Interracial And Interfaith Marriage, Help Needed To Confront/convince My Parents

[Harry Haller]

My only hope to marry this girl is by convincing my parents somehow that Sikhism according to the SGGS ji is not against interracial/interfaith marriage and that they should start living according to SGGS ji and not the Punjabi culture/traditions.

Hmm I would not advise this as a plan, your basically saying that they are doing it all wrong, so you now have two issues, your girlfriend, and the fact that your parents misunderstand Sikhi, its not really about Sikhism, as we have already stated, it is about attitudes and fear. They fear that your marriage could make them look bad in the community, and they fear they will lose you, understand both these points and think of a way to reassure them otherwise would be a better start in my view.

 

[Original]

Respected Onam Singh Ji - SSA,

On the whole, your writings reflect your wisdom and I for one, enjoy immensely, particularly the elegance of language with which you express. But this time around, I'm left twirling my moustache ? Here's why -

According to your description it seems none of the four people involved has any particular interest in Sikhi,

..please qualify !

so it's odd to be discussing this on a Sikh forum.

So..you'd rather the young seeker go to Agony Aunt or the likes of Oprah than to be here amongst his own kind [social] ? I beg to differ ! since the minds of the young [seeker] are very impressionable, we must, if we are to educate them properly, make sure that the moral foundation on which they are to be brought up is suitable for the purpose. And, since Sikhism promotes "garhasthya jeeven" [married life] the seeker did the right thing by calling upon an "authority" or a perceived "representative body" of Sikhism [allegedly] with which his subjective conscience accords. Religion and social organisation taken together forms the very basis of a stable society that has its roots in traditional family values. And, it is the strong families that creates self-reliant citizens [social perspective]. The continued existence of every society [say, Sikhi] depends on the reproduction of a new generation for which sexual union is mandatory. Hence, marriage a necessity [civil]. Keeping aligned one's moral and religious compass isn't a bad thing, but rather, quite a brave thing and must be commended.

Since no one seems to be especially guided by Guru,

..the guru is not confined to the few, but rather, our very dearest and nearest possession in whom we ALL live. And, it is the likes of you through whom Guru works when correcting and guiding others.

Thank you !

 

[Brother Onam]

Original ji,
If I recall the beginning of this discussion, the young man was explaining that his father was basically coming from a Punjabi angle and was not particularly interested in Sikh belief. It seemed he was rather viewing this union as scandalous because it violated his perception of traditional Punjabi relations (a Korean girl?! What?!), while the boy's mother was guided by a secular sort of philosophy as to what is proper or not. The young couple themselves, if I recall, were unsurprisingly mainly following their hearts and not particularly interested in 'religion'.
I may have counseled harshly mainly because I perceive a trend towards atheism in mainstream society in these times, and I feel these youngsters are perhaps inevitably (it's a global world now) getting swept up in this world view.
Young people would be forgiven for having a soured view of religion because there is so much ignorance, greed and abuse of 'religion' in these times, and little example of living, dynamic spirituality, but to abandon the Sikh Panth and instead lean on the 'wisdom' of non-believers is nevertheless a betrayal, I think, of the mighty Gurus. It is because of this that I said, in essence, "you want to walk away from the Gurus? Fine, but then go ahead and seek out the 'guides' of the world: Dear Abby, Dr. Phil, Joel Osteen or other advisors of the secular, mainstream world...Cheers"
For the record, I believe there is absolutely nothing wrong with a Punjabi Sikh dating a Korean girl, I think it's really nice, but to my mind, she MUST come under the banner of Sikhi if that is to flourish. I think the Reht Maryada says as much: no comment about race, but a clear admonition to marry only those who believe in the Naam of Waheguru.
Sat Sri Akaal

 

[Harry Haller]

Let us not forget, during the many marriages that will be carried out today amongst Sikhs, how many of either sex come under the banner, other than lip service..

 

[InnerDarbar]

Young people would be forgiven for having a soured view of religion because there is so much ignorance, greed and abuse of 'religion' in these times, and little example of living, dynamic spirituality, but to abandon the Sikh Panth and instead lean on the 'wisdom' of non-believers is nevertheless a betrayal, I think, of the mighty Gurus

I think the Reht Maryada says as much: no comment about race, but a clear admonition to marry only those who believe in the Naam of Waheguru.

Sat sri akaal Onam ji,

If I am right (forgive me if I am wrong) the SGGS ji nowhere states that it's a MUST for one to be part of the Sikh panth. What I fail to see is that why it wouldn't be possible to just follow the SGGS ji without being a part of the Sikh panth? Joining the panth to get the label of Sikhi, wouldn't magically make me a beter person and certainly not make me just by default more worthy in Guru's eyes, than someone who does not make a part of the panth, but practices great karma.

This all is the reason to why I don't really care about the Reht Maryada, those are just a bunch of made up rules by the committee members, and not written in the SGGS ji. Sure those rules might help for some people to live more closely to the hukam of SGGS ji, but they are not mandatory in my eyes.

As for believing in The Naam of Waheguru, the SGGS ji states that many people worship The Lord in different ways, and no way is necessarily wrong or right, my girlfriend is Roman Catholic and she also believes in The Lord, she does that differently than me, but like I said everyone worships The Lord in his or her own ways. My way of worshiping him, is not by waking up daily 4 AM and doing Path, the way I worship him is by thinking of him and his greatness, by doing so my mind and body surrenders to him. I'm not trying to say that doing Path is wrong, by doing Path one is chanting the praises of The Lord, which can help to remember and feel closer to The Lord, but what I'm trying to say is that it's NOT the only way.

 

[Harry Haller]

If I am right (forgive me if I am wrong) the SGGS ji nowhere states that it's a MUST for one to be part of the Sikh panth. What I fail to see is that why it wouldn't be possible to just follow the SGGS ji and not be part of Sikh panth? Joining the panth to get the label of Sikhi, wouldn't magically make me a beter person and certainly not make me just by default more worthy in Guru's eyes, than someone who does not make a part of the panth, but practices great karma.

There seems to be a growing surge in the young towards pragmatic Sikhism, rather than spiritual Sikhism, largely I think, due to the misinformation and hypocrisy provided by some of the older generation. This is sad in some parts, as spiritualism plays a huge part in Sikhism for some, but not for others. It is good to experience spiritualism even if only to reject it, it works wonders for some but not for others.

This all is the reason to why I don't really care about the Reht Maryada, those are just a bunch of made up rules by the committee members, and not written in the SGGS ji. Sure those rules might help for some people to live more closely to the hukam of SGGS ji, but they are not mandatory in my eyes.

As good or bad, we are stuck with it, and we have to make the best of it. I would say in my opinion it needs updating but then one day it will be your generation that updates it.

As for believing in The Naam of Waheguru, the SGGS ji states that many people worship The Lord in different ways, and no way is necessarily wrong or right, my girlfriend is Roman Catholic and she also believes in The Lord, she does that differently then me, but like I said everyone worships The Lord in his or her own ways. My way of worshiping him, is not by waking up daily 4 AM and doing Path, the way I worship him is by thinking of him and his greatness, by doing so my mind and body surrenders to him. I'm not trying to say that doing Path is wrong, by doing Path one is chanting the praises of The Lord, which can help to remember and feel closer to The Lord, but what I'm trying to say is that it's NOT the only way.

Its the same way I worship god too,but you must also respect the way your parents worship god, and the way those that follow the SRM worship god, you make good points for sure, but at the end of the day the only person who is right for you is you, just don't forget that applies to everyone else as well.

 

[Original]

Inner Darbar,

The proper venue for your sentiments is not religion but ethics. Getting God to do your washing is not going to work; if anyone, it's God that is the innocent party. For this is your typical ethical dilemma with far reaching moral consequences. That is to say, you're torn between your love [inclination] on the one hand and obedience to your parents [obligation], on the other. What is the right thing to do, act on inclination or give into obligation ? The true criterion ought to be, in my opinion, happiness. And, it is this approach with which your parents need to be enlightened because either, or [inclination, obligation] is not a solution but a paradox for you, for them a resolution. Do you follow ? They should weigh up the pros and cons against the happiness of their son in determining the rightness of their action.

Goodnight

 

[Tejwant Singh]

InnerDarbar ji,

Guru Fateh,

My nephew got married to a Japanese classmate of his in March. They had the Anand Karaj in India and then Shinto/Christian wedding ceremony in Japan. Both of them are barristers and work at the World Bank in London. He was born in India and she in Japan.

His parents, my sister and her hubby never objected to that. They were rather very happy for their son as am I. I told my nephew just one thing that both India and Japan (including other far eastern countries) are racist countries, so they should not even think of settling down at any of these places.

You may be wondering why I am telling you all this. The reason being that this has nothing to do with Sikhi as a religion but Sikhi as a culture. Here in this thread, the discussion is being mixed from both aspects. People who are born in Sikh families and keep Sikhi saroop (look) are accepted as Sikhs. Even people who do not wear turbans also call themselves Sikhs because of the same reason. My nephew got married from a cultural point of view as did his wife, hence the two marriage ceremonies. It had nothing to do with religion/s.

I have no idea if you and your Korean girlfriend are financially independent. It seems your father is objecting the cultural aspect of this affair but labeling it as religious. It is a shame that he can not see the difference.

Happiness in not found in any religion but in the self which is knotted with the culture and the religion.

It is not about how much you are in love with each other but the more important question is, are you both ready to have kids in this mixed marriage and prepare them to face racism?

Would the love between you two dissipate if you two faced racism after marriage?

If I were you, I would make a list of these questions with her and then decide.

In closing I would say, thanks for joining the forum and sharing your story with us. We are one big SPN family here who are always with you no matter what decision you make.

Good luck in your journey.

 

[Ishna]

The posts that took a detour from the original topic and into the rules around Anand Karaj / Lavan have been moved here: Interfaith Anand Karaj / Lavan