The Janeus We Wear

[seeker3k]

Gyani Ji,

I never said Nanak was ordinary man. He was very observant person. He traveled lot. In the travel he met lot of people and he discussed with many people. From the child hood his thinking was leaned to ward spirituality. People who are into spirituality are not ordinary people. Nanak was also logical person. He reasoned every thing what he saw and heard. He was not interested in business. He was also not interested in work. He was good writer. But he was not God as many people claim. This is not insult to Nanak. He never claimed that he was Guru. So why we are making him Guru? I have the highest respect for Nanak in the world. There was no other that used common sense and logic. I am trying to live my life according to Nanak’s teaching. Things I say are hurting them so they get anger with me. That’s what happened to Nanak. He told the truth and people stoned him and called me kurahia, lost person. But he never wavers from his ideals. If we stop making him God and just follow his teaching we will be happy and can have peace.
Peace is from inside not from out side. No matter what we do or what we wear or what religion we adopt we will not have peace. Only live according to his teaching.
I am sorry if I offended some one.

seeker

 

[seeker3k]

Tejwant Singh Ji,

There is some information about me in my introduction. You can look in it. If you need more I can give you more info about my self. That information is just little bit. I did not feel to write all then. Let me know
My email is truth3k@gmail.com

seeker

 

[harbansj24]

Seeker3k ji,

You are right when you say that at the age of 13, I could not have revolted against my parents. But the person I am talking about, I know him for the last 4 decades and I have no reason not to believe that he could not have done what he told me he did.

For a person of Guru Nanak ji caliber, I have not heard of anyone from any faith (leave alone Sikhs) doubting that he could not have refused to wear the janeu. I do not understand why you insist that it would have been impossible for a person like Guru Nanak to have refused such a simple thing.

Regarding prescription of rituals by Guru Nanak, of co{censored} he did not prescribe any. He didn't need to . He was only advocating a simple philosophy of life. At his time Sikhism was not institutionalized. Now, let alone religion, any system that is institutionalised needs to have a prescribed system for it to operate. These systems are subject to ammendments as per requirement for it to continue to be operational.

So for Sikhism also to continue meaningfully, its systems have to under continuous critical examination to prevent it from being fossilized. But system it must have. Privately you can follow Guru Nanak's philosophy without being called a Sikh. But if wish to be a part of a organised religious group called as Sikhs then you have be a part of a system which has Gurudwaras, has a congregation known as Sangat with certain relevant and current rules and regulations.

These rules and systems are under continues critical examination. For example at present the Sikh Rehat Maryada is under critical examination regarding its relevance in the presnt form under changed situation. It is likely to undergo a change in future. But a Rehat Maryada has to be in place if Sikh religion is to continue as an organised instituition.

 

[seeker3k]

Dear Harbansj24

To help your ego I agree with your Nanak protested and refused to wear janeo.

seeker

 

[Gyani Jarnail Singh]

Dear Harbansj24

To help your ego I agree with your Nanak protested and refused to wear janeo.

seeker

seeker ji,

such condescending language doesnt help communication...or promote learning...we ALL have "EGO"..and no one can help or hinder except OURSELVES with GURPARSAAD..gurus kirpa only...
No offense em ant or implied...just my 2 cents worth...

 

[Tejwant Singh]

Tejwant Singh Ji,

There is some information about me in my introduction. You can look in it. If you need more I can give you more info about my self. That information is just little bit. I did not feel to write all then. Let me know
My email is truth3k@gmail.com

seeker

Seeker3k ji,

Guru Fateh.

Thanks for the response but it does not tell me anything. I did go to your profile and found the following:

BiographyBorn in sikhism.But I am seeking the truth.Can you please elaborate what you mean by your statement about your biography?

Do you mean that Sikhi does not let one seek the truth? Why not and what suggestions would you have for a person to seek the truth and share its modus operandi with us, if you do not mind?


Then you said something to your post to Gyani ji which aroused my curiousity. I do apologise for piggy back riding on it but as you know very well the meaning of the word Sikh is a student, a learner, a seeker and I need your help in understanding what you stated in your the following remarks:

But he was not God as many people claim. This is not insult to Nanak.

Who claims Guru Nanak to be God? Please share with us. Has anyone in this thread did that?

He never claimed that he was Guru. So why we are making him Guru?

What does the word Guru mean for you?

I agree. None of our Gurus claimed themselves to be Gurus. In fact they did not even give themselves any names nor any titles in the SGGS, our ONLY GURU. They gave themselves just numbers and that is not only their greatness but their wonderful vision which they shared with us in SGGS.

And that vision is to get rid of Me-ism. That is the reason in my opinion they did not care about names, titles, their autobiographies which they would have easily written if they desired so.

I have the highest respect for Nanak in the world. There was no other that used common sense and logic. I am trying to live my life according to Nanak’s teaching.

I am glad that you are following the path of Guru Nanak. We are all told to emulate our Gurus rather than putting them on some pedestal and hence creating a distance. Our Gurus were our mates. They spoke to the world on our behalf.

Things I say are hurting them so they get anger with me.That’s what happened to Nanak. He told the truth and people stoned him and called me kurahia, lost person. But he never wavers from his ideals. If we stop making him God and just follow his teaching we will be happy and can have peace.

Pardon my ignorance but I am a bit confused with your above claim. Who is hurting and who is angry at you and why? Has someone stoned you too? Who called you kurahia, lost person and for what reasons?

This forum is the perfect venue for all of us who want to share our things what we have/ cultivated within.

So, please share with us.

Thanks & Regards

Tejwant Singh

 

[spnadmin]

harbhansj ji

You seem to be saying that we need to act consciously and with evaluation within the framework (i.e., SRM) in order to preserve the idea of rational action. And we can change the framework, but also in a rational way (conscious thought with evaluation). But to just toss out the framework leaves every man and woman to himself/herself and then belief cannot be shared and a path is not longer a path but a washed out road full of chaos.

 

[harbansj24]

Narayanjot ji,

You have put it concisely and precisely.

 

[seeker3k]

Dear Harbans Ji

As I said that I was born in Sikhism. I left India 50 years ago. I do not have a religion. I am spiritual person.
What more information you need? And how cans my past will help you? It is not the part I dwell I live in the present. I have no information about you or any others who write here. And I will not look at the information of the people who write. This site is to share ideas not information about one self. People get clouded by the person’s past.

Yes I was kicked out of Ashrams Gurdwaras Manders for asking the questions. No one hit me. Only place I was not kicked out was church. Once I talked with them for hours. No one got angry. You can see in the writing I use then name Nanak Sikhs get angery. They want me to say Guru Nanak Dev ji. Not just Nanak. If you read your writing you also write Guru Nanak ji. A many people reading are upset that I use only Nanak. And I write granth which it not acceptable to Sikhs. If we can not see that it is book of good writing and it is not a living person then how can you move forward? I am not here to make people change. The change comes from with in. All the religion says that kingdom of God is in you. Jot saroop. How do we go in and find out. Is there can opner that we can use it to go inside to find that Jot?
Guru and chela is both way street not just one way. Both have to accept each other. Here we are accepting granth our guru, guru not accepting us as chela. How is guru kirpa come to play part in this case? Only the living person can do kirpa not a book or stone.

All the writing of Nanak and others in the granth emphasizes on guru. With out guru can not be saved and get the enlighten. If that is true then who was Nanak’s guru? Nanak praised guru every writing how can he praise guru if he did not had guru?

There are writing posted in this forum that claim, Nanak as God and scientist. You can look it up.

What does this mean it is in granth, sil pther me jantu pai? If you brake stone there in no jeev in that stone. No one has found it yet.

I am not an educated person as you can tell in my writing.
seeker

 

[Gyani Jarnail Singh]

Dear Seeker Ji...This Introduction reveals the REAL seekr...
and makes so many things clear...You were born a Sikh..and now prefer something else..the "Church" people are not that goody two shoes...they have actually BURNT entire Churches FULL of Blacks INSIDE !! So far i have not come across any Sikhs who set fire to a "Gurdwara full of...." So Its all a MATTER of PERSONAL Experience. I too was born a sikh..but from Day one as early as age two i was sent to a Catholic Church Kindergarten/Nursery..which was nearby to the GURDWARA where my dad was Granthi and my Mum was Punjabi Teacher...I attedned the Catholic School till I was 20 Years old Higher School Ceritificate Class..and I was "taught" the Bible much more than the SGGS..BUT..I never felt at nay age that I was Out of Place with my Joorra..and then Puggh..and the Long hair which sometimes came unopened during play..never for a moment i "hated my hair or wanted to cut it"...I GREW up in a "CHURCH" environment..and came to KNOW HOW MUCH HATE they have....hatred of the Satan..that is in the Jehovahs wittnesses..in the Lutherans..in the Seventh day Adventists....the SATAN is EVERYWHERE...except in their "OWN DENOMINATION" !! You talked to the Church people a few hours..i talked to them and lived with them for 20 years...and i Became a STAUNCHER SINGH. I attended services of ALL the Churches mentioned above..I went through the World Bible Course ( ANYTHING FREE I TOOK !! he he he) and Passed with Flying colours !! Yet I remained a SINGH !!

Just a minor point...
Sil pathar mein jant UPAI....
Just google up and watch a documentary about Earth's development...you will SEE how "STONES" grew out of the Boiling Lava Flows in the Oceans more than 2 billion years ago...These look like stones, behave like stones..but are LIVING CREATURES...

Churches have no words of "respect"...Jesus is merely Jesus..to those who RESPECT HIM, LOVE HIM..and for those who HATE HIM..DESPISE HIM..its the same "JESUS". We Sikhs however due tot he Indian Environment have the respect words like JI, Sahib etc added. IF one doesnt LIKE it..no body forces anyone to add JI...but those who Love and respect Nanak like to call Him Guru nanak ji..Sahib..Maharaj...all are essentially just words...I too refert o Jesus as Jesus JI when I talk about him to a Punjabi Christian..simply because i understand the langauge/environemnt..BUT strangely the Punjabi Christians too DISCARD the JI..simply because their Church people DONT USE IT...why would I get angry ?? I too then STOP saying JI to Jesus...

 

[Sikh royalist]

i remember the day i was in a conversation with my friend who is a Hindu Brahman he was telling me that the man who wears a janeu(janjua in Punjabi) becomes indestructible and he will not die even if some one tried to kill him or even nature cannot kill him. i was thinking who can tell him that my Guru sacrificed his life to save their belief who? but i was not the one if the one who did the sacrifice never made them realize what he has done for them why should i being his follower at least.

i think the only janeu which a Sikh is expected to wear physically is a kripan which at last protects us at every time and in every situation and the janeu our soul must wear is the faith in our Guru so that we may never get away from the path of our Guru.

 

[seeker3k]

Now we know about each other. All I see hate for the christian.
If that is the life you want to live, good for you.

seeker

 

[Gyani Jarnail Singh]

Now we know about each other. All I see hate for the christian.
If that is the life you want to live, good for you.

seeker

Completely WRONG. You Dont know me at all.
IF i "hated" Christians...i wouldnt be celebrating Christmas even more than Vasakhi as i have more christian friends than sikh friends...in a year i attend more christian weddings in churches than i attend anand karajs in Gurdwaras..

I am perfectly satisfied with the LIFE I live..I am SAFE in my Faith in the Religion is was BORN into..and can still ENJOY the religion i grew up with..and Live my life happily knowing I am SAFE with BOTH feet in One BOAT. I am NOT LOST.
Chardeekalla friend..go on SEEKING..and you "may" find...but i doubt it becasue what you seek is INSIDE YOU...but you look OUTSIDE..

 

[seeker3k]

Tejwant Ji,

Do you mean that Sikhi does not let one seek the truth? Why not and what suggestions would you have for a person to seek the truth and share its modus operandi with us, if you do not mind?

All the religions will not let the person to question what they are doing. And why they are doing the rituals. They just want you to believe what they say. Try question when the bhai ji is preaching in gurdwara. Yet the same bhai ji criticize other religions. Person has to be in touch with himself. Go with in?

Who claims Guru Nanak to be God? Please share with us. Has anyone in this thread did that?
There is thread posted here. But I don’t know who posted it.You have to look it up
There is one sant called Blandpuri He live in Blandpur. I think in distt of Ludhiana. I maybe wrong for the location. His CD’s are distributed in Canada. In one of the CD he claim that nirakar was born in Nanka’s body. Their centers are all over in Canada.

What does the word Guru mean for you?

Guru word was in use before Nanak was born. It is Sanskrit word. Person who shed the darkness is guru. It was never from a stone or book. Guru has to be living person. There are many many reference about guru in the granth. If we read and understand it then we can see what it mean. In one place it says if there are 100 moons and 1000 suns, it still be dark with out guru. If nanak meant the garnth to be guru don’t you think he should have completed it by him self and told us to worship it. Yet he did not do that, why? Even Arjandev called it pothy. Not guru. You can continue to believe that Gobibd Singh told us to believe granth as guru. There is no real evidence that he said it. Even he said it read the sloke and understand what it is saying.

And that vision is to get rid of Me-ism. That is the reason in my opinion they did not care about names, titles, their autobiographies which they would have easily written if they desired so.

No one believes in second best. His religion is the number 1 others are false. If that is not me-ism then what is?

I am glad that you are following the path of Guru Nanak. We are all told to emulate our Gurus rather than putting them on some pedestal and hence creating a distance. Our Gurus were our mates. They spoke to the world on our behalf

So called your guru never spoke to the world on your behalf. No one knew them that time. Just few people that’s all. It is our ego to make them bigger then human. There is more writing of sants and fakirs then the guru. But we don’t ever hear too much about them. The granth looks like copy and paste book. And now we claim it is ours. Who are we to claim it is ours. Is that not ego? We celebrate few of the guru’s BD or Death. Never of any sants who contributed more then gurus. If you read the writing of some guru it looks like they copy it from others. Compare Nanak and Arjan’ bani with Kabir.

Things I say are hurting them so they get anger with me.That’s what happened to Nanak. He told the truth and people stoned him and called me kurahia, lost person. But he never wavers from his ideals. If we stop making him God and just follow his teaching we will be happy and can have peace.
Pardon my ignorance but I am a bit confused with your above claim. Who is hurting and who is angry at you and why? Has someone stoned you too? Who called you kurahia, lost person and for what reasons?

Are you not angry with me? Do you like what I wrote? People don’t wish to know the truth. Truth always hurt.

If as Sikhs claim we have grand as guru then why are we celebrating gurus who have been dead for long time. Dead can not help. It is like we are worshiping the ghosts. We do it because we need to do some thing like Hindus are doing but in different name
I will be happy to give you more information.

seeker

 

[Gyani Jarnail Singh]

seeker ji..are you trying to make me angry? Tejwants ji angry ?? if so you are not succeeding because you have got the wrong kind of sikh here. We are the ones who QUESTION...as our Guru taught us..Kicchh kaheayeh..kichh sunneah....Uttar deejeh Ros na keejeh...say..ask..give answers..dont get annoyed...is GURU NANAK.
TU Sultan kahoon hun meian teri kawan wadayee...if you call the MOON a piece of rock..it still remaisn the MOON..shining orb of light in the darkness...calling GURU NANAK..simply nanak arjan etc doesnt demean them in any way..doesnt take away their GREATNESS an iota...you mentioend sants like bulandpuriah..etc..those are the types who will get "angry"
the Most UNIVERSAL GRANTH that contains ONLY LOVE of the Creator by Varied persons looks like a "cut and paste" job to you...I ma sure you think GOD must have written the Ten Commandments on Stone Tablets..with Lightning..or that the Original Koran in GOLD is in Heaven under lock and key..or the Bible is one beautiful piece of work written by GOD himself at one sitting..well go on..enjoy those ORIGINAL WORKS..and leave the Cut and Paste badly done job well alone...its greatness doesnt go down one iota. No one can make a purse out of sow's ear..BUT then again No sows ear should be used to make a purse....the GRANTH is PARAS that makes other Parases...

TRUTH only HURTS those who are FALSE. The TRUTHFUL love TRUTH...Sach Sunaisee SACH ki BELA....Truthful Living is always higher than TRUTH...

 

[Tejwant Singh]

Seeker3k ji,

Guru Fateh.

Thanks for the post.Please bear with me because your posts have aroused lots of interesting questions in my mind and I am sure I am going to learn a lot from your wisdom.

My post:
"Do you mean that Sikhi does not let one seek the truth? Why not and what suggestions would you have for a person to seek the truth and share its modus operandi with us, if you do not mind?"

Your response:

All the religions will not let the person to question what they are doing. And why they are doing the rituals. They just want you to believe what they say. Try question when the bhai ji is preaching in gurdwara. Yet the same bhai ji criticize other religions. Person has to be in touch with himself. Go with in?

Can you please elaborate what you mean by the above? Pardon my ignorance but it is a bit confusing for me to grasp what you are trying to say.

First of all, for me Sikhi is not a religion but a pragmatic way of life and as you must know that Sikh only means one thing- a student, a seeker, a learner.

I have no idea which Bhai ji you are talking about. I have questioned all kinds of Bhai jis, Kirtan walas, Kathavachaks and have interacted with them for a very long time and have happened to learn a lot from this experience.

Sikhi is based on questioning. It may depend how the questions are asked, perhaps. So, I would like you to give me a particular instance in your life which made you upset when you asked the questions to Bhai Sahib. We can all learn from that. I agree with you that Sachkhand is found within but that goes for all of us.

My post:
"Who claims Guru Nanak to be God? Please share with us. Has anyone in this thread did that?"

Your response:

There is thread posted here. But I don’t know who posted it.You have to look it up
There is one sant called Blandpuri He live in Blandpur. I think in distt of Ludhiana. I maybe wrong for the location. His CD’s are distributed in Canada. In one of the CD he claim that nirakar was born in Nanka’s body. Their centers are all over in Canada.

It is you who claimed the above, so it is your duty to show it and share your own opinion regarding this. I hope you would do that.

My post:

"What does the word Guru mean for you?"

Your response:

Guru word was in use before Nanak was born. It is Sanskrit word. Person who shed the darkness is guru. It was never from a stone or book.

Yes, the word GURU was used long before Guru Nanak's time. It means a teacher or a learning tool. Seeker ji, please share with us if you have learnt any thing from the books that were part of your school studies.

Do you learn anything from watching the nature that one gets awestruck with?

Have you learnt anything through any other way besides a person as a Guru? Please share with us. We can all learn from you.

Guru has to be living person.

As you claim above that Guru has to be a living Guru, can you please share with us who your living Guru is.

There are many many reference about guru in the granth. If we read and understand it then we can see what it mean. In one place it says if there are 100 moons and 1000 suns, it still be dark with out guru. If nanak meant the garnth to be guru don’t you think he should have completed it by him self and told us to worship it. Yet he did not do that, why? Even Arjandev called it pothy. Not guru. You can continue to believe that Gobibd Singh told us to believe granth as guru. There is no real evidence that he said it. Even he said it read the sloke and understand what it is saying.

Please forgive me for my ignorance once again as I am still learning things in life.

Can you please elaborate what you are trying to say above for my better understanding because I do not want to misunderstand what you are trying to convey?

My post:

"And that vision is to get rid of Me-ism. That is the reason in my opinion they did not care about names, titles, their autobiographies which they would have easily written if they desired so."

No one believes in second best. His religion is the number 1 others are false. If that is not me-ism then what is?

Pardon my ignorance but what is that to do with my post? Can you please elaborate it for me?

My post:
"I am glad that you are following the path of Guru Nanak. We are all told to emulate our Gurus rather than putting them on some pedestal and hence creating a distance. Our Gurus were our mates. They spoke to the world on our behalf."

Your response:

So called your guru never spoke to the world on your behalf. No one knew them that time. Just few people that’s all. It is our ego to make them bigger then human. There is more writing of sants and fakirs then the guru. But we don’t ever hear too much about them. The granth looks like copy and paste book. And now we claim it is ours. Who are we to claim it is ours. Is that not ego? We celebrate few of the guru’s BD or Death. Never of any sants who contributed more then gurus. If you read the writing of some guru it looks like they copy it from others. Compare Nanak and Arjan’ bani with Kabir

Once again I do not understand what you are trying to say in your post above. Please elaborate with examples.

As you mentioned above that you believe in a living Guru and hopefully your will share his/her name with us and share with us what you have learnt from him/her so far.

Let us say for the sake of the argument that if your living Guru dies, then you unlearn everything that he/she taught you when he/she was alive? Can you shed some light on this thought process of yours?

Things I say are hurting them so they get anger with me.That’s what happened to Nanak. He told the truth and people stoned him and called me kurahia, lost person. But he never wavers from his ideals. If we stop making him God and just follow his teaching we will be happy and can have peace.

My post:

"Pardon my ignorance but I am a bit confused with your above claim. Who is hurting and who is angry at you and why? Has someone stoned you too? Who called you kurahia, lost person and for what reasons?"

Your response:

Are you not angry with me? Do you like what I wrote? People don’t wish to know the truth. Truth always hurt.

It seems that you are presuming too much and prejudging me without any reasons. Does your living Guru teach you to prejudge others without any basis?

Show me where in my post have I expressed my anger towards you?

What made you jump to this conclusion? I do not find any reasons to be angry at you, hence I am interacting with you so I can learn the truth from a fellow Sikh. And No, you are wrong, Our Gurus have taught us that truth never hurts but it enlightens us and acts like a balm on our internal and sometimes self created wounds.

No, I have no reason to get angry with you but as a Sikh, I can only learn by asking questions.

If as Sikhs claim we have grand as guru then why are we celebrating gurus who have been dead for long time. Dead can not help. It is like we are worshiping the ghosts. We do it because we need to do some thing like Hindus are doing but in different name

So, please share with us who you living Guru is and what you have learnt from him/her.

I will be happy to give you more information.

I would love to have all the information I have asked you in details so I can learn from you. So, please do not hesitate to respond in an elaborate manner for all of my queries.

As I said before, I hope to learn a lot from you.

Thanks & Regards

Tejwant Singh

 

[seeker3k]

Gyani Ji,

Now the true color shows. Instead replying to what I asked you accused me of the things I never said. I thought we should reply to the topic at hand. I never wrote about ten commandments nor about the bible. Never said any thing about kuran or islam. Mulim is not a religion. So there is nothing to write about muslims.
I know every thing about bible and jesus and Mohamed. Nothing is what is claimed by them. It is we who are falling victim of the false preaching. And we are corrupting what Nanak said and lived.
This the lowest of low to accuse some who is asking question. This is what I said all along that Sikhs can not discuss. The only way one can say his religion is the best in the world is to discuss their belief.
I can claim that my father was the greatest wrestler in Punjab.(he was wrestler) But what are the rest of the people of Punjab are saying? Does any one recognize that he was the best? Is there any proof that my father never lost? If there is no proof then I can not claim what I am claming. We have to put every thing on the table and let the intellectuals examine.
You can see on TV there is some thing discussed about Jesus. In favor and against him. There are open discussion going on. No one is accusing the producers. There was one producer made the documentary about the way Muslim treat women. The producer was shot. Kala Afgana wrote and question about baba budha blessing the wife of Arjan Dev. He was kicked out the whole Sikh community.
Now I ask the question and you getting angry and claim that you are not angry. Only the frustrated angry person accuses the one who is asking question.

If you don’t like they way I ask question then you have the right to take me off the membership list. And ban my questions. So that other Sikhs can not be cotupted by my thoughts.

seeker

 

[Gyani Jarnail Singh]

seeker ji, you assume too much.

1.I DONT ban/UNBAN anyone. I have already said..i follow Gubani that says..kichh kaheayh,,kichh sunneah..ros na keejeh uttar deejeh...but you still go on jumping to wrong concluisons and assuming...

2. NO one has been Banned from SPN for asking questions...show proof or retract this false accusation. Whoever was "banned" was warned for using vulgarity/abusive langauge/or spamming or insulting the Gurus/srm/sikh panth/gurmatt...and when they persist they are removed. ASKING QUESTIONS is our Cornerstone..SPN exists to ENABLE posters to...ask questions and provide ANSWERS.

I leave you with Tejwant Ji to interact as tejwant ji has the knack of answering you better.
:happysingh:

 

[spnadmin]

seeker3k ji

I have to step in here at the risk of agitating you or anyone else in the conversation. Forgive me if I am interrupting the flow of thought. However this conversation is getting very difficult to follow. And seeker3k ji -- no one is even thinking of banning you or dismissing your point of view. The problem is that many of us are having a hard time making the same connections that you are making from point to point.

It would help if you would re-group as they say in the military. Pull in and re-organize your argument. We would like to be able to follow what you are saying. It has nothing to do with your English which is better than you think.

Please restate your thinking on the following points. Don't explain but just restate and then maybe we can put the rest of it together.

Here are the points

1. Your understanding of Guru Nanak as a human being and as a leader of the Sikh panth.

2. Your understanding of Guru Nanak's contribution to spirituality.

3. Your understanding of Guru Nanak's way to union with the Creator.

4. Your understanding of the value of the shabads composed by Guru Nanak in leading others to a more truthful life.

That will do to start. It would really help a lot if you could just tell us what you think on each of those points.

 

[spnadmin]

Let's forget about the Janeau's for a post or two so we can understand seeker3k's basic ideas. Then we can get back to the question of blindly following cultural rituals and practices and Guru Nanak's stance in relation to all of that.