Sukhmani Sahib Astpadi 1 Sabad 1 / ਸੁਖਮਨੀ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਅਸਟਪਦੀ ੧ ਸਬਦ ੧

[Ambarsaria]

Bhagat Singh Veer ji some comments.

Ambarsaria ji,
I thought you wanted people to respond to your interpretations of Sukhmani Sahib since you desired to be corrected when wrong.

Veer let us be honest. Anytime something is said about other religions and the stuff like vedas, idols, re-incarnation, and other aspects with little to no value in Sikhism, you get triggered and so do Bagga ji. What am I supposed to take from it when Guru ji has debunked all this is empty rituals, lack of solutions, lack of guidance of the true creator and creation in such. I try to keep things as straight as I can but I am limited in doing positive versus fighting this negative attacks on Sikhism, no matter how camouflaged or sugar coated or hidden.

Guru ji have repeatedly stated the falsehood of external rituals, samadhis, and all other funky stuff. If one wants to persist that is a personal choice and no one can force anyone. If it is to mislead and justify as a Sikhism and SGGS vouched way, then Sikhs need to stand up and be counted.

Now when I felt you were mistaken with your understanding of dhyan, jap, simran etc, I responded.

I respect your intellect and I have sensed a change towards meditative close your eyes as a way equivalent to what SGGS states. This is false and your choice but not what SGGS teaches or our Guru ji teach.

When I felt that you were mistaken with your understanding of the place of Vedas, etc in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, I responded again.

Veer there is no special place for vedas in SGGS in spite of what you may conjecture. There are misleading translations and I could not help if you want to use those shoulders to shoot from. Guru ji did not start Sikhism because Vedas and other stuff was leading people the right way. It was the reverse. These led people and the exploiters to mislead and create divides. Hence Sikhism and SGGS.

If you are going to simply shrug it off with "you sound like this other person(s) I dislike" or "you are defending this other person(s) I dislike" or "you are falling in a ditch, playing with mud" etc then so be it, I will not respond to your posts again.

Veer I pay attention to circumstances and relationships and triggers for posts. I am not 100% right but I cannot ignore obvious collusion or re-activeness in some responses. This being specially true if it is potentially going to mislead or misrepresent Sikhism to the gullible or young. If I make errors I will take note. Be upfront let me know what brought you into this Astpadi 1 and Sabad if it was not the following post from me,

http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/interfaith-dialogues/33304-gayatri-mantra-10.html#post159252

Sat Sri Akal.

 

[BhagatSingh]

Ambarsaria ji,
It is not as you think. I ask for your forgiveness if I have hurt you. However, I do not apologize for my views.

I did write a big response to your post but I did not post it as I don't feel you are up for a discussion right now. You are currently having issues with Prakash Singh ji (as you are constantly bringing him up even though he has nothing to do with this discussion) that you need to resolve first. Good luck with it. When you are up for it let me know as I am always ready for such discussions.

Satsriakal

 

[ravneet_sb]

Sat Sri Akaal,

There is bondage of religion/time/relation/region etc.

Maya effects and impacts.

One states what one can see on back of mind,

What one reveals one relates.

To reveal to other is not so easy, there is bondage.

One can not be out of it.

Read listen with an open mind, closed hard gates reflect back,

Through clear glass, one realise self and see what others reveal.

To clear one self is not so easy.

Through clear perception

"I" HERE MEANS "EGO" OR SHALL BE READ AS INSIDE OUT,
WHICH REFLECTS,
OR
ANY ONE WHO READ IT, IT'S OWN SELF
IT BELONGS NOT TO WRITER BUT AS READER'S SELF

I know self
I know other's self
I know how other's reflect my self.

Treat the way, we expect to be treated.
Our action (thought/speech and physical) reflects back,

Clear one's perception.


Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa
Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh:sippingcoffee::sippingcoffee:

 

[Ambarsaria]

Sat Sri Akaal,

There is bondage of religion/time/relation/region etc.

Maya effects and impacts.

One states what one can see on back of mind,

What one reveals one relates.

To reveal to other is not so easy, there is bondage.

One can not be out of it.

Read listen with an open mind, closed hard gates reflect back,

Through clear glass, one realise self and see what others reveal.

To clear one self is not so easy.

Through clear perception

"I" HERE MEANS "EGO" OR SHALL BE READ AS INSIDE OUT,
WHICH REFLECTS,
OR
ANY ONE WHO READ IT, IT'S OWN SELF
IT BELONGS NOT TO WRITER BUT AS READER'S SELF

I know self
I know other's self
I know how other's reflect my self.

Treat the way, we expect to be treated.
Our action (thought/speech and physical) reflects back,

Clear one's perception.


Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa
Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh:sippingcoffee::sippingcoffee:

ravneet_sb ji I am on the record with my translation or understanding. Your sermons of truisms are good but irrelevant.

Become a good person and translate for once. Same goes for Bhagat Singh ji, Taranjeet Singh ji, and any others with thoughts.

Preaching and throwing stones is easy, I have done the stone throwing myself at times and I knowingly do that. I really do not need you to point that out to me.

Sat Sri Akal.

 

[ravneet_sb]

Sat Sri Akaal,

Ambarsaria Ji,

All thought's are welcome.

Thought's are seed of action and
and are sown hidden and protected to reap.
But seed causes fruit to appear.

One can know self thought's

but can know other's thought
as reflected through one's action of speech, writtings or physical actions

Stone throwing has root thought behind action

One throw stone during rainy season in mud and muck,
Softly and gently so that humans can walk through
and have comfort of walk through without getting soil and spoil

Some throw stone for mud play

Some throw stone to damage the body
Some throw stone to quench the thirst of thirsty crow.

Purpose is give by root thought behind the action

It's definete stone throwing is being done
But the root thought only one own's self is aware

So one sow's, so one reap's
One shall not worry of action of other's.
Any one's way of expression
Just express.

If preaching is compared or equated to stone throwing
It's not for damage, but for betterment of people.

"GURU's BANI" preaches self assesment and correction.

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa
Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

 

[ravneet_sb]

Ambarsaria Ji,

Veer there is no special place for vedas in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji in spite of what you may conjecture. There are misleading translations and I could not help if you want to use those shoulders to shoot from. Guru ji did not start Sikhism because Vedas and other stuff was leading people the right way. It was the reverse. These led people and the exploiters to mislead and create divides. Hence Sikhism and Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji.



This is true for all research program. Most of the research is initiated with positive
thought.

But nothing exist only as positive,
negative comes with positive as part of true nature.
Be it ved, kuran and so on.

These text were to guide people, but few from them who got awareness, exploited also.

Education be it religion, doctors, engineers, lawyers, chartered accountants etc
fall prey of negativity, and they use education to exploit people.

This is nature and natural.

So ved, kuran, was not problem to "Guru's". They way knowledge was exploited by Brahmins was real concern.

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa
Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

 

[Harry Haller]

what "meditative way" are you talking about besides this - "reminder to me that everything I have, everything I see, everything I feel, has Creator in it"?

It is like so: A blacksmith is asked whether he uses a hammer to shape his metal, and he replies "No, I don't use a hammer. I use this blunt tool that is composed of a lump of metal joined to the end of a wooden handle. Definitely not a hammer though." Lol

Bhagat Singhji,

I am talking about thoughts and intenal discussion, you are talking about changing the state of your mind to achieve a different level of conciousness, they are two very different states brother.

 

[Ambarsaria]

Bhagat Singhji,

I am talking about thoughts and intenal discussion, you are talking about changing the state of your mind to achieve a different level of conciousness, they are two very different states brother.

Harry Haller veer ji some comments. Your above post so befits your Avatar. lol

It appears like a difference between a night (meditation) and day (living). Getting into a cocoon (meditation) versus world is your oyster (living). It is like putting the mind on a rinse cycle (meditation) versus nourishing a relevant mind (living). It is like theory (meditation) versus practice (living). It is like Hinduism (meditation) versus Sikhism (living). It is LaLa land (meditation) versus real (living). It is funky (meditation) versus normal (living).

Guru ji focused on living a practical life in understanding of the creator and creation.

Sat Sri Akal.

 

[Harry Haller]

Ambarsariaji,

whilst it is true,the state of mind whilst meditating, reminds me of my days spent in a haze of drugs, which is possibly one reason I cannot get on with it, if others find it an arena within they can achieve something positive then it is not for us to judge another or challenge interpretations that have been around for centuries.

I personally prefer the arena of a focused and alert mind, but each to his own

 

[Ambarsaria]

Ambarsariaji,

whilst it is true,the state of mind whilst meditating, reminds me of my days spent in a haze of drugs, which is possibly one reason I cannot get on with it, if others find it an arena within they can achieve something positive then it is not for us to judge another or challenge interpretations that have been around for centuries.

I personally prefer the arena of a focused and alert mind, but each to his own

Veer Harry Haller ji I am also OK with each to their own.

The only issue that I generally contest is the notion that it is part of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji teachings where as Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji is teaching always aware state as the way to be in consonance.

Cheers,

Sat Sri Akal.

 

[BhagatSingh]

what "meditative way" are you talking about besides this - "reminder to me that everything I have, everything I see, everything I feel, has Creator in it"?

It is like so: A blacksmith is asked whether he uses a hammer to shape his metal, and he replies "No, I don't use a hammer. I use this blunt tool that is composed of a lump of metal joined to the end of a wooden handle. Definitely not a hammer though." Lol

Bhagat Singhji,

I am talking about thoughts and intenal discussion, you are talking about changing the state of your mind to achieve a different level of conciousness, they are two very different states brother.

No I am talking about that in whichthere is a thought and discussion or an experience of altered consciousness, the One who has the thought or altered state. Knowing that one and being it is a direct "reminder to me that everything I have, everything I see, everything I feel, has Creator in it".

 

[ravneet_sb]

Sat Sri Akaal,

If reading appears as abject on mind, and object what appears as imagination appears as reality, is TRUTH.

Reading is false, listening is false, and imaginary, if objective not appears to mind and one cannot sense in real.

"GURU's BANI" is realised "Truth".

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa
Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

 

[Harry Haller]

No I am talking about that in whichthere is a thought and discussion or an experience of altered consciousness, the One who has the thought or altered state. Knowing that one and being it is a direct "reminder to me that everything I have, everything I see, everything I feel, has Creator in it".

just how many people have doctors permission for medicinal cannabis these days

lol

 

[Ambarsaria]

No I am talking about that in whichthere is a thought and discussion or an experience of altered consciousness, the One who has the thought or altered state. Knowing that one and being it is a direct "reminder to me that everything I have, everything I see, everything I feel, has Creator in it".

Veer Bhagat Singh ji perhaps better statement instead of "has Creator in it" is "is of the one creator and one creation".

What you think?

Sat Sri Akal.

 

[BhagatSingh]

Harry Ji,
Me thinks you are the only one here.


They mean the same thing Ambarsaria ji. If you believe "Sab gobind hai sab gobind hai gobind bin nahi koi" everything is creator, has creator and is of creator.