General Lost Online Battle?

[Tejwant Singh]

What's the higher purpose of living if not to help others?

Sorry to burst your bubble, helping does not mean teaching. And Seva is the cornerstone of Sikhi which I happen to agree with.

U practice it and teach others to find their way home. If He teaches u in experience, what would keep you from sharing it with humanity as Nanak did?

Firstly, sharing is not teaching. How sharing a piece of bread or an idea can be teaching. It is sharing which Sikhi demands from us. Simply put. Please use Gurbani from the SGGS to clarify your claim because it is quite nebulous to put it opaquely.

 

[Ishna]

"Give a man a fish a he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he eats for the rest of his life."

Yet you're telling me Sikhi is about giving fish, not teaching fishing? That's disappointing.

 

[Tejwant Singh]

"Give a man a fish a he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he eats for the rest of his life."

Yet you're telling me Sikhi is about giving fish, not teaching fishing? That's disappointing.

Sorry to disappoint you but that is your conclusion, not mine. Sharing one's knowledge is not giving one a fish. The fact of the matter is Guru Nanak shared with others what he knew. Teachers are those who claim to know more than the one they are teaching. Neither Guru Nanak, nor any other Guru had that goal.
But more importantly, if Guru Nanak had told the people who were under the Mughal emperor Babur that he was there to teach, then he would have been killed there and then due to the crowded market of the dogmas where Muslims were raping, abducting, converting and killing at will.

 

[Ishna]

Sorry to disappoint you but that is your conclusion, not mine. Sharing one's knowledge is not giving one a fish. The fact of the matter is Guru Nanak shared with others what he knew. Teachers are those who claim to know more than the one they are teaching. Neither Guru Nanak, nor any other Guru had that goal.
But more importantly, if Guru Nanak had told the people who were under the Mughal emperor Babur that he was there to teach, then he would have been killed there and then due to the crowded market of the dogmas where Muslims were raping, abducting, converting and killing at will.

It seems like splitting hairs to me for the sake of argument.

 

[Tejwant Singh]

It seems like splitting hairs to me for the sake of argument.

Not really. It is a fact, as simple as that. Sharing and teaching are two different things. Vand Kei Chaknah is sharing in Sikhi and our Gurus encouraged us and even gave us the tools to chisel ourselves with.

Guru Nanak never taught during his travels -udassis to the four corners, he shared what he knew. He did not teach anyone. Sidhgosht is the prime examples in the SGGS, our only Guru, which gives us the tools for how to share the knowledge.

 

[Inderjeet Kaur]

The primary goal of a good teacher is to become extraneous, with the student exceeding the teacher.

 

[Sikhilove]

"Give a man a fish a he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he eats for the rest of his life."

Yet you're telling me Sikhi is about giving fish, not teaching fishing? That's disappointing.

Nicely put

 

[Sikhilove]

Sorry to disappoint you but that is your conclusion, not mine. Sharing one's knowledge is not giving one a fish. The fact of the matter is Guru Nanak shared with others what he knew. Teachers are those who claim to know more than the one they are teaching. Neither Guru Nanak, nor any other Guru had that goal.
But more importantly, if Guru Nanak had told the people who were under the Mughal emperor Babur that he was there to teach, then he would have been killed there and then due to the crowded market of the dogmas where Muslims were raping, abducting, converting and killing at will.

That would be up to God, not for u to decide. Gurbani says He sent Narsingh to preserve the honour of his Bhagat Prahlad.

Guru Nanak walked out of Mecca unscathed. He walked into the most fanatical and most dangerous place for a So called Kaffir to be, in the eyes of many, 'disrespected' their holiest shrine and walked out.

That's Gods glory in action.

 

[Sikhilove]

The primary goal of a good teacher is to become extraneous, with the student exceeding the teacher.

And the Guru becomes the Chela and Chela the Guru.

People learn from each other all the time.

 

[Dr.Alta]

If they cannot listen/read Gurbani and change their lives, how can my intervention help? I am better off finding my way Home.

It doesn't appear that way in the moment. but trust me you plant the seeds of change in their minds when you confront them, it just takes a while for it to bear fruit.

 

[Dr.Alta]

@Kanwaljit.Singh
I have hardly any will left to make posts, and it's not because I don't have anything to say (I love hearing the sound of my own typing hahaha), it's because it never goes anywhere. I'm not a scholar, so it's all just my opinions rattling around with other people's opinions and getting nowhere and nine times out of 10 ending in an argument.

"People will forgive you for being wrong, but they will never forgive you for being right—especially if events prove you right while proving them wrong."Thomas Sowell
It's even more you if you prove them wrong.

Be humble enough to not need their apology

 

[Dr.Alta]

When Nanak went to Mecca, he taught people, some of whom turned around and wanted to kill him.

But he fearlessly taught anyway.

It's nice to know
I'm not alone, the sikh gurus ,Thomas Paine, and Benjamin Franklin are my satsangat. it's hard being separated from them, thou at least SGGS is here for me.

Teach people if they're willing to listen.

how they will listen

If they're not, then don't. And if they listen and threatened death upon you, who cares..at least you did the right thing.

here here!

 

[Dr.Alta]

what I have learned is about me thought, how can I teach someone what applies to me?


I may know my truth, but how can I know yours?

you can show them your truth so that they can recognize their truth when they see it

 

[Dr.Alta]

do you know of anyone who knows this truth enough to teach it?

those you can't honestly teach you can dishonestly teach.

 

[Logical Sikh]

Sorry to disappoint you but that is your conclusion, not mine. Sharing one's knowledge is not giving one a fish. The fact of the matter is Guru Nanak shared with others what he knew. Teachers are those who claim to know more than the one they are teaching. Neither Guru Nanak, nor any other Guru had that goal.
But more importantly, if Guru Nanak had told the people who were under the Mughal emperor Babur that he was there to teach, then he would have been killed there and then due to the crowded market of the dogmas where Muslims were raping, abducting, converting and killing at will.

ਮਃ ੧ ॥ ਮਾਸੁ ਮਾਸੁ ਕਰਿ ਮੂਰਖੁ ਝਗੜੇ ਗਿਆਨੁ ਧਿਆਨੁ ਨਹੀ ਜਾਣੈ ॥ ਕਉਣੁ ਮਾਸੁ ਕਉਣੁ ਸਾਗੁ ਕਹਾਵੈ ਕਿਸੁ ਮਹਿ ਪਾਪ ਸਮਾਣੇ ॥ ਗੈਂਡਾ ਮਾਰਿ ਹੋਮ ਜਗ ਕੀਏ ਦੇਵਤਿਆ ਕੀ ਬਾਣੇ ॥ ਮਾਸੁ ਛੋਡਿ ਬੈਸਿ ਨਕੁ ਪਕੜਹਿ ਰਾਤੀ ਮਾਣਸ ਖਾਣੇ ॥ ਫੜੁ ਕਰਿ ਲੋਕਾਂ ਨੋ ਦਿਖਲਾਵਹਿ ਗਿਆਨੁ ਧਿਆਨੁ ਨਹੀ ਸੂਝੈ ॥ ਨਾਨਕ ਅੰਧੇ ਸਿਉ ਕਿਆ ਕਹੀਐ ਕਹੈ ਨ ਕਹਿਆ ਬੂਝੈ ॥ ਅੰਧਾ ਸੋਇ ਜਿ ਅੰਧੁ ਕਮਾਵੈ ਤਿਸੁ ਰਿਦੈ ਸਿ ਲੋਚਨ ਨਾਹੀ ॥ ਮਾਤ ਪਿਤਾ ਕੀ ਰਕਤੁ ਨਿਪੰਨੇ ਮਛੀ ਮਾਸੁ ਨ ਖਾਂਹੀ ॥ ਇਸਤ੍ਰੀ ਪੁਰਖੈ ਜਾਂ ਨਿਸਿ ਮੇਲਾ ਓਥੈ ਮੰਧੁ ਕਮਾਹੀ ॥ ਮਾਸਹੁ ਨਿੰਮੇ ਮਾਸਹੁ ਜੰਮੇ ਹਮ ਮਾਸੈ ਕੇ ਭਾਂਡੇ ॥ ਗਿਆਨੁ ਧਿਆਨੁ ਕਛੁ ਸੂਝੈ ਨਾਹੀ ਚਤੁਰੁ ਕਹਾਵੈ ਪਾਂਡੇ ॥ ਬਾਹਰ ਕਾ ਮਾਸੁ ਮੰਦਾ ਸੁਆਮੀ ਘਰ ਕਾ ਮਾਸੁ ਚੰਗੇਰਾ ॥ ਜੀਅ ਜੰਤ ਸਭਿ ਮਾਸਹੁ ਹੋਏ ਜੀਇ ਲਇਆ ਵਾਸੇਰਾ ॥ ਅਭਖੁ ਭਖਹਿ ਭਖੁ ਤਜਿ ਛੋਡਹਿ ਅੰਧੁ ਗੁਰੂ ਜਿਨ ਕੇਰਾ ॥ ਮਾਸਹੁ ਨਿੰਮੇ ਮਾਸਹੁ ਜੰਮੇ ਹਮ ਮਾਸੈ ਕੇ ਭਾਂਡੇ ॥ ਗਿਆਨੁ ਧਿਆਨੁ ਕਛੁ ਸੂਝੈ ਨਾਹੀ ਚਤੁਰੁ ਕਹਾਵੈ ਪਾਂਡੇ ॥ ਮਾਸੁ ਪੁਰਾਣੀ ਮਾਸੁ ਕਤੇਬੀ ਚਹੁ ਜੁਗਿ ਮਾਸੁ ਕਮਾਣਾ ॥ ਜਜਿ ਕਾਜਿ ਵੀਆਹਿ ਸੁਹਾਵੈ ਓਥੈ ਮਾਸੁ ਸਮਾਣਾ ॥ ਇਸਤ੍ਰੀ ਪੁਰਖ ਨਿਪਜਹਿ ਮਾਸਹੁ ਪਾਤਿਸਾਹ ਸੁਲਤਾਨਾਂ ॥ ਜੇ ਓਇ ਦਿਸਹਿ ਨਰਕਿ ਜਾਂਦੇ ਤਾਂ ਉਨ੍ਹ੍ਹ ਕਾ ਦਾਨੁ ਨ ਲੈਣਾ ॥ ਦੇਂਦਾ ਨਰਕਿ ਸੁਰਗਿ ਲੈਦੇ ਦੇਖਹੁ ਏਹੁ ਧਿਙਾਣਾ ॥ ਆਪਿ ਨ ਬੂਝੈ ਲੋਕ ਬੁਝਾਏ ਪਾਂਡੇ ਖਰਾ ਸਿਆਣਾ ॥ ਪਾਂਡੇ ਤੂ ਜਾਣੈ ਹੀ ਨਾਹੀ ਕਿਥਹੁ ਮਾਸੁ ਉਪੰਨਾ ॥ ਤੋਇਅਹੁ ਅੰਨੁ ਕਮਾਦੁ ਕਪਾਹਾਂ ਤੋਇਅਹੁ ਤ੍ਰਿਭਵਣੁ ਗੰਨਾ ॥ ਤੋਆ ਆਖੈ ਹਉ ਬਹੁ ਬਿਧਿ ਹਛਾ ਤੋਐ ਬਹੁਤੁ ਬਿਕਾਰਾ ॥ ਏਤੇ ਰਸ ਛੋਡਿ ਹੋਵੈ ਸੰਨਿਆਸੀ ਨਾਨਕੁ ਕਹੈ ਵਿਚਾਰਾ ॥੨॥ {ਪੰਨਾ 1289-1290}

The purpose of sharing these line is that guru sahib used words like " Moorakh, PAANDA JAANE NAAHI, Hindu Andha, Turk Kaana, etc. many times in countless verses...... this tells us the fact that they knew "they have better understanding of many?every concepts than others contemporary SAADHs/PREACHERS of that time."

THIS IS MY CURRENT UNDERSTANDING OF SIKHI, FEEL FREE TO PROVE ME WRONG with A STRONG ARGUMENT, IF IT HAS ANY LOGICAL EXPLANATION BEHIND IT.