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Simran And Sikhi (Karminder Singh Dhillon)

Harry Haller

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he has taken a stand against the mindlessness of repetition

but this is the crux of the argument, many people find comfort/connection/spirituality in mindlessness repetition, and it is mindless repetition that is the key issue here.

It is mindless repetition that we have all been brought up with, the sight of parents, grandparents rushing through Japji sahib, the Akhand Paths with the granthis going at breakneck speed while we all chatted in the kitchen, the cheery repetition of the words 'waheguru' guaranteed to make anything happen, be it the cure for cancer, or that new Mercedes, if anything is wrong in your life, just chant 'waheguru' everything will be ok, and then suddenly, a small child points out the obvious, the emperor has no clothes on, maybe we should understand the words, instead of chanting.............
 

ActsOfGod

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I read this today and am now even more confused. The injunction to repeat the True Name appears time and again in Gurbani, for example:

ਸਦਾ ਰੰਗਿ ਰਾਤੀ ਸਹਜੇ ਮਾਤੀ ਅਨਦਿਨੁ ਨਾਮੁ ਵਖਾਣੈ
Saḏā rang rāṯī sėhje māṯī an▫ḏin nām vakẖāṇai.
Ever imbued with His Love, in perfect poise and grace, she repeats His Name, night and day.


and the following, also on Ang 568:

ਅਨਦਿਨੁ ਨਾਮੁ ਵਖਾਣੀਐ ਲਾਹਾ ਹਰਿ ਰਸੁ ਪੀਜੈ ਰਾਮ
An▫ḏin nām vakẖāṇī▫ai lāhā har ras pījai rām.
Night and day, he repeats the Naam, the Name of the Lord, and he earns his profits, drinking in the subtle essence of the Lord.


ਲਾਹਾ ਹਰਿ ਰਸੁ ਲੀਜੈ ਹਰਿ ਰਾਵੀਜੈ ਅਨਦਿਨੁ ਨਾਮੁ ਵਖਾਣੈ
Lāhā har ras lījai har rāvījai an▫ḏin nām vakẖāṇai.
He earns the profit of the subtle essence of the Lord, meditating on the Lord, and repeating the Naam, night and day.



As far as I understand it, "Vaheguru" is the name of God. (or one of the names, anyway). So it would seem that repeating "Vaheguru" night and day (i.e. continuously) is what is advocated?

Or I am not understanding it right?

Thanks!
 
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spnadmin

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ActsOGod ji

If you take the literal meaning of these verses, then you will arrive at the conclusion you have arrived at. Taranjeet Singh ji has already pointed out that this is one path that a person can take. But problems lie with the use of only one tuk. Let's look at the entire shabad for the just for the first tuk you posted

ਸਦਾ ਰੰਗਿ ਰਾਤੀ ਸਹਜੇ ਮਾਤੀ ਅਨਦਿਨੁ ਨਾਮੁ ਵਖਾਣੈ ॥
Saḏā rang rāṯī sėhje māṯī an▫ḏin nām vakẖāṇai.
Ever imbued with His Love, in perfect poise and grace, she repeats His Name, night and day.

I am not trying to be funny - but does the tuk say exactly how many times "she" the soul-bride should repeat His Name? No. To repeat His Name is not the main idea of the shabad. The main idea is to become 'suhagan,' the soul bride.

Please take a look at the entire shabad. Our understanding should improve when we do. It should become deeper and more detailed. The color highlighting is explained later.

ੴ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਪ੍ਰਸਾਦਿ ॥
Ik▫oaʼnkār saṯgur parsāḏ.
One Universal Creator God. By The Grace Of The True Guru:

ਆਪਣੇ ਪਿਰ ਕੈ ਰੰਗਿ ਰਤੀ ਮੁਈਏ ਸੋਭਾਵੰਤੀ ਨਾਰੇ ॥
Āpṇe pir kai rang raṯī mu▫ī▫e sobẖāvanṯī nāre.
Let yourself be imbued with the Love of your Husband Lord, O beautiful, mortal bride.

ਸਚੈ ਸਬਦਿ ਮਿਲਿ ਰਹੀ ਮੁਈਏ ਪਿਰੁ ਰਾਵੇ ਭਾਇ ਪਿਆਰੇ ॥
Sacẖai sabaḏ mil rahī mu▫ī▫e pir rāve bẖā▫e pi▫āre.
Let yourself remain merged in the True Word of the Shabad, O mortal bride; savor and enjoy the Love of your Beloved Husband Lord.


ਸਚੈ ਭਾਇ ਪਿਆਰੀ ਕੰਤਿ ਸਵਾਰੀ ਹਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਸਿਉ ਨੇਹੁ ਰਚਾਇਆ ॥
Sacẖai bẖā▫e pi▫ārī kanṯ savārī har har si▫o nehu racẖā▫i▫ā.
The Husband Lord embellishes His beloved bride with His True Love; she is in love with the Lord, Har, Har.

ਆਪੁ ਗਵਾਇਆ ਤਾ ਪਿਰੁ ਪਾਇਆ ਗੁਰ ਕੈ ਸਬਦਿ ਸਮਾਇਆ ॥
Āp gavā▫i▫ā ṯā pir pā▫i▫ā gur kai sabaḏ samā▫i▫ā.
Renouncing her self-centeredness, she attains her Husband Lord, and remains merged in the Word of the Guru's Shabad.


ਸਾ ਧਨ ਸਬਦਿ ਸੁਹਾਈ ਪ੍ਰੇਮ ਕਸਾਈ ਅੰਤਰਿ ਪ੍ਰੀਤਿ ਪਿਆਰੀ ॥
Sā ḏẖan sabaḏ suhā▫ī parem kasā▫ī anṯar parīṯ pi▫ārī.
That soul bride is adorned, who is attracted by His Love, and who treasures the Love of her Beloved within her heart.

ਨਾਨਕ ਸਾ ਧਨ ਮੇਲਿ ਲਈ ਪਿਰਿ ਆਪੇ ਸਾਚੈ ਸਾਹਿ ਸਵਾਰੀ ॥੧॥
Nānak sā ḏẖan mel la▫ī pir āpe sācẖai sāhi savārī. ||1||
O Nanak, the Lord blends that soul bride with Himself; the True King adorns her. ||1||

ਨਿਰਗੁਣਵੰਤੜੀਏ ਪਿਰੁ ਦੇਖਿ ਹਦੂਰੇ ਰਾਮ ॥
Nirguṇvanṯ▫ṛī▫e pir ḏekẖ haḏūre rām.
O worthless bride, see your Husband Lord ever-present.

ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਜਿਨੀ ਰਾਵਿਆ ਮੁਈਏ ਪਿਰੁ ਰਵਿ ਰਹਿਆ ਭਰਪੂਰੇ ਰਾਮ ॥
Gurmukẖ jinī rāvi▫ā mu▫ī▫e pir rav rahi▫ā bẖarpūre rām.
One who, as Gurmukh, enjoys her Husband Lord, O mortal bride, knows Him to be all-pervading everywhere.


ਪਿਰੁ ਰਵਿ ਰਹਿਆ ਭਰਪੂਰੇ ਵੇਖੁ ਹਜੂਰੇ ਜੁਗਿ ਜੁਗਿ ਏਕੋ ਜਾਤਾ ॥
Pir rav rahi▫ā bẖarpūre vekẖ hajūre jug jug eko jāṯā.
The Lord is all-pervading everywhere; behold Him ever-present. Throughout the ages, know Him as the One.

ਧਨ ਬਾਲੀ ਭੋਲੀ ਪਿਰੁ ਸਹਜਿ ਰਾਵੈ ਮਿਲਿਆ ਕਰਮ ਬਿਧਾਤਾ ॥
Ḏẖan bālī bẖolī pir sahj rāvai mili▫ā karam biḏẖāṯā.
The young, innocent bride enjoys her Husband Lord; she meets Him, the Architect of karma.


ਜਿਨਿ ਹਰਿ ਰਸੁ ਚਾਖਿਆ ਸਬਦਿ ਸੁਭਾਖਿਆ ਹਰਿ ਸਰਿ ਰਹੀ ਭਰਪੂਰੇ ॥
Jin har ras cẖākẖi▫ā sabaḏ subẖākẖi▫ā har sar rahī bẖarpūre.
One who tastes the sublime essence of the Lord, and utters the sublime Word of the Shabad, remains immersed in the Lord's Ambrosial Pool.



ਨਾਨਕ ਕਾਮਣਿ ਸਾ ਪਿਰ ਭਾਵੈ ਸਬਦੇ ਰਹੈ ਹਦੂਰੇ ॥੨॥
Nānak kāmaṇ sā pir bẖāvai sabḏe rahai haḏūre. ||2||
O Nanak, that soul bride is pleasing to her Husband Lord, who, through the Shabad, remains in His Presence.||2|


ਸੋਹਾਗਣੀ ਜਾਇ ਪੂਛਹੁ ਮੁਈਏ ਜਿਨੀ ਵਿਚਹੁ ਆਪੁ ਗਵਾਇਆ ॥
Sohāgaṇī jā▫e pūcẖẖahu mu▫ī▫e jinī vicẖahu āp gavā▫i▫ā.
Go and ask the happy soul-brides, O mortal bride, who have eradicated their self-conceit from within.

ਪਿਰ ਕਾ ਹੁਕਮੁ ਨ ਪਾਇਓ ਮੁਈਏ ਜਿਨੀ ਵਿਚਹੁ ਆਪੁ ਨ ਗਵਾਇਆ ॥
Pir kā hukam na pā▫i▫o mu▫ī▫e jinī vicẖahu āp na gavā▫i▫ā.
Those who have not eradicated their self-conceit, O mortal bride, do not realize the Hukam of their Husband Lord's Command.

ਜਿਨੀ ਆਪੁ ਗਵਾਇਆ ਤਿਨੀ ਪਿਰੁ ਪਾਇਆ ਰੰਗ ਸਿਉ ਰਲੀਆ ਮਾਣੈ ॥
Jinī āp gavā▫i▫ā ṯinī pir pā▫i▫ā rang si▫o ralī▫ā māṇai.
Those who eradicate their self-conceit, obtain their Husband Lord; they delight in His Love.


This is the tuk you singled out, forgetting all the other tuks. You focus on the word "repeat" and don't take in the word "Shabad." Do not feel bad because many of us do that.

ਸਦਾ ਰੰਗਿ ਰਾਤੀ ਸਹਜੇ ਮਾਤੀ ਅਨਦਿਨੁ ਨਾਮੁ ਵਖਾਣੈ ॥
Saḏā rang rāṯī sėhje māṯī an▫ḏin nām vakẖāṇai.
Ever imbued with His Love, in perfect poise and grace, she repeats His Name, night and day.

Shabad continues


ਕਾਮਣਿ ਵਡਭਾਗੀ ਅੰਤਰਿ ਲਿਵ ਲਾਗੀ ਹਰਿ ਕਾ ਪ੍ਰੇਮੁ ਸੁਭਾਇਆ ॥
Kāmaṇ vadbẖāgī anṯar liv lāgī har kā parem subẖā▫i▫ā.
Very fortunate is that bride, who focuses her consciousness on Him; her Lord's Love is so sweet to her.

ਨਾਨਕ ਕਾਮਣਿ ਸਹਜੇ ਰਾਤੀ ਜਿਨਿ ਸਚੁ ਸੀਗਾਰੁ ਬਣਾਇਆ ॥੩॥
Nānak kāmaṇ sėhje rāṯī jin sacẖ sīgār baṇā▫i▫ā. ||3||
O Nanak, that soul-bride who is adorned with Truth, is imbued with her Lord's Love, in the state of perfect poise. ||3||

ਹਉਮੈ ਮਾਰਿ ਮੁਈਏ ਤੂ ਚਲੁ ਗੁਰ ਕੈ ਭਾਏ ॥
Ha▫umai mār mu▫ī▫e ṯū cẖal gur kai bẖā▫e.
Overcome your egotism, O mortal bride, and walk in the Guru's Way.

ਹਰਿ ਵਰੁ ਰਾਵਹਿ ਸਦਾ ਮੁਈਏ ਨਿਜ ਘਰਿ ਵਾਸਾ ਪਾਏ ॥
Har var rāvėh saḏā mu▫ī▫e nij gẖar vāsā pā▫e.
Thus you shall ever enjoy your Husband Lord, O mortal bride, and obtain an abode in the home of your own inner being.

]ਨਿਜ ਘਰਿ ਵਾਸਾ ਪਾਏ ਸਬਦੁ ਵਜਾਏ ਸਦਾ ਸੁਹਾਗਣਿ ਨਾਰੀ ॥
Nij gẖar vāsā pā▫e sabaḏ vajā▫e saḏā suhāgaṇ nārī.
Obtaining an abode in the home of her inner being, she vibrates the Word of the Shabad, and is a happy soul-bride forever.



ਪਿਰੁ ਰਲੀਆਲਾ ਜੋਬਨੁ ਬਾਲਾ ਅਨਦਿਨੁ ਕੰਤਿ ਸਵਾਰੀ ॥
Pir ralī▫ālā joban bālā an▫ḏin kanṯ savārī.
The Husband Lord is delightful, and forever young; night and day, He embellishes His bride.


ਹਰਿ ਵਰੁ ਸੋਹਾਗੋ ਮਸਤਕਿ ਭਾਗੋ ਸਚੈ ਸਬਦਿ ਸੁਹਾਏ ॥
Har var sohāgo masṯak bẖāgo sacẖai sabaḏ suhā▫e.
Her Husband Lord activates the destiny written on her forehead, and she is adorned with the True Shabad.


ਨਾਨਕ ਕਾਮਣਿ ਹਰਿ ਰੰਗਿ ਰਾਤੀ ਜਾ ਚਲੈ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਭਾਏ ॥੪॥੧॥
Nānak kāmaṇ har rang rāṯī jā cẖalai saṯgur bẖā▫e. ||4||1||
O Nanak, the soul-bride is imbued with the Love of the Lord, when she walks according to the Will of the True Guru. ||4||1||

Those who are men and who are women, they become happy brides when merged in the Lord's love. Nothing in this shabad states or implies one should say Waheguru over and over again. Your eye falls to the word "repeat" and Karminder Singh Dhillon explains that we wrongly take this to mean chant, recite, or say a 'name of God' over and over again.

Look at what is missed from that point of view. I highlighted in blue all the places where Guruji tells us how to be the happy soul-bride. Chanting is not mentioned. Repeat occurs only one time. But Guru ji is very clear about what is needed. The shabad itself is the word. The shabad itself must be the focus of steadfast comprehension and attention.

Through the Shabad we become the suhagan, happy soul-bride
. If someone were to chant Waheguru day and night minute by minute what time attention or energy would remain for all those other things that this shabad brings forth as the path to Waheguru - which I have highlighted in red. All of those things which are in red are active states of focused mind. When and how does one make this kind of effort by repeating repeating repeating? The idea lacks common sense.

One last thought of a practical nature. In all that we know from the sakhis and from Bhai Gurdas ji, we learn that Guru Nanak himself was not chanting or repeating HIs Name name over and over again. He was busy with pilgrimages, preaching, building Kartapur to be a spiritual center, writing hymns and composing kirtan, tending his herds and shepherding his human flock. He sets the standard for "repeating" God's name through righteous action, not through chanting or repeating. That is the point of the essay by Dr. Karmandir Singh Dhillon ji.

Anyone who wants to repeat repeat repeat should certainly do that. However, ShabadGuru should not be distorted to be an endorsement.
 

Ishna

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Meditating on Nam (Divine Substance) and Scriptures
Article IV

1. A Sikh should wake up in the ambrosial hours (three hours before the dawn), take bath and, concentrating his/her thoughts on One Immortal Being, repeat the name Waheguru (Wondrous Destroyer of darkness).

Even the Punjabi uses the word 'jap' in this passage which translates to "meditate, repeat" and not "chant".
 

chazSingh

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Thanks for all your input...

Does this mean to say that repeating "Waheguru" over and over again as we've been taught to do is actually not prescribed by Gurbani? It's so habitual now that I just say "Waheguru" repeatedly whenever I'm driving or standing in line or doing some chores, etc.

Still very confused about how to actually do simran. And what did Guru Nanak Sahib mean in Japji Sahib when he wrote "Amrit Vayla such nao vadiai vichar". I got the first part, Amrit Vayla, but the second part, how exactly should one do vichar? Help please from anyone who can shed any light on this.

Guru Fateh!

Acts of God Ji,

there are some great links on my personal Blog about Amrit Vela simran:

http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/blogs/chazsingh/8301-daily-amrit-vela-blog-difficulties-joys.html


if you like repeating 'Waheguru' in your mind throughout the day, then do it... it is better than repeating "money, money, money" or a million other things :)

the Shabad Waheguru obviously has a deep connection with you and is a link to God so keep focus on it ji...

My Message to you form my own personal journey through Amrit Vela, is if you have the perseverance and patience, you will not regret spending some quiet time daily doing some Simran and focussing your attention/Consciousness to 'WITHIN' yourself.

I have never looked back, and nothing will ever change my mind on it :)
 

chazSingh

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Great article. It's unfortunate that 95% of Sikhs are happy to do the mentioned chanting. Flicking through Sikh channels it's hard not to find the chanting, 50 day, 24 hour simran sessions in order for good luck, or some other wanted change. The number of parcharak's promoting this are in abundance.

I always feel a bit cheated going to the Gurdwara for someone to spent 10-15+ minutes just chanting instead of delving into the deep ocean of pearls Guru Granth Sahib ji. I mean they can't complain that they don't have enough content to use!

I just so happened to go to the local Gurdwara where they are currently doing a 50 day Simran event (or whatever you want to call it) :)

Positive things i noticed

1. Have never seen so much Sangat ever, which was immense (regardless of their personal reasons for attending)

2. Sitting with my eyes closed when the whole Sangat said "waheguru" - I have never felt so much energy flow though me..through all my time delving though the Sri Guru Granth Sahib - I have never felt more connected to my Guru.

3. My Wife, who in her own word is "not interested in Sikhi or religion" for some reason attended with me...she found herself (in her own words) "immersed in Waheguru"...was "repeating waheguru without any conscious control" she described what she said was like falling asleep and having a very peaceful dream which has left her contemplating God since. How great Waheguru is :)

4. Listening to people at the gurdwara, many spoke of the immense energy felt during the Simran. Even if 5% of the people are inspired to seek god further, then what a great Sangat gathering this has been

Sure, many people will be attending to gain some 'Good Luck', a 'Better job' ... 'healing of an illness'....but if a few are inspired by Guru Ji to seek further and continue after the 50 Day Simran, then wow, how worthwhile this has been.


God bless ji
 

spnadmin

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chazSingh ji

Many have felt a similar surge of energy when chanting the Gayatri mantra at interfaith gatherings.
Om bhur bhuvah svah
tat-savitur varenyam
bhargo devasya dhimahi
dhiyo yo nah pracodayat

You say,
2. Sitting with my eyes closed when the whole Sangat said "waheguru" - I have never felt so much energy flow though me..through all my time delving though the Sri Guru Granth Sahib - I have never felt more connected to my Guru.

3. My Wife, who in her own word is "not interested in Sikhi or religion" for some reason attended with me...she found herself (in her own words) "immersed in Waheguru"...was "repeating waheguru without any conscious control" she described what she said was like falling asleep and having a very peaceful dream which has left her contemplating God since. How great Waheguru is


Would you explain how your description follows from Gurmat or a careful reading of ShabadGuru? The author of the OP has argued that Simran within the experience of ShabadGuru is not the same thing as sitting with your eyes closed.

Perhaps I misunderstand and you are not trying to connect the Waheguru experience to ShabadGuru.
 

Harry Haller

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Years ago, at a Hedonists society I was fond of attending, I recall we all sat round a table and chanted the same word again and again, I found it also quite exciting and although not peaceful, (but then peace was not what we were chanting for), quite brain numbing....


It is interesting to note that the very practice that Guru Nanakji tried to get us away from, ie inducement of an almost hypnotic state through oral ingestion, or indeed mental and verbal gymnastics, is now a recognised state within Sikhism to become at one with Creator.

Sikhism is different, it was always supposed to be different, not just a bit different, but 180 degrees different, it taught that there are no short cuts, no magical ceremonies, just study and practice. Study the SGGS and practice it in your life.
 

chazSingh

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spnadmin;193308

Many have felt a similar surge of energy when chanting the Gayatri mantra at interfaith gatherings.
Om bhur bhuvah svah
tat-savitur varenyam
bhargo devasya dhimahi
dhiyo yo nah pracodayat



Hi SPNAdmin Ji

I cannot talk much/compare about what others have felt with other mantra 1. because i haven't sat through the same experience as them 2. i havnt meditated on any other mantra other than "waheguru" and other Gurbani shabads.

My comments that you have highlighted were just reporting some positives that i observered from attending some days of a 50 day Simran program.

The author of the OP has argued that Simran within the experience of ShabadGuru is not the same thing as sitting with your eyes closed.

Perhaps I misunderstand and you are not trying to connect the Waheguru experience to ShabadGuru.

I think the whole of Gurbani is trying to 'awaken' us all in order that whilst we experience the Ego in its full manifestation (which has seperated us from almost complete knowledge of Gods existance) we can start to remember the truth of our self and the reality of God.

As you say "simran is remembering" so i'm guessing the remembering will take place in many forms for each individual.

I am not as learned as many on this forum when it comes to gurbani...
i beleive most methods will be useful in some way providing your thirst is there.

the thirst, combined with the vibrational potency of Gurbani will no doubt be felt by God and God will reveal the truth (at which point, the real Simran/Remembering begins)

I don't know if that answers your question...i find it very hard to say that one method is different to the other because i havn't gone through all methods. I just find it hard to not recommend Waheguru Simran when so many people just call it repeating and parroting, when i know personally it so sooooooo much more :)

I suppose each person will find something that allows them to hit the frequency and state of mind required to turn that cup the right way round and receive the grace that was already there.
 

chazSingh

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people often say why do we need the whole of Gurbani if you think that just the shabad Waheguru is required.

I say, both are critical. Sri Guru Granth sahib provides my anchor...it tells me throughout my inner and outer journey that i am not going crazy, that the things i experience, see, feel are real...that i must continue moving forward, fighting with my corrupt mind, to never give up.... reading it, contemplating it, feeling its vibration, tells me i have a true, non judgemental, forgiving, loving companion through my journey to truth discovery....even if the world thinks i'm crazy :)

God Bless
 

spnadmin

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That's great chazSingh ji

A deeply sincere answer. However, Waheguru simran is not from Gurbani. Tuks often quoted to show that it is are usually quoted out of context. Thanks for not doing that.
 

ActsOfGod

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Thank you everyone for your insights and wisdom, I appreciate it. Yesterday at the Gurudwara I asked a Singh about this same question, and he concurred that chanting is not prescribed by Guru Sahib anywhere in SGGS. But he also stated that it's better to say Waheguru than not saying anything at all. Or saying something worse (like cursing someone out, for instance).

I think I am slowly coming to understand that there are many and varied viewpoints on this issue. It seems as personal as people's individual personalities.

However, it has become clear in my mind that Guru Nanak Sahib never endorsed chanting "Waheguru", which answers part of my original question. Many, many thanks for clearing that up.

I guess that my "Naam Simran" could comprise of reading the morning Nitnem at AmritVela. That would certainly qualify, and at the same time I would be giving my mind something of substance to chew on and think about. Thus I wouldn't fall into the vacuous empty space of mindless chanting.

I was curious, though, about mindful chanting. Where does that fall on the spectrum?

And finally (sorry to be asking so many questions), in terms of Nam Simran as I now understand it, personally it would be better for me to recite a shabad or paaht where in the past I used to recite "Waheguru". The only stumbling block I have is, I would want to do this when I was out and about in daily life, for example driving or waiting in line, etc. And usually we don't want to interrupt a paaht once we've started it or stop and not complete it. But daily activities are constantly being interrupted. Suppose I begin Chaupai Sahib paaht while waiting in line and I get to the counter before I complete it? I don't want to abruptly stop the paaht, so I have a little conundrum here. Or maybe there are some short shabads or paaht's that I can memorize that would be suitable for such occasions? Is it ok to recite only a few verses of Bani?

Thank you everyone for your insights, I really appreciate it! It has been invaluable to me.

Guru Fateh!
 

chazSingh

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Feb 20, 2012
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Thank you everyone for your insights and wisdom, I appreciate it. Yesterday at the Gurudwara I asked a Singh about this same question, and he concurred that chanting is not prescribed by Guru Sahib anywhere in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. But he also stated that it's better to say Waheguru than not saying anything at all. Or saying something worse (like cursing someone out, for instance).

I think I am slowly coming to understand that there are many and varied viewpoints on this issue. It seems as personal as people's individual personalities.

However, it has become clear in my mind that Guru Nanak Sahib never endorsed chanting "Waheguru", which answers part of my original question. Many, many thanks for clearing that up.

I guess that my "Naam Simran" could comprise of reading the morning Nitnem at AmritVela. That would certainly qualify, and at the same time I would be giving my mind something of substance to chew on and think about. Thus I wouldn't fall into the vacuous empty space of mindless chanting.

I was curious, though, about mindful chanting. Where does that fall on the spectrum?

And finally (sorry to be asking so many questions), in terms of Nam Simran as I now understand it, personally it would be better for me to recite a shabad or paaht where in the past I used to recite "Waheguru". The only stumbling block I have is, I would want to do this when I was out and about in daily life, for example driving or waiting in line, etc. And usually we don't want to interrupt a paaht once we've started it or stop and not complete it. But daily activities are constantly being interrupted. Suppose I begin Chaupai Sahib paaht while waiting in line and I get to the counter before I complete it? I don't want to abruptly stop the paaht, so I have a little conundrum here. Or maybe there are some short shabads or paaht's that I can memorize that would be suitable for such occasions? Is it ok to recite only a few verses of Bani?

Thank you everyone for your insights, I really appreciate it! It has been invaluable to me.

Guru Fateh!

if you can tell the difference between

saying "i love you" to someone just verbally and mentally

and

saying "i love you" to someone and actually feeling it deep in your heart...

then you should know the difference between mindless chanting and mindful chanting...

then you'll have a connection from Soul -> Mind -> to physical word manifestation...

while the other person may just hear the words "I love you" ... on a personal level, the words are manifesting something much much more that comes from your soul...and seeing as God is within your very being...he'll know the difference...:)

whether its saying "waheguru" or any Gurbani


just my thoughts ji...
 

spnadmin

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Jun 17, 2004
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ActsOfGod ji

There are many different options for you. I understand how it completely turns things upside down when reciting or even reading a prayer and then being interrupted. Don't try simran when it competes with a daily routine.

Personally, trying to do simran in a supermarket line also turns things upside down. Make a plan. List all the ways in which simran are possible: studying a shabad, reciting a shabad, taking cyber-hukamnama and reading the bani that goes with it, doing a sehaj paat where you read a page of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji a day, for starters. Pick one thing from that list and set time aside to study, think, write and ask questions. Once you work out the wrinkles on that one, pick another thing to add to your simran. Be practical. Just as your friendly Singh says, better to say "Waheguru" than a curse word, so it is better to do one thing well so it satisfiesyou instead of winding you up in frustrations.

I myself began this journey with the daily hukamnama. I printed out the hukamnama and read as much as I could about its meaning, and the ideas in it. I kept notes, everything together in a loose-leaf book. Then I moved from there. Today there is so much more. You can take the hukamnama and then find a blog or internet site where the shabads are explained. Make this your private time. Treat yourself to quality time with Guruji. It pays off. The important thing is to feel for those moments completely immersed in the ShabadGuru. Mine was only one approach. There are others.
 

spnadmin

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Jun 17, 2004
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Here is something for you. Very simple. Inni Kaur recently suffered the death of her mother. Always a Kaur it was with this death that she began a new path of discovering her heart. Everyday she takes the hukam and keeps a log of her feelings. It is so simple; yet you can make it as broad and as deep as you want.
Today’s Hukam, Darbar Sahib, Amritsar – Monday, November 4, 2013


O friend, such is the Divine whom I have obtained. The Divine does not leave me, and always keeps me company. Meeting the Guru, night and day, I sing Divine Praises. ||1|| Pause ||

I met the Divine, who has blessed me with all comforts; the Divine does not leave me to go anywhere else. I have seen the mortals of many and various types, but they are not equal to even a hair of my Beloved. ||1||

The Divine palace is so beautiful! Divine gate so wonderful! The celestial melody of the sound current resounds there. Says Nanak, I enjoy eternal bliss; I have obtained a permanent place in the home of my Beloved. || 2 || 1 || 27 ||

[Guru Arjan, Raag Dayv-Gandhaari, GGS: 533]



My eyes mist as I listen to today’s hukam.

I feel Guru has lifted a veil and revealed the consciousness of one who has been blessed with divine union.

The essence: “Blessed with divine union, I have gained an eternal place in the home of my beloved. I feel the constant presence of the divine. The eternal never-ending sound resounds within.”

Head bows …

Longing increases …

May mehar be bestowed …

I beg …


Everyday she does this and it is posted in SikhChic. Anyone can do this. And see the word "mehar" -- that can be something to follow up in other ways.

http://www.sikhchic.com/columnists/the_morning_hukam_a_meditation_monday_november_4_2013
 

Gyani Jarnail Singh

Sawa lakh se EK larraoan
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The reading of the Five Nitnem Banis daily (required as per SRM) is just like a student doing a last minute reading of his/her NOTES before the EXAM...Nitnem is simply a DISCIPLINE...reading the Japji for example..BEFORE GOING OUT into the WORLD and begin PRACTISING what the JAPJI requires !!

A Sikh who dutifully "reads" the Japji..BUT then DISREGARDS/IGNORES/FORGETS all about its MESSAGE while going about his DAY..is like the student who read his NOTES..BUT then NEVER ENTERED the EXAM ROOM at all..but LOITERED outside in the corridors or in a nearby MALL...!!!..and then the next morning dutifully reads his notes once again...again and again..till the day he dies...a FAILED STUDENT..

A SIKH who dutifully reads his Japjis and Rehrasses daily....for an entire LIFE TIME..BUT NEVER practiced any of its TRUTHS...is a FAILED SIKH. The FIRST and Most Fundamental of the TRUTHS in Japji coems at the very beginning... SATNAM...SAACH...AAD SACH...JUGAAD SACH..SACH SACH SACH...and thats what we are supposed to be holding on tightly every SINGLE MOMENT of our LIVES....but how many of us can TRUTHFULLY CLAIM...that we hold to TRUTH...if not every single moment at least for a few moments DAILY...increasing the AMOUNT daily...Thats the CAPITAL Guru ji wants us to have in OUR ACCOUNTS when we DEPART this world...Do we have that CAPITAL...
 

ActsOfGod

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This has been a time of learning and spiritual growth for me. I have some new learnings and beliefs as a result of this inquiry and your very generous dialogue with me. Sikhi is way deeper than I had ever comprehended.

I have learned that there is no "one right way". There are multiples approaches and each person does what makes sense to him or her, and what resonates with them the most. At the end of the day, it's not about following protocol as much as it's about the real connection with the Creator. Since we are all individuals, the many and myriad ways in which we connect to our Beloved will also be as individual as we are. There is no one "right" way that can be used as a formula, or recipe.

Sikhi is all about love. We can see from any love story that the lover and beloved don't need anyone to tell them how to connect with each other. Even if the whole world is against them, still they go to meet each other. Sikhi is the ultimate Love story. We are all born with this innate sense inside us, we can all tune it to that love.

I have been asking about how to do it, because I was concerned that I might be doing it wrong. In fact I was doing it wrong. But not cause I was following one prescription and not the other. In fact, Guru Sahib didn't give a procedure, and that should have been a clue.

This at once makes it sooooo compelling and just about the most difficult thing. Because there's nobody in your way. And because you're going to have to put in some real work, some real effort here. Following a recipe is easy, execution of steps 1 through n is easy. But actually building everything from scratch, that's a real challenge. It completely frees you from any and all burdens, but at the same time everything is up to you. Because everything really *is* up to you.

Thank you everyone.

Guru Fateh!
 

chazSingh

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Feb 20, 2012
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The reading of the Five Nitnem Banis daily (required as per SRM) is just like a student doing a last minute reading of his/her NOTES before the EXAM...Nitnem is simply a DISCIPLINE...reading the Japji for example..BEFORE GOING OUT into the WORLD and begin PRACTISING what the JAPJI requires !!

A Sikh who dutifully "reads" the Japji..BUT then DISREGARDS/IGNORES/FORGETS all about its MESSAGE while going about his DAY..is like the student who read his NOTES..BUT then NEVER ENTERED the EXAM ROOM at all..but LOITERED outside in the corridors or in a nearby MALL...!!!..and then the next morning dutifully reads his notes once again...again and again..till the day he dies...a FAILED STUDENT..

A SIKH who dutifully reads his Japjis and Rehrasses daily....for an entire LIFE TIME..BUT NEVER practiced any of its TRUTHS...is a FAILED SIKH. The FIRST and Most Fundamental of the TRUTHS in Japji coems at the very beginning... SATNAM...SAACH...AAD SACH...JUGAAD SACH..SACH SACH SACH...and thats what we are supposed to be holding on tightly every SINGLE MOMENT of our LIVES....but how many of us can TRUTHFULLY CLAIM...that we hold to TRUTH...if not every single moment at least for a few moments DAILY...increasing the AMOUNT daily...Thats the CAPITAL Guru ji wants us to have in OUR ACCOUNTS when we DEPART this world...Do we have that CAPITAL...

Very nicely explained Giani ji,

For me, after i do my amrit vela...the remainder of the day is where i really have a chance to live Gurbani in my thoughts and Actions...the true test..

The rest of the day allows me to experience God all around me, in others, to serve others...

And my amrit Vela gives me the chance to experience God deep within my very being on a one to one personal level...
 

chazSingh

Writer
SPNer
Feb 20, 2012
1,644
1,643
This has been a time of learning and spiritual growth for me. I have some new learnings and beliefs as a result of this inquiry and your very generous dialogue with me. Sikhi is way deeper than I had ever comprehended.

I have learned that there is no "one right way". There are multiples approaches and each person does what makes sense to him or her, and what resonates with them the most. At the end of the day, it's not about following protocol as much as it's about the real connection with the Creator. Since we are all individuals, the many and myriad ways in which we connect to our Beloved will also be as individual as we are. There is no one "right" way that can be used as a formula, or recipe.

Sikhi is all about love. We can see from any love story that the lover and beloved don't need anyone to tell them how to connect with each other. Even if the whole world is against them, still they go to meet each other. Sikhi is the ultimate Love story. We are all born with this innate sense inside us, we can all tune it to that love.

I have been asking about how to do it, because I was concerned that I might be doing it wrong. In fact I was doing it wrong. But not cause I was following one prescription and not the other. In fact, Guru Sahib didn't give a procedure, and that should have been a clue.

This at once makes it sooooo compelling and just about the most difficult thing. Because there's nobody in your way. And because you're going to have to put in some real work, some real effort here. Following a recipe is easy, execution of steps 1 through n is easy. But actually building everything from scratch, that's a real challenge. It completely frees you from any and all burdens, but at the same time everything is up to you. Because everything really *is* up to you.

Thank you everyone.

Guru Fateh!

you are 100% right ji,

Guru Ji says Look Within and you will find Him...

How you look 'Within' is your path..unique to you...just be in the moment..and if your heart is calling out, you will utter whatever He wants you to utter, and the heavens will open up before you (literally)


God bless you on your journey
 
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