Yogism Turbans And White Robes: The Latest Yoga Craze Is Kundalini

[harmanpreet singh]

Thanks all for giving your views , both sides have valid points .

in vid of feb 84 below Yogi bhajan talking abt his criticism , the cute kid in video is Gurumustak singh of Sikhnet.com ,video is really very inspiring ...


Yogi Bhajan Talk w/ Gurumustuk about India & Mothers (Feb 1984) - YouTube

 

[Tejwant Singh]

I was the same, i didn't understand what he was talking about nor understood its importance.

Can i explain it to you? i don't think i can, the true meaning of it occurs when you experience it...each line of Gurbani i;m finding is endless in its meaning dependent on the conscious awareness of the reader. Gurbani says we need to 'wake up'. it's talking about our consicousness which is still asleep following computer like generated thoughts/commands.

By 'thinking' he cannot be obtained or understood or 'known' ... thinking is a waste of life energy when its wandering in countless directions, it drains us and we are left with ideas, thoughts and limited understanding....so why think? Mind will always think...it lives by generating thoughts and creates our life experience...if mind stops working, the creation for us stops...so how can we stop thinking? Work it out Ji .. this is what the inner journey is all about (from my experience)...i can;t explain it to you nor show you how.

How can we obtain, experience our Creator without thought? is there a state of being or existence, in between thoughts..is there space in between thoughts? can we find that space, take our attention to it where thoughts no longer take hold of us where were are present in that divine moment where illusion of time no longer exists , in that moment, precise moment where god is forever present in pure stillness and tranquility?

Lets Enjoy the journey to finding this out, as i am

next line:
By remaining silent, there is still no silence...so even when we obtain that state where thoughts of past and future and present no longer pull our attention, consciousness and energy, deep in inner seeking and meditation where pure stillness is found, and yet there is still no silence...what a beautiful jewel of gurbani this is.

Something else is there...something else is listening, something else is talking, something else has a shabad ... seek it, have faith in it...fearless on this path.

Like Yogi Ji says...this is the formula...these two lines describe the whole of existance...the meaning just goes deeper and deeper the more you seek within....it just keeps on going and going deeper.Ego says "i have found the truth', yet the more we seek the more there is to discover about ourselves and God, endless, infinte...can we explain that? we can't...we just fall to our feet and surrender more and more to the wonder of God...Waheguru, Waheguru, Waheguru, Waheguru

I'm enjoying the seeking, i'm sure we all are.

God bless.

Chaz Singh ji,

Guru Fateh.

Before I say something regarding this post, I would like to second Harry ji about your true Sikhi behaviour.

For example, sunshine shines on a diamond the same way it shines on some rubbish. In the latter, you do not see the rubbish but the sunshine which is a commendable quality to have. Not very many have this kind of inner-sight into things.

Secondly, just for your information, I knew Yogi Bhajan very well on a personal level. I was present at many of his meetings in which he mentioned not knowing anything about Yoga nor about Sikhi but he was doing it because the Goras loved his BS. I am paraphrasing him.

He was a great orator, the gift he cultivated and took the best out of. There are many other things about him which are not worth mentioning because they are so disgraceful for anyone, whether one is a Sikh or not.

Now coming back to the video by Yogi Bhajan, I watched it. I was even aware of it before I asked you the questions about it.

Due to his lack of knowledge of Sikhi, allow me to post what he said and how it affected you. I am glad that it affected you in a positive manner and led you to this path.

The below are your words:

B]This particular one shook me when i watched it because there were many things i couldn't understand through my practical experience of Simran in Amrit Vela, but the way Yogi Ji explained only Two lines of Japji, just like he described, my whole universe opened up.

The two lines he talks about in this video are:
sochai soch n hovee jae sochee lakh vaar ||
chupai chup n hovee jae laae rehaa liv thaar ||[/B]

According to Yogi Bhajan the meaning of the first line above in the video is,” What Nanak is saying is, do not think”. And he continues talking about it throughout. In fact all is lecture is based on this theme of Thinking.

This is not what Guru Nanak said. Sochai is Such which means Pure. It does not mean Thinking as Yogi Bhajan claimed and many others like him have done the same.

Thought process is a collective noun. It cannot happen multiple times although our thoughts can be multiple. Thinking is a natural way in us humans. This is the unique distinction between us and the other animals in this animal kingdom of ours. So, one cannot stop thinking.

Now the question arises what to think about?

Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, our only Guru is full of answers for that. Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji is filled with Shabads talking about Mann-Mind-Thinking.

In this particular Pauri above, Guru Nanak is talking about taking dips in the holy waters thousands of times to become pure which brings to naught.

Yogi Bhajan has spent his life talking about this one line and making fool of people. In fact he has made his money on this line only.

This particular video is from the later moments of his life. One can see the oxygen tubes in his nostrils. He had gone to India to get the kidney transplant where he bought them as there was a long waiting list here in the US. One could judge for oneself if this was a Sikhi gesture on his part or not.

Yogi Bhajan has misinterpreted many verses of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, our only Guru in the same manner because as he said himself many times that he knew nothing about Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. It was always more about Yogi Bhajan than anything else.

Having said all this, I want to reiterate the same with what I began my post.

You looked at the Sunshine not at the rubbish dump which is one admirable trait to have and cultivate.

Thanks & regards

Tejwant Singh

PS: If you like, I can translate the whole Pauri according to my understanding. In short, in this particular Pauri Guru Nanak is talking about the 4 different methods the Hindu sages applied in order to "find/please God" and none of them work. They have nothing to do with thinking as Yogi Bhajan claimed several times when he was alive.

 

[Harkiran Kaur]

Here is some of the truth about 3HO:
(hint: even kundalini yoga was made up, and actual yoga experts have said it is dangerous physically, because some of the poses put the body into un-natural poses that could actually cause damage!)

http://www.gurmukhyoga.com/forum/index.php?mode=thread&id=384

Yogi Bhajan and his family doing Hindu pooja... which is against Rehet!

Yogi Bhajan ordered his kundalini yoga students to bow before him:
http://www.gurmukhyoga.com/forum/index.php?id=545

He was in it for the power...

Idolatry is forbidden in Sikhism... so then why this??

 

[spnadmin]

Thanks for posting these photos. In one of my next replies they were going to have to be posted !!!!!!! Now I will not have to do that.

The next comment about some Sikhs being more "ecclectic" and "inclusive" will be greeted with a lecture about McLeod who made up this fiction from his fertile imagination.

The point akasha ji that you have asked we consider both explicitly and implicitly has been a good one.... in my own words "Something is wrong with this picture." Yes some things are definitely wrong and are not Sikhi.

 

[spnadmin]

And I forgot.

Why is 3HO Kundalini Yoga always subtitled "As taught by Yogi Bhajan?" The answer is it has nothing to do with kundalini yoga "as practiced in India" which is a branch of Hatha Yoga, having its own Upanishad. In reality Yogi Bhajan's yoga is more like morning calisthenics "as practiced in a military boot camp."

With some breathing exercises added in for a genuine occultish effect.

There is a kundalini yoga and it is nothing like this.

 

[muddymick]

Akasha ji,

Here is some of the truth about 3HO:
(hint: even kundalini yoga was made up, and actual yoga experts have said it is dangerous physically, because some of the poses put the body into un-natural poses that could actually cause damage!)

With respect what do you mean by Kundalini Yoga was made up?

Considering Yoga-Kundalini Upanishad is in the Muktika canon of 108 Upanishads.This canon was fixed in the year 1656, it accepted by scholars that the Yoga-Kundalini Upanishad was compiled in the first half of the 17th century at the very latest.

This Upanishad is accepted as more likely dating from 16th century, as do other many other Sanskrit texts which treat kundalini as a technical term in tantric yoga, such as the Ṣaṭ-cakra-nirūpana and the Pādukā-pañcaka.
The Yoga-Kundalini and the Yogatattva are considered to be closely related to texts from the school of Hatha yoga. They both draw heavily on the Yoga Yajnavalkya (c. 13th century), as does the foundational Hatha Yoga Pradipika. They considered to be part of a prevalent tendency of syncretism in the 15th and 16th century combining the tradition of yoga with other schools of Hindu philosophy.

I would be very interested to hear who these yoga experts are that consider it dangerous due to its un-natural poses?

Many thanks

 

[muddymick]

spnadmin ji
just saw this;

Why is 3HO Kundalini Yoga always subtitled "As taught by Yogi Bhajan?" The answer is it has nothing to do with kundalini yoga "as practiced in India" which is a branch of Hatha Yoga, having its own Upanishad. In reality Yogi Bhajan's yoga is more like morning calisthenics "as practiced in a military boot camp."



With some breathing exercises added in for a genuine occultish effect.

There is a kundalini yoga and it is nothing like this.

Which answers my question.

Many thanks

 

[Harkiran Kaur]

And I forgot.

Why is 3HO Kundalini Yoga always subtitled "As taught by Yogi Bhajan?" The answer is it has nothing to do with kundalini yoga "as practiced in India" which is a branch of Hatha Yoga, having its own Upanishad. In reality Yogi Bhajan's yoga is more like morning calisthenics "as practiced in a military boot camp."

With some breathing exercises added in for a genuine occultish effect.

There is a kundalini yoga and it is nothing like this.

I should have said in my post 'kundalini yoga as taught by Yogi Bhajan' is not authentic yoga... sorry lol. It's his franken-yoga that has caused injuries because of the un-natural poses... I wasn't referring to the authentic kundalini yoga.

 

[Tejwant Singh]

I should have said in my post 'kundalini yoga as taught by Yogi Bhajan' is not authentic yoga... sorry lol. It's his franken-yoga that has caused injuries because of the un-natural poses... I wasn't referring to the authentic kundalini yoga.

Many of his old followers had sued him because of the back problems it caused.

Yogi Bhajan was known to walk on their backs while they queued up laying on the floor. This was one of his "Walking Postures".

 

[Luckysingh]

Not too sure about the un-natural poses that may cause damage !
Although I have seen this comment elsewhere before and from what I gather, all forms of yoga may induce some sort of damage if done too extremely.
Especially the bikram yoga where one is able to extend further without any pain because of the sauna like conditions where muscles are much more pliable. Many bikram yoga users tell me that you may regret it the next day if you are not too careful !

I'm not too sure how different the ancient kundalini is compared to YB's except that there would be no gurbani mantras, but I do believe it was supposed to be a tantric yoga.

 

[Brother Onam]

Dear SPNers,
As one who has done Yogi Bhajan's kundalini yoga in the past, I'd like to weigh in.
On the whole, I would have to agree that my intuition tells me most of what he teaches is indeed of his own invention, and has little to do with a secret science handed down from a little-known Brotherhood, or whatever provenance he claimed. And in its present form there is some silly mumbo-jumbo woven in, based on his dealing with, basically, white hippy students in the 70's, when this all came together. Having said that:
I found it to be an excellent experience. Most Sikhs will dismiss it out of hand because of preconceptions that Sikhi frowns upon yoga; end of story. But when you allow yourself to actually and openly experience it, you may be very surprised.
Beyond whatever strange hybrid of Sikh doctrine/hippy philosophy/hatha yoga or whatever he offered, one thing is true. In intensely combining prayer and meditation and simran with vigorous yogic breathing and posture, the spiritual experience can be almost ecstatic. I don't mean in just lightheaded, oxygen-starved dizziness, but rather in actual spiritual bliss. For all their silliness, the 3HO people tend to be strong, disciplined individuals, and I feel the depth of spiritual bliss I've felt in some kundalini sessions has been stronger than I see in the average satsang at typical gurdwara.
All of this is just to say, there is a place for combining intense breathing and movement with prayer; it can be life-changing. I have never been a member of 3HO, nor am I endorsing the yoga, but rather I am saying we would form deeper understanding of the spiritualizing potential of such discipline if ever we truly allowed ourselves to really feel it, rather than dismissing it based on notions without ever having had the taste.

 

[Luckysingh]

Beyond whatever strange hybrid of Sikh doctrine/hippy philosophy/hatha yoga or whatever he offered, one thing is true. In intensely combining prayer and meditation and simran with vigorous yogic breathing and posture, the spiritual experience can be almost ecstatic. I don't mean in just lightheaded, oxygen-starved dizziness, but rather in actual spiritual bliss. For all their silliness, the 3HO people tend to be strong, disciplined individuals, and I feel the depth of spiritual bliss I've felt in some kundalini sessions has been stronger than I see in the average satsang at typical gurdwara.
All of this is just to say, there is a place for combining intense breathing and movement with prayer; it can be life-changing. I have never been a member of 3HO, nor am I endorsing the yoga, but rather I am saying we would form deeper understanding of the spiritualizing potential of such discipline if ever we truly allowed ourselves to really feel it, rather than dismissing it based on notions without ever having had the taste.

I think your description above sums it up quite well.
From my little and current experience, I am sometimes amazed that the release of feel good endorphins and bliss can be achieved so rapidly with this yoga!!!
Saying that I must say that these 'feel good endorphins' are the same that are experienced in any vigorous physical activity such as the common ''runner's high'', BUT I find that in this yoga along with the meditation there is that Extra edge which I assume is to do with the meditative aspects.
This seems to give it a whole new dimension of experience that I haven't encountered before.

 

[Harkiran Kaur]

I don't think anyone has anything against kundalini yoga itself or 3HO, other than the fact that they merge it with Sikhi which is wrong. In North America, many people think kundalini yoga = Sikhi because of 3HO... its fine if people find connection with another spiritual path, but they shouldn't try to re-write another religion in the process. Or try to combine aspects of several religions (Hindu and Sikhi) together especially when they go against the teachings of one, or even the other (idol worship, fire pooja etc) That's all...

 

[chazSingh]

Having said all this, I want to reiterate the same with what I began my post.

You looked at the Sunshine not at the rubbish dump which is one admirable trait to have and cultivate.

Thanks & regards

Tejwant Singh

PS: If you like, I can translate the whole Pauri according to my understanding. In short, in this particular Pauri Guru Nanak is talking about the 4 different methods the Hindu sages applied in order to "find/please God" and none of them work. They have nothing to do with thinking as Yogi Bhajan claimed several times when he was alive

Thank you Tejwant Ji for your reply...

I like the many things you have said.

you see ji, in my life...often i have been a naughty boy, on the outside dressing like a sikh and on the inside having immense feelings of lust, sometimes anger, drinking heavily, trying drugs, treating women badly ... although i beleive i was kind hearted most of the time, and helping to the people around me, i was a BIG BIG hyprocrite...

And then BANG! as if from nowhere god took me by the arm and put me on the right path...i won't go into the ins and outs....but this happened. in a split second, my life turned around, and with a lot of patience, simran etc and help from God within all the negatives started slowly going away.

Rather than hating my past and the things i have done, i understood that it was my unique personal journey as ordained by God, and i also understood that a persons inner cries are heard by God and Guru, and within an instance Guru Ji can come to your aid...

The world still judges, i still get called a Hypocrite because the world thinks "you think you're a good person, how can you be when you DID this and THAT in the past" no one cares for your current state of being or the efforts one is taking to inner cleanse...Thank GOD that God and Guru are so forgiving.

Because of this, if god can forgive a person like me, surely He can forgive many others...and Surely if i want to experience God, i can also forgive others to...and not judge them, so i will always try to look for the positives in everything.

Dislike the Play(storyline), not the actors...for the actors are all elements of God...beneath the makeup, there is only God.

Maybe Ji, the interpretation of those lines of Gurbani is incorrect by Him,
But i know 100% from my own personal experience that if we take our attention within, and if our love and thirst for Guru Ji is there, then in complete silence of the mind where thoughts pass by without any influence of you, time ceases to exist and we become aware that in Silence, there isn;t silence, where there is no form, somethings is still there, where there is nothing to create a sound/shabad, there is still shabad.

So for me, That is what i see when i read many passages in Gurbani
I am enjoying the journey of uncovering Gurbani within me, and one thing i'm realising is that Gurbani is beyond limitations, there is unlimited depth in each line of gurbani...

 

[chazSingh]

Dear SPNers,
As one who has done Yogi Bhajan's kundalini yoga in the past, I'd like to weigh in.
On the whole, I would have to agree that my intuition tells me most of what he teaches is indeed of his own invention, and has little to do with a secret science handed down from a little-known Brotherhood, or whatever provenance he claimed. And in its present form there is some silly mumbo-jumbo woven in, based on his dealing with, basically, white hippy students in the 70's, when this all came together. Having said that:
I found it to be an excellent experience. Most Sikhs will dismiss it out of hand because of preconceptions that Sikhi frowns upon yoga; end of story. But when you allow yourself to actually and openly experience it, you may be very surprised.
Beyond whatever strange hybrid of Sikh doctrine/hippy philosophy/hatha yoga or whatever he offered, one thing is true. In intensely combining prayer and meditation and simran with vigorous yogic breathing and posture, the spiritual experience can be almost ecstatic. I don't mean in just lightheaded, oxygen-starved dizziness, but rather in actual spiritual bliss. For all their silliness, the 3HO people tend to be strong, disciplined individuals, and I feel the depth of spiritual bliss I've felt in some kundalini sessions has been stronger than I see in the average satsang at typical gurdwara.
All of this is just to say, there is a place for combining intense breathing and movement with prayer; it can be life-changing. I have never been a member of 3HO, nor am I endorsing the yoga, but rather I am saying we would form deeper understanding of the spiritualizing potential of such discipline if ever we truly allowed ourselves to really feel it, rather than dismissing it based on notions without ever having had the taste.

Thank you Ji for sharing your 'Actual Experience'.

How can you forget the One who created your soul, and the praanaa, the breath of life?
Without Him, all that we wear and eat is impure
Everything else is false. Whatever pleases Your Will is acceptable
http://www.sikhitothemax.com/page.asp?ShabadID=58

There is so much Shakti in the breath of life...the energy and bliss felt through the breath can be immense.

you wrote "For all their silliness, the 3HO people tend to be strong, disciplined individuals, and I feel the depth of spiritual bliss I've felt in some kundalini sessions has been stronger than I see in the average satsang at typical gurdwara."

And in this day and age, anything that can give people a spiritual lift is so critical for society..whether it is true sikhi or not, the Truth will reveal itself more once spiritual awareness is increased in the masses so the truth is where it all points to