Lava In Guru Granth Sahib

[Nirmaljot Baidwan]

Respected gyani ji
It is not necessary that Guru ajun dev ji would include all the bani in SGGS or is it?? I dont think there's hundred percent surity of bhai bala's janam sakhi to be fake. I have the janam sakhi, should i quote the laavan written in the janam sakhi, although the janam sakhi is not in very good condition as its very old. one of the contradictions about this janam sakhi is that it contains many shabads mentioned to be written by guru nanak dev ji where as in SGGS these are mentioned to be written by other gurus.

Now what i think is that the other gurus that followed sri guru nanak dev ji were also the same. as we say k ikko he jot da prakash c. Oh sade lai beshak alag alag roop c par oh ik he jot c!!

 

[spnadmin]

Forwarded by SPN mentor Gyani Jarnail Singh ji Arshi

 

[Gyani Jarnail Singh]

Respected gyani ji
It is not necessary that Guru ajun dev ji would include all the bani in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji or is it?? I dont think there's hundred percent surity of bhai bala's janam sakhi to be fake. I have the janam sakhi, should i quote the laavan written in the janam sakhi, although the janam sakhi is not in very good condition as its very old. one of the contradictions about this janam sakhi is that it contains many shabads mentioned to be written by guru nanak dev ji where as in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji these are mentioned to be written by other gurus.

Now what i think is that the other gurus that followed sri guru nanak dev ji were also the same. as we say k ikko he jot da prakash c. Oh sade lai beshak alag alag roop c par oh ik he jot c!!

Veer Ji,
IT IS NECESSARY THAT WE NOW PLACE ALL (100%) of OUR TRUST/FAITH/SHARDHA in the SGGS as prepared by GURU ARJUN JI and RE-PREPARED as Final Rescencion by GURU GOBIND SINGH JI and bestowed upon the GURGADEE of Guru nanak Ji sahib in 1708. It is a Blasphemy to even consider one sentence out of place as far as the SGGS is concerned. This is LAW now in PUNJAB under recently passed amendments - a FIR can be registered and Punjab Police will take action on such finger pointers.
WHATEVER "bani/gurbani/whatever" LEFT OUTSIDE the SGGS is NOT GURU-KIRT...not even those banis now in our Nitnem, supposedly penned by Guru Gobind Singh ji but since these are NOT INSIDE THE SGGS..they are NOT OUR GURU. ONLY SGGS is our One and SOLE GURU. BEYOND QUESTIONING...BEYOND DOUBTS. PERIOD.
This is NOT my perosnal position..its the position of the Guru Khalsa Panth.
And this is also the Terms of service of SPN. Violation of those terms is serious.

2. Lots of Bhagat kabir jis bani is available OUTSIDE of SGGS..we dont accord that portion any "VALUE" (as in GURBANI)
3. Lots of Bhagat ravidass jis bani is also OUTSIDE SGGS...recently some people made a GRANTH out of that. WE SIKHS place no "value" on that either. We BOW to only SGGS.

As I said I have access to an ORIGINAL hand written Mnauscript of the Bala Janam sakhi ( at present in Punjab and out of my contact NOW. but avilable for research when i do viist India )..BUT I do have in my Library a TREATISE of most of the janamsakhi published by PU. It also lists almost 100 shabads supposedly by Guru nanak ji but NOT included in SGGS. A SIKH will NOT consider those as "Gurbani" - under any circumstances. GURU ARJUN JI had good reasons to EXCLUDE them.

Veer Ji..we have lots of Non-sikhs, non-punjabis on this Forum..so if we confine Punjabi words to a MINIMUM that helps. Sure we cna understand the lingo..but for them its a major difficulty. Please keep as much ENGLISH as possible.

Regards
jarnail Singh

 

[Gyani Jarnail Singh]

Veer Ji,
On the question of a "shabad" that is chosen by Guru Arjun Ji for inlcuison in the SGGS and this fact is reaffirmed by Guru Gobind Singh Ji....then THAT Particular shabad IS the AUTHENTIC VERSION - Confirmed by TWO GURU SAHIBS - in WRITING.

IF a similar shabad / exact same shabad is found OUTSIDE the SGGS...thne this is what we do:

1. The SHABAD in the SGGS is GURBANI and our GURU.
2. The exact same shabad that is outside the SGGS but found elsewhere..is a COPY.(UTARA)
3. A "similar" shabad found OUTSIDE SGGS is a FAULTY COPY/PLAGIRISATION/FAKE.
Could be an attempt to confuse sikhs...the KACHI BANI.
4. ANY writing found OUTSIDE the SGGS carrying the NANAK CHHAAP is FAKE.( under
point 3 above )..at best
its a COPY - UTARA. The GURU-GURBANI is always ONLY the SGGS.
5. The SGGS was prepared under direct superviison of GURU SAHIB JI. All outisde books,
historical accounts, books, etc etc...not prepared under that CATEGORY..so any
banis/shabads included should be taken under advisement !! For example even
TODAY there are thousands of books...even WEB SITES ( SPN included)..which may
have GURBANI shabads included....these books web sites etc CANNOT be considered
AUTHENTIC/GURBANI/GURU as on the same level as SGGS.!!! Simply becasue
these are all prepared by ordinary humans...while the SGGS was prepared by the
GURU SAHIBS. As an EXAMPLE: I as a writer of a Book on "Katha of Japji Sahib"
could MISS out an
ENTIRE PAUREE of Japji Sahib...or Leave out half of it (by mistake)..can the Japji
Sahib in My book be considered as authentic as the Japji Sahib found in the SGGS ??
OR by mistake I may inlcude a few chhands form JAAP SAHIB...and then can people
about 500 years down the line say..OH Jarnail Singh's Katha on japji Sahib has a
different Japji Sahib than the one in SGGS ???? That is what you are saying about
Bhai bala's Janamsakhi and its shabdas. On the KASWATTEE..touchstone of
SGGS..the shabads in Janamsakhi FAIL the LITMUS TEST.

 

[Nirmaljot Baidwan]

@ gyani jarnail singh

My friend we dont have baani of bhai Gurdas in SGGS , is that kachi baani????

 

[findingmyway]

Respected gyani ji
It is not necessary that Guru ajun dev ji would include all the bani in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji or is it?? I dont think there's hundred percent surity of bhai bala's janam sakhi to be fake. I have the janam sakhi, should i quote the laavan written in the janam sakhi, although the janam sakhi is not in very good condition as its very old. one of the contradictions about this janam sakhi is that it contains many shabads mentioned to be written by guru nanak dev ji where as in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji these are mentioned to be written by other gurus.

Now what i think is that the other gurus that followed sri guru nanak dev ji were also the same. as we say k ikko he jot da prakash c. Oh sade lai beshak alag alag roop c par oh ik he jot c!!

Nirmaljot ji,
Forgive me but I don't fully understand what you are saying here?

Are you saying that Gurbani can be doubted or second guessed but other texts such as janamsakhis must not be doubted?

When the Guru's are the same jyot, does it make sense that one Guru would then overwrite shabads written by another? What is the point of having the numbering lock in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji if the Guru's were going to change the shabads for their own?

Does it make more sense to verify texts against Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji or the other way round? I would say the former as Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji is our only Guru and everything else comes second.

Jasleen Kaur.

 

[Gyani Jarnail Singh]

@ gyani jarnail singh

My friend we dont have baani of bhai Gurdas in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji , is that kachi baani????

Nirmaljyot jI,

IS the SGGS our One and ONLY GURU ? or is Bhai Gurdass Ji also "GURU" ?
GURBANI can only be what the GURU says/speaks...and the SGGS does not speak/say the Bhai Gurdass Jis Vaars/Kabits/Swaiyahs as well as lots of other compositions.

2. The SRM does however give us the privilege and HONOUR to perform Kirtan of Bhai Gurdass Jis vaars/kabits/Swaiyahs in the presence of SGGS. This proviso also applies to Bhai Nand Lal Goya Jis compositions. Other "compositions" may also be "presented" on Gurdwara Stages - dhadee vaars, kavitas, poems, lekhs, Academic Papers etc etc fort eh ebnefit of the Sangat.

3. Kachi Bani as a description is now widely applied to the "TWO LINER JINGLES type of TV advertisments that various so called SANT/BABAS sing during their "Religious Diwans". These are written by human beings. Example would be...."Ucha Dar babeh nanak Da...uchah dar ababeh nanak da.....AA giaya baba Vaid Rogian da....Haath jorr ke darshan kardeh ne..etc etc types sung with groups of CHAMTA BANGING youths behind the Waddeh baba Ji on stage with a Vaja....and after each PAUSE..the Waddeh baba Ji will stop and TELL/RELATE TALL TALES/FAIRY TALES of the even BIGGER "WADDEH BABA JI" that went before his time...(GURU NANAK JI SAHIB/and the Nine Gurus after Him ARE NOT what is meant by Waddeh Baba Ji....that "respectful" term is for the DERA HEADS that have died..like Ishar singh attar singh wariam singh etc etc...BABA NANAK is kept OUT of such kirtna darbars. Such Babas almost NEVER singh GURBANI SHABADS form SGGS or will just sing a line or two and leave the shabad UNFINISHED and proceed to their waddeh babajis stories...and Jingles. IF you listen carefully the DEVI BHAJANS sung sound almost the same as these two liner jingles. IN the Hindu situation thats perfectly all right becasue they DONT HAVE GURBANI to sing..so they rely on man made kavitas and songs..BUT when SIKHS disregard the THOUSANDS of Shabads in SGGS..and give preference to such bhajan types of kavitas..then its sad. This types of songs are much easier to Memorise !! Hnece the reaosn why these Half Baked babas prefer them..no effort needed compared to SHUDH RAAG GURBANI.