Transmigration Of Soul

[Amarpal]

Dear Sikh80 Ji,

Your post said:
'Since then in India the highest spiritual goal has been the release of thejivatma from the cycle of birth and death or avagaman (lit. coming and going)'

I have a doubt about it.

If this was the aim of human life, and assuming that all the beings achieve this goal, then no being will be left in this world. The animated creation of 'The Sat' will come to an end. Why 'The Sat' will seek dissolution of life in what 'The Sat' has created?

In this world capability wise Humans are next to God. We are born to further the cause of 'The Sat'; help evolve and preserve creation. I hold the voew that perpetual all round evolution is the will of God, we humans are the instruments of 'The Sat' of implimentation of the will of 'The Sat'.

I further hold the view that 'The Sat' does not directly intervenes in worldy affairs. Recoeded history and life of our Guru is proof of it. When Vedvyas wrote in Mahabharat that Lord Krishna will not use weapons, he was telling his readers that Gos doesnot intervenes directly in any ones worldly affairs; the worldly battles we have to fight ourselves. That is what our Gurus did.
'The Sat' is within us. When we awaken to this reality we loose 'I-ness' and then work as instrument of 'The Sat',working for the benefit of the creation of 'The Sat'. To sensetise his Sikhs towards this responsibility in Japji Sahib, Guru Sahib has included a shalok Pawn Guru Pani Pitta---------. I understand this shalok as a pledge to protect the creation of 'The Sat'.

I understand that working in a selfless manner for entire creation is ultimate aim of human form.

With love and respect for all.

Amarpal Singh

 

[Sikh80]

I have gone thru. your post time and again but could not relate to the values that I have learnt so far. My understanding about sikhi is totally different. You may have the views but these are yours and not necessarily those that are expounded in sikhi. It is summed up as follows:


quote
"The Spiritual philosophy expounded by the Gurbani (Sri Guru Granth Sahib) is monistic. It's primary goal is realizing one's complete identity with the Unconditioned Consciousness (Akaal Purakh or Supreme Reality), in perfect union and non-differentiation. This is termed realization of the Self, Turiya Avasthaa, Sunn Samaadhi, Nirvikalap Samaadhi, Sahaj Samaadhi, Divine Vision, Dasam Duaar, Nirvaana, and so on. This Spiritual experience of free and blissful state of our True Being can be attained in this very life, "here" and "now", granting the so-called liberation — permanent release from unenlightened existence or transmigration; final or eternal emancipation (Moksha or Mokh, Mukti, etc.). "Unquote


You may like to enlighten as to how the views as expressed by you would get fit in the macro level concept that is stated and acepted by many. You must be having very many reasons .Shall be grateful if told.



source: gurbani.org

 

[Amarpal]

Dear Sikh80 Ji,

I am nobody to explain what others have understood and accepted. I can only say what I have understood.

With love and respect for all.

Amarpal Singh

 

[drkhalsa]

Sikh80 Ji,

A glimpse of how we perceive truth.

We express ourselves thru our mind and physical body. The result is strife and dissappointments. Let us consider how we can conquer our mind and change our hearts. Man is composed of body, mind (intellect) and soul. We have to develop all around.

To achieve this end, we must have an ethical or moral life which is a stepping stone to spirituality. Guru Nanak said, "Victory over the mind is victory over the world."

If we direct our attention toward soul, we become spiritual; the result will be love and peace. When we liberate ourselves from the bondage mind and matter we find we are conscious entities— souls.

We are, as it were, drops of the ocean of life.Your souls are of God, give unto God. Only the mind asks the questions and is time bound.

Soul exists beyond the realm of matter, energy, time and space. All of mind's questions are within the dimension of time and space.

A man who was blind from birth underwent an eye operation, after which he could see. His first experience of space by sight was like as if everything he saw was touching him. He had no concept of distance thru sight.

Your questions, Sikh80 Ji, are also within the space-time continium therefore what you're reading now is also within the mind world. Of course, there are gifted people who can tell you events in this time-space continium about when soul gets entrapped in the mind world after leaving the ocean of the absolute. But your question requires a precise answer as to when does soul enter the physical body and before that where is it ? It's like asking when will it start raining and where will the first droplet reach the ground.

Everything works in a random way. Yes I know you need to feed your mind by giving it a visual map. So that you'll move forward and ask the next more difficult question, lol. There is no end to the questions, no matter how much knowledge is gained.

Life just is. No questions. Try this exercise if you're willing to. Sit in a comfortable chair and take a few deep breaths. Ease yourself on a sturdy but comfortable chair. Relax your body and still your mind as much as you can. You'll definitely come to the conclusion that it is not possible to still the mind. So try this exercise as follows:-

Silently say to yourself, within you :
I am soul, the divine spark of God.
I have a physical body but I know that I am not my body. My body can be in states of health or illness and I can observe its conditions. Since I can observe and perceive myself as a separate entity - it confirms that I am not my physical body.

I am soul, pure consciousness. I have feelings. I can observe my emotions which might be in states of happiness or sadness. But I know I am not my feelings. I am soul, the pure consciousness of God.

I have a mind. I know I am not the mind. The mind oftens refuses to obey me. Therefore I cannot be my mind. I am above the mind. I am in control. I am soul. I am my trueself, a drop of the ocean of my Creator.

Bhai Baljit Singh Namdhari - Mat Dekh Bhoola

Happy New Year 2008.

Sikh80,

Thank you for sharing. You are a real seeker who is going thru the same steps as every seeker does.
As seekers of truth, we find ourselves separated from the masses. Finding a true friend is rare. Loneliness is the universal feeling that increases the need to belong. You have the invisible friend with you always. In fact, you are God himself experiencing the journey thru this long silk road. Without you, nothing can exist. It is God's wish - who is beyond the realms of matter, energy, space and time - to experience Himself within this realm of MEST.

Why you're facing an ordeal now is because, once you step within the boundaries of space and time, there is a loss of memory. Therefore, you have programmed yourself to remind your ownself that the drama set in front of you is but an illusion -because there's a footnote saying, "God helping himself in his camping trip".

Anekh Hain Phir Ek Hai.

Mann Tu Jyot Swaroop Hai,
Apna Mool Pachaan.

More Later.

Santokh Singh
(Malaysia)

Dear Santokh ji

I read your above two posts . They were one of your best posts that I have read

If all you have written is from your own experience than you are really Blessed being !!

Cheers


Jatinder Singh

 

[Sikh80]

Dear Sikh80 Ji,

I am nobody to explain what others have understood and accepted. I can only say what I have understood.

With love and respect for all.

Amarpal Singh

Dear Amar ji,

It is ok. if you cannot explain. We will make out what Guru sahibaan have stated.

Regards
happy

 

[Amarpal]

Dear Sikh80 Ji,

You said 'It is ok. if you cannot explain. We will make out what Guru sahibaan have stated'.

What you had qouted in your earlier post was what persons have understood after considerable effort. They have reached somewhare in the path of spiritual evolution. I respect them. It is not fair for mr to put myself over and above them. For this reason I do not want to eleborate on what you have qouted. I just say what i have understood and leave it to the reader to do the rest. I do try not to argure in this forum. I keep it at discussion level where I say what I understand and provide clarification on what i have said. I read what others say and ask clarifiecations. I avoid arguments

With love and respect for all.

Amarpal Singh

 

[Sikh80]

Respected Sir,
There is no place for an argument if the discussion is serious. All that I have stated is that your views are slightly different from what an ordinary sikh would have interpolated. It was on this account that a request was made.
Regarding this thread it is believed that many of us are not even clear as to what Bani has to say on Transmigration or reincarnation both of which are entirely two poles apart.You may like to guide us.

 

[Ishna]

Amarpal ji's post #41 absolutely blew my mind. He has put into better words part of what I've been thinking about lately.

Some threads over the past few months about consonance and the physical world, about creation being an ever-changing manifestation of the Creative Force got me thinking about the universality of physical substance. When I die, the creative substance that is me will be reabsorbed as raw material into the creative soup. The carbon of my ashes will be scattered and form a countless number of other things, I can't comprehend. The physical stuff I am made from has been here since the beginning and will be here until the very end unimaginable. It is not MY stuff, it belongs to the Universe.

And that got me thinking about the intangible stuff on the inside, and I wondered about my soul and reincarnation, etc.

I read an article quoted earlier in the thread: Does Sikhism Believe in Reincarnation? by Baldev Singh Ji. I like his thinking!

However, I feel the thoughts are still incomplete. To quote from the article:

Besides, the Sikh Gurus rejected the notion of past life or the life after death, and made it abundantly clear that the present life is the only chance to realize God. For example: O my mind, my dear friend, this is the time for you to meet the Creator. Moreover, this opportunity will last only as long as the body is healthy and full of vitality. AGGS, M 1, p. 20 Take advantage of your birth as a human, this is your only opportunity to meet God. AGGS, M 5, p. 378 “Don’t look to the past, make efforts to make your future life successful by meeting God, because you won’t be born again,” says Nanak. AGGS, M 5, p. 1096 “You won’t be born again, take some measures to obtain salvation right now. Praising the Merciful One, will take you across the ocean of worldly temptations,” says Nanak. AGGS, M 9, p. 220

(I hope the tuks in the quote aren't breach of ToS - if they are let me know and I'll post the entire shabads, thanks)

My question then is:

If the soul is Creative Force, then who is supposed to be desperate to realise the Creative Force, and attain salvation? It's all Creative Force - there is nothing higher! Unless salvation is an experience of this human life, this collection of carbon molecules, and nothing beyond that. Gee it's hard to explain.

There is no separation... The immaterial creative force has gathered it's own material creative essence to form this body... the person that is me is part of the body and will expire with the body -- I myself the ego will cease to exist (and not go to heaven with all it's friends, as it would like to believe as it is selfish and self-preserving). The observer part of me is actually the creative force itself... which will become part of the greater light of itself once this body has expired...

So in fact "I" am nothing more than a product of my biology. Which is wonderful and glorious as an expression of creation, but it will cease to exist and then there is nothing left but Creative Essence. Whose to say the soul part of me isn't redistributed just like my carbon will be? Not as an entity, not as an ego-self, not as an identity, just like my carbon does not retain my identity...

I feel like my mind is treading a path of nullification lately.. like I'm coming upon the spiritual equivelant of atheism. It's hard to explain. When you think you can't tell the difference between where the creative force ends and YOU begin, or the other way around, there is nothing left.

*brain explodey smiley*

Do I make ANY sense? Even in my own mind I can only hold on to the coherancy of it for a second or two and then I'm confused again. Maybe someone who recognises these thought processes can give me a hand before I turn myself into a puff of air and disappear into the 1+1=0 infinite loop thingy I've got myself stuck in. icecreamkaur

I'm a bit worried about my world-view lately too - I took the Beliefnet Belief-O-Matic again the other day (as I do periodically) and apparently I'm more HINDU than I am SIKH! AAAAHHH!!!

 

[ravneet_sb]

SAT SRI AKAAL,

As Realisation,

Felt ego as hardisk. and there are many tracks.

These tracks are run by event of light.

When the focus of light (very fine micro laser) shift of track from one level to other,
one plane to other,

there is change in sound produced by voice box (Speakers).

body actions also changed as the dance tune has changed. Dance has chaged

As the way of body action also change.


This cycle of "Death" and "Birth"

is related to thought cycle not physical birth cycle.

But at fact plane once it comes it never goes like

"GURU's BANI"

thought of gravity

thought of elementary laws

But duality/ mistrust/ jealousy/ hatred/ keeps the thought taking bith and dying

Silence of these thoughts bring "PEACE"

Thought generating machine is silent and not tempting human voice box to produce sound

and one can experience "PEACE" hence "BLISS" Nothing Outside All Inside



One can not see inside, but realise,

Realisation can not be expressed as it is only self realisation

Yes what is revealed through realisation can be related and explained through simple anology.

As A WORD "MUSA PARADISICA" is read, written and imagined.

It can be realised if one has realised this word physically.

Otherwise it has to be related to "Banana" scientific name

To make common man understand

Bhul Chuk Maaf

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa
Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

 

[spnadmin]

ravneet_sb ji

please put your mind thoughts into the MATRIX so that in the future the seekers can tune into it. Thanks.

 

[ravneet_sb]

SAT SRI AKAAL,

It might be foolish of myself to ask,

MATRIX???

Kindly guide me so that I can maintain discipline in writting.

With

Warm Regards

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa
Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

 

[spnadmin]

It is a movie ravneet_sb ji. A very intriguing movie. Here is a link that tells about it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matrix_movie