i remember a professor telling me when i asked him a question about being vegetarian etc
he said
that whenever sikhs asked guru gobind singh ji whether to eat meat or not guru gobind singh ji answered" kutha nahin khana"
Wrong!!
What is Kuttha meat?
Punjabi-English Dictionary, PunjabiUniversity, Dept. of Punjabi Lexicography, Published Dec. 1994. "Kuttha: meat of animal or fowl slaughtered slowly as prescribed by Islamic law."
Punjabi English Dictionary, Singh Bros., Amritsar"Kuttha: Tortured, killed according to Mohammedan law."
In the Rehit Marayada (
http://www.sgpc.net/rehat_maryada/section_six.html), Section Six, it states:
The undermentioned four transgressions (tabooed practices) must be avoided
1. Dishonouring the hair;
2. Eating the meat of an animal slaughtered the Muslim way(Kutha);
3. Cohabiting with a person other than one's spouse;
4. Using tobacco.
And using the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji
mehlaa 1.
First Mehl:
maanas khaanay karahi nivaaj.
The man-eaters say their prayers.
chhuree vagaa-in tin gal taag.
Those who wield the knife wear the sacred thread around their necks.
tin ghar barahman pooreh naad.
In their homes, the Brahmins sound the conch.
unHaa bhe aavahi o-ee saad.
They too have the same taste.
koorhee raas koorhaa vaapaar.
False is their capital, and false is their trade.
koorh bol karahi aahaar.
Speaking falsehood, they take their food.
saram Dharam kaa dayraa door.
The home of modesty and Dharma is far from them.
naanak koorh rahi-aa bharpoor.
O Nanak, they are totally permeated with falsehood.
mathai tikaa tayrh Dhotee kakhaa-ee.
The sacred marks are on their foreheads, and the saffron loin-cloths are around their waists;
hath chhuree jagat kaasaa-ee.
in their hands they hold the knives - they are the butchers of the world!
neel vastar pahir hoveh parvaan.
Wearing blue robes, they seek the approval of the Muslim rulers.
malaychh Dhaan lay poojeh puraan.
Accepting bread from the Muslim rulers, they still worship the Puraanas.
abhaakhi-aa kaa kuthaa bakraa khaanaa.
They eat the meat of the goats, killed after the Muslim prayers are read over them,
cha-ukay upar kisai na jaanaa.
but they do not allow anyone else to enter their kitchen areas.
day kai cha-ukaa kadhee kaar.
They draw lines around them, plastering the ground with cow-dung.
upar aa-ay baithay koorhi-aar.
The false come and sit within them.
mat bhitai vay mat bhitai.
They cry out, "Do not touch our food,
ih ann asaadaa fitai.
this food of ours will be polluted!
tan fitai fayrh karayn.
But with their polluted bodies, they commit evil deeds.
man joothai chulee bharayn.
With filthy minds, they try to cleanse their mouths.
kaho naanak sach Dhi-aa-ee-ai.
Says Nanak, meditate on the True Lord.
such hovai taa sach paa-ee-ai. ||2||
If you are pure, you will obtain the True Lord. ||2||
The Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji clearly shows Kuttha to mean ritually slaughtered meat. All scholars agree on this.
In fact such a hukamna would indeed contradict the one Guru Gobind Singh ji sent to his Sikhs in Kabul (ADVANCED STUDIES IN SIKHISM by Jasbir Singh and Harbans Singh.):
"Sarbat sangat Kabul Guru rakhe ga
Tusa ute asaadee bahut khusi hai
Tusi Khande da Amrit Panja to lena
Kes rakhne...ih asadee mohur hair;
Kachh, Kirpan da visah nahee karna
SARB LOH da kara hath rakhna
Dono vakat kesa dee palna karna
Sarbat sangat abhakhia da kutha
Khave naheen, Tamakoo na vartana
Bhadni tatha kanya-maran-vale so mel na rakhe
Meene, Massandei, Ramraiye ki sangat na baiso
Gurbani parhni...Waheguru, Waheguru japna
Guru kee rahat rakhnee
Sarbat sangat oopar meri khushi hai.
Patshahi Dasvi
Jeth 26, Samat 1756
(To the entire sangat at Kabul.
The Guru will protect the Sangat,
I am pleased with you all.
You should take baptism by the sword, from the Five Beloveds.
Keep your hair uncut for this is a seal of the Guru,
Accept the use of shorts and a sword.
Always wear IRON KARA on your wrist,
Keep your hair clean and comb it twice a day.
Do not eat Halal (Kosher) meat,
Do not use tobacco in any form,
Have no connection with those who kill their daughters
Or permit the cutting of their children's hair.
Do not associate with Meenas, Massands and Ram-raiyas (anti-Sikh cults)
Recite the Guru's hymns
Meditate on "The Name of our Wonderful Lord",
Follow the Sikh code of discipline
I give the entire sangat my blessing)
Signature of 10th Guru
Jeth 26, 1756 Bikrami (23rd May 1699 A.D)
and from what i have learned by doing research is that in those days kutha meant all types of meat, it was used as a very general word to refer to "meat"
so that clears that we should be vegetarian right?
Wrong Again my friend.
The research you have done is inconclusive. I suggest you read:
http://www.sikh-history.com/cgi-bin/Ultimate/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=10;t=000802
Here are other scholars views on this:
Sikhs and Sikhism by I.J. Singh, Manohar, Delhi
Throughout Sikh history, there have been movements or subsects of Sikhism which have espoused vegetarianism. I think there is no basis for such dogma or practice in Sikhism. Certainly Sikhs do not think that a vegetarian's achievements in spirituality are easier or higher. It is surprising to see that vegetarianism is such an important facet of Hindu practice in light of the fact that animal sacrifice was a significant and much valued Hindu Vedic ritual for ages. Guru Nanak in his writings clearly rejected both sides of the arguments - on the virtues of vegetarianism or meat eating - as banal and so much nonsense, nor did he accept the idea that a cow was somehow more sacred than a horse or a chicken. He also refused to be drawn into a contention on the differences between flesh and greens, for instance. History tells us that to impart this message, Nanak cooked meat at an important Hindu festival in Kurukshetra. Having cooked it he certainly did not waste it, but probably served it to his followers and ate himself. History is quite clear that Guru Hargobind and Guru Gobind Singh were accomplished and avid hunters. The game was cooked and put to good use, to throw it away would have been an awful waste.
Guru Granth Sahib, An Analytical Study by Surindar Singh Kohli, Singh Bros. Amritsar
The ideas of devotion and service in Vaishnavism have been accepted by Adi Granth, but the insistence of Vaishnavas on vegetarian diet has been rejected.
A History of the Sikh People by Dr. Gopal Singh, World Sikh University Press, Delhi
Commenting on meat being served in the langar during the time of Guru Angad: However, it is strange that now-a-days in the Community-Kitchen attached to the Sikh temples, and called the Guru's Kitchen (or, Guru-ka-langar) meat-dishes are not served at all. May be, it is on account of its being, perhaps, expensive, or not easy to keep for long. Or, perhaps the Vaishnava tradition is too strong to be shaken off.
Philosophy of Sikhism by Gyani Sher Singh (Ph.D), Shiromani Gurdwara Parbandhak Committee. Amritsar
As a true Vaisnavite Kabir remained a strict vegetarian. Kabir far from defying Brahmanical tradition as to the eating of meat, would not permit so much, as the plucking of a flower (G.G.S. pg 479), whereas Nanak deemed all such scruples to be superstitions, Kabir held the doctrine of Ahinsa or the non-destruction of life, which extended even to that of flowers. The Sikh Gurus, on the contrary, allowed and even encouraged, the use of animal flesh as food. Nanak has exposed this Ahinsa superstition in Asa Ki War (G.G.S. pg 472) and Malar Ke War (G.G.S. pg. 1288).
A Popular Dictionary of Sikhism, W.Owen Cole and Piara Singh Sambhi, England
The Gurus were loath to pronounce upon such matters as the eating of meat or ways of disposing of the dead because undue emphasis on them could detract from the main thrust of their message which had to do with spiritual liberation. However, Guru Nanak did reject by implication the practice of vegetarianism related to ideas of pollution when he said, 'All food is pure; for God has provided it for our sustenance' (AG 472). Many Sikhs are vegetarian and meat should never be served at langar. Those who do eat meat are unlikely to include beef in their diet, at least in India, because of their cultural proximity to Hindus.
Sikhism, A Complete Introduction by Dr. H.S. Singha and Satwant Kaur, Hemkunt Press, Delhi
In general Sikhism has adopted an ambivalent attitude towards meat eating as against vegetarianism. But if meat is to be taken at all, Guru Gobind Singh enjoined on the Khalsa Panth not to take kosher meat ie. Halal meat slaughtered and prepared for eating according to the Islamic practice. In fact it is one of the kurahits for every amritdhari Sikh. One who infringes it becomes patit (apostate).
Real Sikhism by Surinder Singh Kohli, Harman Publishing, New Delhi
A close study of the above-mentioned hymns of Guru Nanak Dev clarifies the Sikh standpoint regarding meat-eating. The Guru has not fallen into the controversy of eating or not eating animal food. He has ridiculed the religious priests for raising their voice in favour of vegetarianism. He called them hypocrites and totally blind to the realities of life. They are unwise and thoughtless persons, who do not go into the root of the matter. According to him, the water is the source of all life whether vegetable or animal. Guru Nanak Dev said. "None of the grain of corn is without life. In the first place, there is life in water, by which all are made green" (Var Asa M.1, p. 472). Thus there is life in vegetation and life in all types of creatures.
Introduction to Sikhism by Dr. Gobind Singh Mansukhani, Hemkunt Press, Delhi
The Gurus neither advocate meat nor banned its use. They left it to the choice of the individual. There are passages against meat, in the Adi Granth. Guru Gobind Singh however prohibited for the Khalsa the use of Halal or Kutha meat prepared in the Muslim ritualistic way.
Introduction to Sikhism by G.S. Sidhu, Shromini Sikh Sangat, Toronto
There are no restrictions for the Sikhs regarding food, except that the Sikhs are forbidden to eat meat prepared as a ritual slaughter. The Sikhs are asked to abstain from intoxicants.
The Sikh Faith by Gurbakhsh Singh, Canadian Sikh Study and Teaching Society, Vancouver
According to the Maryada booklet 'Kutha', the meat prepared by the Muslim ritual, is prohibited for a Sikh. Regarding eating other meat, it is silent. From the prohibition of the Kutha meat, it is rightly presumed that non-Kutha meat is not prohibited for the Sikhs. Beef is prohibited to the Hindus and pork to the Muslims. Jews and Christians have their own taboos. They do not eat certain kinds of meat on certain days. Sikhs have no such instructions. If one thinks he needs to eat meat, it does not matter which meat it is, beef, poultry, fish, etc., or which day it is. One should, however, be careful not to eat any meat harmful for his health. Gurbani's instructions on this topic are very clear. "Only fools argue whether to eat meat or not. Who can define what is meat and what is not meat? Who knows where the sin lies, being a vegetarian or a non-vegetarian?" (1289) The Brahmanical thought that a religious person should be a vegetarian is of recent origin. Earlier, Brahmans had been eating beef and horse meat. In conclusion, it is wrong to say that any person who eats meat (of course Kutha, because of the Muslim rituals is prohibited) loses his membership of the Khalsa and becomes an apostate.
Scientific Interpretation of Gurbani, Paper by Dr. Devinder Singh Chahal
The above discussion leads us to the conclusion that the Sikh Gurus made people aware of the fact that it is very difficult to distinguish between a plant and an animal, therefore, it is difficult to distinguish between a vegetarian and a non-vegetarian diets and there is no sin of eating food originating from plants or animals.
Mini Encyclopaedia of Sikhism by H.S. Singha, Hemkunt Press, Delhi.
The practice of the Gurus is uncertain. Guru Nanak seems to have eaten venison or goat, depending upon different janamsakhi versions of a meal which he cooked at Kurukshetra which evoked the criticism of Brahmins. Guru Amardas ate only rice and lentils but this abstention cannot be regarded as evidence of vegetarianism, only of simple living. Guru Gobind Singh also permitted the eating of meat but he prescribed that it should be Jhatka meat and not Halal meat that is jagged in the Muslim fashion.
now guru nanak dev ji says that we should not be vegetarian just for the sake of being vegetarian
Agreed
i would say that we should be vegetarian for the sake of the animals (why? cruelty etc)
I disagree again. Guruji in detail describes the pain of plants:
Page 143 of the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji
mehlaa 1.
First Mehl:
vaykh je mithaa kati-aa kat kut baDhaa paa-ay.
Look, and see how the sugar-cane is cut down. After cutting away its branches, its feet are bound together into bundles,
khundhaa andar rakh kai dayn so mal sajaa-ay.
and then, it is placed between the wooden rollers and crushed.
ras kas tatar paa-ee-ai tapai tai villaa-ay.
What punishment is inflicted upon it! Its juice is extracted and placed in the cauldron; as it is heated, it groans and cries out.
bhee so fog samaalee-ai dichai ag jaalaa-ay.
And then, the crushed cane is collected and burnt in the fire below.
naanak mithai patree-ai vaykhhu lokaa aa-ay. ||2||
Nanak: come, people, and see how the sweet sugar-cane is treated! ||2||
In fact we have just as much chance of being incarnated a plant as we do an animal, so the two are on par with life form’s….only human life is sacrosanct:
On page 176 of the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, the following is written:
ga-orhee gu-aarayree mehlaa 5.
Gauree Gwaarayree, Fifth Mehl:
ka-ee janam bha-ay keet patangaa.
In so many incarnations, you were a worm and an insect;
ka-ee janam gaj meen kurangaa.
in so many incarnations, you were an elephant, a fish and a deer.
ka-ee janam pankhee sarap ho-i-o.
In so many incarnations, you were a bird and a snake.
ka-ee janam haivar barikh jo-i-o. ||1||
In so many incarnations, you were yoked as an ox and a horse. ||1||
mil jagdees milan kee baree-aa.
Meet the Lord of the Universe - now is the time to meet Him.
chirankaal ih dayh sanjaree-aa. ||1|| rahaa-o.
After so very long, this human body was fashioned for you. ||1||Pause||
ka-ee janam sail gir kari-aa.
In so many incarnations, you were rocks and mountains;
ka-ee janam garabh hir khari-aa.
in so many incarnations, you were aborted in the womb;
ka-ee janam saakh kar upaa-i-aa.
in so many incarnations, you developed branches and leaves;
lakh cha-oraaseeh jon bharmaa-i-aa. ||2||
you wandered through 8.4 million incarnations. ||2||
saaDhsang bha-i-o janam paraapat.
Through the Saadh Sangat, the Company of the Holy, you obtained this human life.
kar sayvaa bhaj har har gurmat.
Do seva - selfless service; follow the Guru's Teachings, and vibrate the Lord's Name, Har, Har.
ti-aag maan jhooth abhimaan.
Abandon pride, falsehood and arrogance.
jeevat mareh dargeh parvaan. ||3||
Remain dead while yet alive, and you shall be welcomed in the Court of the Lord. ||3||
jo kichh ho-aa so tujh tay hog.
Whatever has been, and whatever shall be, comes from You, Lord.
avar na doojaa karnai jog.
No one else can do anything at all.
taa milee-ai jaa laihi milaa-ay.
We are united with You, when You unite us with Yourself.
kaho naanak har har gun gaa-ay. ||4||3||72||
Says Nanak, sing the Glorious Praises of the Lord, Har, Har. ||4||3||72||
Reading this Shanbad one can clearly see that the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji does not attach any particular order to how life is incarnated. Infact it states:
ka-ee janam sail gir kari-aa.
In so many incarnations, you were rocks and mountains;
ka-ee janam garabh hir khari-aa.
in so many incarnations, you were aborted in the womb;
ka-ee janam saakh kar upaa-i-aa.
in so many incarnations, you developed branches and leaves;
now i belive that all the gurus were vegetarian
Some may have been but highly unlikely. The reason’s for this:
1) In Sri Dasam Granth Guru Gobind Singh ji demonstrates how he is from Kshatriya lineage i.e. Khatri/Kshatriya are one and the same. As we know Kshatriya’s are meat eaters.
2) The ancestors of the Guru’s and their family members today are not vegetarian, this gives a clue as to their diet.
3) Eyewitness accounts:
In ‘Mobad’ Dabistan-I Mazahib 1645-46, the author states:
Many person became his disciples. Nanak believed in the Oneness of God and in the way that it is asserted in Muhammadan theology. He also believed in transmigration of souls. Holding wine and pork to be unlawful, he had [himself] abandoned eating meat. He decreed avoidance of causing harm to animals. It was after his time that meat-eating spread amongst his followers. Arjan Mal, who was on of his lineal succesors, found this to be evil. He prohibited people from eating meat, saying “This is not in accordance with Nanak’s wishes”. Later, Hargobind, son of Arjan Mal, ate eat and took to hunting. Most of their [the Gurus] followers adopted his practice.
therefore i am vegetarian because thats how my gurus were like
That is your belief, but in all honesty not a fact. Be a vegetarian, but do not for a minute think it has anything to do with Sikhism, or the Sikh Guru’s.
although i belive being an omnivore is better (so a little bit of meat in your diet) because there are a few nutrients that can only be obtained from animals (but they arent essential)
Nonsense….as a powerlifter and athlete I experiment with my diet. I have become vegetarian, to vegan to what I called “balanced” (vegetable, fruit and some meat and chicken/fish). When I became vegetarian/vegan, I was considerably weaker to what I am now. My bench press plummeted from 150 kilo’s to 100 kilo’s (and that was with the same amount of training).
