I second what AoG has said, Anon. Do not forget you are on a Sikh forum. I'm of half a mind to take the eraser to some of what you've said, but I'll let it stand as-is as a show of your character.
It's very sad to see that you haven't been able to make the connection with Guruji. Perhaps later in your life, you will. But for now, probably what Harry Ji suggested is best; don't masquerade as something you're not, especially when you're so full of venom towards something so beautiful.
On the other hand, if you want to unpack some of the anger and frustration you're holding on to which makes you speak so badly of Sikhi, I'm sure the sangat would be pleased to help you.
But any further derogatory statements, like suggesting Gurbani's lessons make you want to drink bleach, or "so called guru" will be deleted without notice.
Thanks for not deleting my whole comment. It took a long time and I think my arguements are fair, I hope people attempt to rebut them rather than ignore them with the reasoning that they are offensive, and I do to some extent feel that maybe I went to far in some places (given that i wrote ~2000 words I think its fair to say that the places were i went "too far" were actually only a very small part of my post). Never the less, I should have refrained from this. But I hope that you can see
why succumbed to the trap of going to far. It was because ActsOfGod attacked me personally.
If you read up the thread you will see I made a non personal post about my theory as to why beards are intrinsically unnatractive, and regardless to weather I was right or wrong, it did not warrant the personal attacks ActsOfGod made towards me, and I think it's unfortunate that you are so ready to moderate my comments where I "Insult" sikhism, yet you don't do anything about the way ActsOfGod replied to me with such hostility. His post doesn't bother me but the double standard of these rules does, but if that's the way it has to be I suppose i'll just have to play by your rules.
You'll also note that in reference to my own post i put the word "insult" in speech marks. This is because I don't feel like I insulted sikhism. When talking about the bleach I didn't intend for it to read that: "gurbani makes me want to drink bleach", the point I was trying to make is that bleach, (or for that matter any poison which dulles the senses, alchohol, drugs etc) have the effect of altering our minds to make us not fear death. That was the point I was trying to make sorry if it did not read that way.
I also don't think there is anything wrong with caling SGGS a "so-called" guru. I am not a sikh, and therefore I don't recognize it as my guru, which is why I used the term "so called". I think it's reasonable for any non-sikh to not recognize sggs as their guru and if you want this place to be able to accommodate people of other faiths then I think its not reasonable to deem the term "so-called guru" as offensive.
Finally I don't think i've been offesive where I have used the term, "Man", "Militant" or "Book" in reference to the Sikh gurus. Like I said they are not my guru's, to me Guru Nanak was not divine, he is just a man. To take offense to me calling him this is to again deny a dialogue in which non-sikhs can participate with the usage of non-sikh terminology.
now onto you AoG
My discussion with you ends here, due to the above.
Sikhs, and indeed anyone who has studied even a little bit of Gurbani, will understand why. You will not.
My first theory is that the reason why you are saying this is because you have read my post and either can’t be bothered to reply to it because It’s long, or don’t want to reply for it because you can’t come back with a good response. Of course if you admit this you look weak, so you need an excuse not to respond, so instead you play the “I’m so offended you aren’t worth my time” card. Now I could be wrong, this is just a theory but let’s examine the alternative, let’s say that you truly are so offended you don’t have it in you to respond.
As I said above I don’t believe that what I have said has been offensive (perhaps mildly offensive, especially since I wrote over 2000 words and only a very small portion could be considered mildly inflammatory). I think that I have presented a critique of sikh philosophy, and you should (as a manly man) have enough conviction in your own faith to be able to defend it. This is a forum of discussion, and if you are so strong in your faith and philosophy you should be able to use this forum to address my critique. After the next quote ill consider another alternative.
Despite your grievously hurtful, ignorant and insulting statements, I sincerely hope that Guru Sahib has mercy upon you. For you know not what you speak. You are blind.
Let’s now assume that what I have said IS excessively offensive (I don’t believe this to be true but let’s assume it anyway). If it is offensive then surely it’s not very manly to get all offended to the point where you can’t even reply? If I have offended your philosophy, then you as a “real man” should be able to defend it, afterall it was YOU who said that a real man should be “strong on their principles and morals”. Yet because of a few insults, a few words, you aren’t able to reply because you are so offended. This isn’t being strong on your principles, you aren’t being very manly
Secondly if you are going to dismiss me for being offensive then by your standard I should be able to dismiss you for being offensive. You called my theory “BS”, You said I don’t stick to my principles, You said I was lustful, You said I sniff around females like a dog you said I wasn’t a “real man”, You replied to my post about physical attraction and twisted it into vulgaraity portraying me as a shallow person who is driven by sex and “base” pleasures. You did all of these things despite not knowing me and having only seen one post from me. Not only have you been judgmental without basis but you have also been extremely hostile. also why do you talk like this:
"For you know not what you speak. You are blind."
this isn't biblical times, there's no need to be so dramatic in the way you write, why be so over the top?
This is a forum on Sikh philosophy,
On a forum of sikh philosophy we should be able to discuss how the sikh philosophy holds up to other conflicting philosophies, my own philosophy being one such conflicting philosophy. My post was entirely appropriate to be on a sikh forum.
A sikh philosophy forum is also a place where criticisms of Sikhism can be rebutted, that was what you were supposed to do. Instead you walked away because you were offended. Perhaps it is YOU who doesn’t belong on a sikh phislosophy forum
not a place to go pandering your personal family issues.
YOU were the one that made me bring up my family issues, YOU were the one who asked me “Who's stopping you? Why do you say "not being able to"? What is that nonsense?”. I replied honestly. Don’t tell me that I can’t talk about my own personal problems when YOU were the one that asked me about them.
A: “Hello sir how are you?”
B: “I’m not feeling great”
A: “For god sake no one cares!!! why are you telling me this!?”
If all you want to do is cut your hair and shave your beard, but you're scared of your parents and family, there is no point in coming here and showcasing your cowardice to the world.
I don’t think it’s cowardice, I think it’s a tough choice. I don’t think it’s unreasonable to see that choosing between my own freedom and my parents’ happiness is a distressing dilemma. Not that distressing mind you, I can live with it, but still it’s a choice, a very real choice, and I don’t think either option is the coward’s way out. Again you are just using the word “Coward” because you want to personally insult me. This reveals your own double standard of being able to dish it out but not being able to take it.
Be a man (yes, a real man), and have the guts to be your real self in front of your family. I do feel sorry for your poor parents, though. It sounds like they just want the best for you.
You be a man. Have the courage to reply to what I said rather than just shrug it off because you are offended. A beard does not make you a man, according to you it’s alsoabout how you behave. Being so offended that you are just going to walk away is not manly at all.
that took a while. I just read my old post. While I didn't like being moderated, i'd like to say thanks Ishna for not moderating my post to the the extent where the original message has been lost. I also think this topic is taking a turn for things more personal and deviating away from the original thread topic. If either of you want to discuss this further then I think it would be better do do so over personal message so we don't derail things further.
it's soft and I like playing with it LOL but on a serious note plenty of women like bearded turbaned Sikh Guys and many young Sikh girls are now tying turbans themselves. In sure they will look specifically for husbands who tie tueban and keep their beards. And the number of girls tying turbans is growing steadily!!
