as their own because everything else that Guru Arjan Dev rejected was not consistent with the teachings of Guru Nanak. Hence the red-herrings.Both Farid and Kabir were part of the Bhakti movement of northern India. This movement preceded Guru Nanak and apparently had an impact on his own religious perspective.Though a Muslim, Farid is believed to have been a Sufi. The religious perspectives of Sufis from time to time have been castigated as heresy by one or another larger sect of Islam. Such was the case during the times of Guru Sahibhan, when Sufis were martyred.Almost nothing is known about Baba Kabir ji. That Guru Nanak possessed original copies of Farid's beej is accepted by most scholars. There are however legends that abound regarding Baba Kabir, including the life-sketch that he was the cast-away son of a Brahmin woman who was then raised by a family of Mulsim weavers, and the legend of his death when Muslims and Hindus squabbled over possession of his body. Allegedly he disappeared the night of his death, and only flowers remained on site. Muslims and Hindus thus claimed Kabir  jij "as their own" if the legends are taken seriously. The Kabir Panth however is a movement which is not identified with any organized religion, in so far as Kabir ji himself in his hymns was indifferent to formal practice. So what do Sikhs claim as "their own" in this convoluted story? We certainly do not claim Farid as our own because no one owns another person. We do claim Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji as Guru Nanak's gift to humanity. We do acknowledge that the idea of tuhi nirankar, the all pervading divine nature of God, which was anticipated in the Bhakti movement.I could continue for pages about Baba Farid, more about the legend of Kabir ji, on and on about how Guru Nanak both recognized the important ideas of the bhakti movement and then recreated bhakti in a way that is particularly Sikhi. But I will not because it is off-topic.There is nothing like a handful of red-herrings however thrown in the path of debate to get people off topic and pushed to the wall to defend their own beliefs. This thread's topic is What do you think of Islam?</blockquote>

Verification