Are Faith Schools A Good Idea?

[kds1980]

Then the problem lies with the minorities in the shape of insecurity, its not only based on religion alone but also in race, color, creed and culture and sub culture. Assimilation is always a two way street. When water from one body of meets the water of another body, in minority of majority, the composition of the whole body is changed.

No Hinduism in India assimilated Budhists, did anything changed for hindu's?
similarly other small religions that emerged were also swallowed by Hinduism and some by islam.Just look at example of Parsi's they are the one of the most peaceful Religion of India ,but on the other hand they are on the verge of extinction.There is not even a single explanation that why parsi Religion is
dieing

 

[findingmyway]

Teaching Not Preaching In CA Bible Belt




http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/06/24/eveningnews/main4206426.shtml

(CBS) Modesto is known as the bible belt of California. It has deep conservative roots in farmland and a vocal Evangelical community.

But increasingly, some less familiar notes are echoing through California's Central Valley, CBS News correspondent John Blackstone reports.
Like many other places, Modesto is becoming more religiously diverse.

But unlike any other place, religion is a required course in high school here.
"We can't preach, but we can teach," teacher Yvonne Taylor said.

Using "Teach Don't Preach" as her motto, Taylor guides the world religions course at Johansen High.

"And now we're going to be looking at Judaism, Christianity, and Islam," Taylor said to her class.

Most schools studiously avoid religion. In fact, Modesto is the only public school district in America where students have to study all major religions to graduate.

"The United States is one of the most religious countries on Earth. And yet Americans know almost nothing about religion," said Stephen Prothero, author of a new book, "Religious Literacy."

Prothero believes Modesto should be a model for the country, because America is paying a price for knowing so little about the world's religions.
"Religious illiteracy imperils our Democracy at home and it puts to a huge test our ability to conduct foreign policy overseas," Prothero said. "What's going on now in Iraq and in Iran and in Burma - these are religious people acting for religious reasons."

"In Islam, we'll be talking about the five pillars," Taylor said to her class.
But in Modesto, the lessons aren't about distant cultures, so much as about the student at the next desk.

"So the only religion that actually requires the wearing of the turban would be what faith?" Taylor asked her students.

"Sikhs," students answered.

Jaskirat Brar, a devout member of Modesto's Sikh community, may stand out at Johansen High. But thanks to the world religions course he also fits in.

"Kids get to learn what I am and clear up misconceptions they have about me," he said.

"Because we have the world religions course, the students are aware of what's happening in our community and that certainly is something to celebrate," Taylor said.

"Probably the best thing that I learned [is] how to respect the cultures and the religions and what they believe," one student said.

"I was really glad that people are learning who I am and what I'm about," said Doria Hohenlavuth, a Buddhist.

The city's religious leaders have embraced the course.

"This is a very good thing in my opinion," said Ahmad Kayello of the Islamic Center of Modesto.

At the city's Sikh temple, Ravinder Singh Brar said: "The more we know about each other, the more friendly we are going to be."

While there are many religions here, the goal is to create one community where everyone is accepted.


There is a video if you click on the link above.

 

[eropa234]

No Hinduism in India assimilated Budhists, did anything changed for hindu's?
similarly other small religions that emerged were also swallowed by Hinduism and some by islam.Just look at example of Parsi's they are the one of the most peaceful Religion of India ,but on the other hand they are on the verge of extinction.There is not even a single explanation that why parsi Religion is
dieing

Firstly Parsi is not a religion. In Sanskrit Parsi are the Iranians of pre-Islamic age and most of them followed Zoroastrian religion. When Arabs concurred Iran (Persian Empire) there was a summary executions and enslavement of Zoroastrians. Many Zoroastrians escaped to India and other parts of the world. There are still some left in Iran and are subject to hate and discrimination. Iranians have completely dissociated themselves from their Zoroastrian Past.

Even though Hinduism is not part of my religion it is still part of my culture I still take pride in the history of my people that goes back ten thousand years in recorded history.

For your knowledge the converted Zoroastrians brought culture and science to Islam hence making minute changes in Islam. Soofi brand of Islam has a big contribution from Zoroastrians. Even though most of the Soofis are considered as heretics by Sunnis and Shiite sects of Islam.

A religion has to stand on its own merits as well. Guru Nanak Ji only had a very small number of HINDU disciples. It was the power of his words and actions that changed people's lives and thinking.

In order to answer your first question I ask you this question. What did assimilation do for the Buddhists?

 

[prakash.s.bagga]

EROPA234
It is good idia that assimilation is a two way street.It is equally important to understand the concept of identity among miniorties.Why indentity is so impotant for community like
Sikhs.?There was need for such an identity and it is this identity a Sikh is A Sikh.
If in the process of assimilation if there is risk of loss of identity this would be dangerous for miniority community.Therefore miniority comunity should be strong enough to save its identity in the process of assimilation.We must understand that identity is related to the fundamental concept of faith of particular comunity.It is this fundamental concept of faith which is required to be maintained.
That is why it is very subjective to think about having faith schools or not.

Prakash.S.Bagga

 

[sikhway]

Well those are part of 5 K's-
Kesh-hair
kara-iron bracelet
kirpan-sword
kangha=comb
kachehra=decent lower body covering

To cover hair we have turban.
All of these things have deep theology behind it.

 

[kds1980]

Firstly Parsi is not a religion. In Sanskrit Parsi are the Iranians of pre-Islamic age and most of them followed Zoroastrian religion. When Arabs concurred Iran (Persian Empire) there was a summary executions and enslavement of Zoroastrians. Many Zoroastrians escaped to India and other parts of the world. There are still some left in Iran and are subject to hate and discrimination. Iranians have completely dissociated themselves from their Zoroastrian Past.

Even though Hinduism is not part of my religion it is still part of my culture I still take pride in the history of my people that goes back ten thousand years in recorded history.

For your knowledge the converted Zoroastrians brought culture and science to Islam hence making minute changes in Islam. Soofi brand of Islam has a big contribution from Zoroastrians. Even though most of the Soofis are considered as heretics by Sunnis and Shiite sects of Islam.

I know the name of Religion is Zorastion and Parsi is Indian name of their religion,but the fact is despite being a beautiful Religion ,the zorastions are on the verge of extinction.
As you are saying they bought culture and science to islam but were they able to change the mentality of islam of attacking destroying and converting people.?
Now let me give you an example if tommorow large number of sikhs will become hinduised
in India then also surely they will keep on singing/hearing kirtan ,so there may be little change but the fact will remain that Sikhism will lost forever

n order to answer your first question I ask you this question. What did assimilation do for the Buddhists?

I don't get your question? The fact is budhism died in India.Some of its very good points like no caste system also died with it

 

[findingmyway]

Well those are part of 5 K's-
Kesh-hair
kara-iron bracelet
kirpan-sword
kangha=comb
kachehra=decent lower body covering

To cover hair we have turban.
All of these things have deep theology behind it.

External symbols are not enough when we are following Hindu rituals and festivals instead of embracing our own unique philosophy. Maybe we need to have better weekend schools in Gurdwara? I don't think enough is done for children or adults to understand Gurmat, instead Gurdwara'a have become about worship when they should be centres of learning.

 

[dalbirk]

Firstly Parsi is not a religion. In Sanskrit Parsi are the Iranians of pre-Islamic age and most of them followed Zoroastrian religion. When Arabs concurred Iran (Persian Empire) there was a summary executions and enslavement of Zoroastrians. Many Zoroastrians escaped to India and other parts of the world. There are still some left in Iran and are subject to hate and discrimination. Iranians have completely dissociated themselves from their Zoroastrian Past.

Even though Hinduism is not part of my religion it is still part of my culture I still take pride in the history of my people that goes back ten thousand years in recorded history.

For your knowledge the converted Zoroastrians brought culture and science to Islam hence making minute changes in Islam. Soofi brand of Islam has a big contribution from Zoroastrians. Even though most of the Soofis are considered as heretics by Sunnis and Shiite sects of Islam.

A religion has to stand on its own merits as well. Guru Nanak Ji only had a very small number of HINDU disciples. It was the power of his words and actions that changed people's lives and thinking.

In order to answer your first question I ask you this question. What did assimilation do for the Buddhists?

Firstly I like you to kindly DEFINE the word Hinduism . Secondly Hinduism ( Sanatan Dharma / Brahminism ) is just 3500 years old not tens of thousands years , it starts with the arrival of Aryans from Persia ( Iran ) in about 1500 BC . The first book created by them was Rigveda which was transmitted orally until it was wriiten formally by Ved Vyasa who also wrote Mahabharata . What is the contribution of Brahminism to India , it just institutionalised the Varna system which caused untold misery in the form of slavery to Muslims for 800 years in which 80 million Indians were killed & 10 million girls , women & boys were sold in Kabul , Ghazni , Kandhar , Bahgdaad for as little as 25 paise each . This is the most inhuman ideology after Islam ( of course ) which institutionalises discrimination on the baisis of birth . Also most hilarious including false , mythological fairy tales which have no head or tail . Even today most of problems faced by India are due to the ill-effects of Brahminism . IMHO Buddhism , Jainism & above all Sikhism are the only three TRUE DHARMAS rest are merely expansionist ideologies like Christianity , Islam or eternally discriminating like Brahminism . If anybody wishes to have real NIRVANA he must go for either of the three ideologies namely Buddhism , Jainism , Sikhism . As Jainism & Buddhism have been all but assimilated in Brahminism , Sikhism is the only way for living emancipation for all the poor , downtrodden & Dalits of India .

 

[Serjinder Singh]

I studied in India in a Khalsa High School and in a Khalsa College. However, my middle school was a government school. Although there were religious education teachers in Khalsa school and college teaching in what were called divinity classes I did not learn much about Sikhism there. We were just asked to memorise the names of ten gurus, five banis and few other such things that coming from a deeply religious family I already knew. However, in the Khalsa College one thing that I inadvertently learned was to hate non-Sikhs (I thank Waheguru to be able to have soon overcome this). Whenever there used to be a hockey match between our college team and a local DAV College we would go in large numbers not so much to back up our team but to shout derogatory chants against the DAV College players. We would chant (during fifties) "Dhoti, topee, bodee karo Yamuna to paar" (send those wearing a Dhoti, wearing a cap, and a religious tuft of hair across river Yamuna). And DAV students would retort in reply, "Kainchee, Ustra karo tyaar (get the razor and scissors ready)

On the other hand, during my Govenrment Middle School I had a very gentle and loving Hindu teacher teaching Hindi and Sanskrit. I now appreciate knowledge of these two language that help me tremendously to understand Gurbani, particularly Dasam Granth almost all of which in Braj, a dialect of Hindi ( The Punajbi is not the dominant language of Gurbani - Hindi content keeps rising as we move from first Guruji to tenth). I do not imagine a Sikh school in the west realising our misplaced notion that Gurbani language is Punjabi and hence proclaiming that it would teach pupils Punjabi (and not other Gurbani languages)

The experience and advantage of having learned non-mother tongue languages persuaded me to learn other languages such as Farsi and Arabic later when in University. This not only helped me to be able to communicate with Middle Eastern and Iranian persons but also be able to understand Zafarnama and Bhai Nand Lal's writings. Of course, I can understand the Quran as well.

I do not envisage any Khalsa School in the West would be courageous enough to break out of the typical Sikh tight-jacket to help children explore the beauty of entire diversity of His creation.

Rangi Rangi Bhati Kar Kar Jinsi Maya Jin Upaee (Japuji Sahib)

Humbly
Serjinder Singh

 

[spnadmin]

Serjinder ji

Thank you for the fallacy about the dominance of Punjabi in Sikh scripture and other important historical texts.

 

[Balkar Singh]

Things are not bad if organized properly.

Faith schools are a very good idea, but it is obserevd that the SIKH faith school does not employ a seperate qualified divinity-teacher . Either a local Granthy is hired for the ceremonies or one of the teachers do the time-pass.
I am impressed by the Akal Academy organization but they also lack the same . They believe that a music teacher is enough or the Granthy baba will do.
Art of teaching divinity also needs some qualification . It should not be taken lightly. Our children and youth are fed up with the traditional 'fairy tales'.
I believe that faith schools are here and they will prevail.Come, shed up the way of criticizm and doubts. Gurubani says that Sikhism is a GADI-RAH (TRUNK ROAD) . Why do we not speed-up ? We expect name and fame even in sewa. Satguru save THE FAITH.
Bhul chuk muaf krni ji. Guru Fateh

 

[prakash.s.bagga]

Considering, two aspect of the faith one idiology and other theology,there should be a balance between the two.Theology should not be allowed to Dominate Idiology.Theology should be a matter of convinience to suit the current generation without disturbing certain minimum norms of theology.
This balancing can provide stability to the faith for times to come.
Prakash.S.Bagga

 

[bsc1]

WKWF.
My daughters are students at The Guru Nanak Sikh School West London Hayes.
I have lived in Southall all my life ,it's a "socially,culturally,regligious diverse melting pot."....in other words it's becoming a ghetto !
When I was a student at the local schools back in the late 70's and 80's we used to attend morning assembly and christmas/easter were the only national holiday's ,it was a very Christian affair in the UK at that time.My fellow students were from Sikh/Hindu/Muslim/Christain,Asian/Black/White backgrounds and we all grew up unaffected by the "school Christains." All have maintained their own belief system that they were born into.
This prove's that it's NOT only what is taught in school BUT also what is taught at home.
Do I like the idea of faith school's ?....a very firm NO.....so why do I send my daughters to a Sikh Faith School ?....because its a very good school for academia.
The school has Christain white teachers,Muslim teachers black/asian ,Sikh teachers and most importantly the 20% non Sikh rule is taken up by Muslim students and Christain students.This proves other beliefs trust the Sikh rule of non indoctrination.
If I had my way I would keep religion out of schools because it's an unstable mix.Good example is Catholic schools,they find it very hard to teach natural selection(science) and creationism(religion) in the same school.
Most schools in London have been serving Halal approved meals (both veggie/non veggie options) but none of the non Muslim parents were informed of this fact.If religion had been kept out of the schools this would have never happened.
Keep religion for after school (monitored by person outside of belief eg a Sikh should monitor a Muslim or Christain afterschool class,this will prevent radical loony teaching's) classes and the home enviroment.

 

[Serjinder Singh]

BSC1
Sat Sri Akal

I remember early seventies when south asian school children in Southall were being bussed to distant schools. However, the situation has now totally changed with a sikh school although I wouldn't approve of repeating this in other parts of UK just for the sake of doing so for sectarian considerations.

There is no harm in sending one's children to a 'faith school' if the academic standards are better than those of non-faith schools in the area and the 'faith' of the faith school is not imposed on the pupils deliberately or inadvertently. I sent my children to a catholic school in India because that was the best one in the city established nearly 80 years ago. The pupils were 95% from non-faith background and there was no compulsion to attend assembly or other christian events.

However, I am of the firm opinion that religion should be taught not in a school but in a religious place or at home. A school should focus on imparting academic knowledge in a scientific manner, that includes religious education about all faith and belief systems in an objective manner in order to develop critical appreciation of the system in question.

Remember Guru ji sent prominent sikhs like Bhai Gurdas to Hindu places of learning such as Benaras to learn about Hindu religion. However, if the aim of setting up a faith school is to attempt to convert or to inculcate a sense of chauvinistic superiority over other faiths then faith school may become a place for breeding extremism and sectarian hatred as happens in Scotland in UK where the top agenda of the recentlly elected Scottish National Party is to curb the scourge of sectarianism in Scotland particularly in Scottish footbal.

Humbly
Serjinder Singh

 

[prakash.s.bagga]

It is equally important that we have preachers and scholars with proper and indepth knowledge of Gurbaani.Ifind most of our prechers and scholars are unable to give satisfactory answer of many of Gurbaani messages and their interpretation is just more confusing.
So we should look at the qualities and the level of knowledge they can impart to our coming generation.
Prakash.s.Bagga

 

[findingmyway]

I feel that ALL schools should teach the basics of ALL religions to ALL children in order to avoid misconceptions, stereotyping and conflict. This is the best way to promote harmony among different people imho