Is Homosexuality / Transsexuality A Punishment Because Of Karma Of Previous Lives?

[Harry Haller]

what ???!!!!!!!
what hollow rituals are you talking about ?

well for starters, the SGGS is not a sort of Moores Almanac where you open a page at random and then find some Bani to form some sort of punjabi tarot card reading.

If you treat the SGGS as such then do not be surprised if you get the same results as you would from a second rate palm reader.

When I need counsel from the divine, I search srigranth.org for relevant topics, and then when I find a shabad, I READ (licence fee in the post Gyaniji),it, not chant it, or repeat it throughout the day, READ it, then read it again, then try and understand it, then translate it, then compare the translations with the provided ones, then maybe post it here, debate it, and after some period of time, I may be lucky enough to understand the message. Some shabads are easier to understand than others, some contain such awe and wow that you have to work, but the results are worth it, it is information, guidance, life tips,

As for reincarnation, there are many many shabads that support a single life only, and there are many writers that have written in support of such, one favourite of mine is Baldev Singhji who has now sadly passed away.

You seem angry at God for your life, dont be, some people can lose holding 5 kings, some can win with nothing. You have more than nothing, you can feel, emotions, love, desire, some feel nothing, some are incapable of feeling, you have much to be grateful for, you have been given the gift of life and you clearly have intelligence, the rest is in your hands.

 

[spnadmin]

what ???!!!!!!!
what hollow rituals are you talking about ?

Seeker2013 ji

will only contaminate your mind further which will surround your mind with lots of fear eventually leading to hollow rituals

I had to ponder that myself. Then I realized there is such a thing as mental rituals. It makes sense. japjisahib is describing a mind going around in circles, creating mental traps that prevent making a fresh start that you can completely own. These are compulsive emotional reactions to images of future happenings and possible conversations, memories of past events and conversations, that trigger more of the same images and memories, and then more of the same fear. Rituals of the mind which drain a person and quite literally stand in the way of finding the confidence to move on to a place of your own choosing.

Whether you agree with him, to tell your parents now or later or never at all, telling them won't release you from the traps a thinking process creates. It was supposed to be a message of encouragement. Don't depend on a 'telling' to other people to release you. It takes some age on your bones to realize the truth of that.

 

[spnadmin]

p/s

My point is how to get away from it. Gurbani guidance is for us, 'ਭਾਂਡਾ ਧੋਇ ਬੈਸਿ ਧੂਪੁ ਦੇਵਹੁ ਤਉ ਦੂਧੈ ਕਉ ਜਾਵਹੁ ॥ this scar will only go once you surrender your matt and make inner journey and let fragrance of amrit rupi milk - divine traits control your mind otherwise even sharing with your parents or anyone else will only contaminate your mind further

So japjisahib ji is also saying in Gurbani we have a guide to the place where we can find that True Self we are and become who we truly are.

Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji may not at this time be that for you. That is OK! Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji works for me, for harry haller ji, for japjisahib ji. But it may not be for you at this time. I understand that, because reading spiritual articles by "very spiritual people" does absolutely nothing for me. However your mind can rest assured that there is nothing in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji that should make you less able to accept who you are, or doubt who you are.

 

[Seeker2013]

The beautiful thing about faith is, you can walk away from it but it never really leaves you. Its a door that can always be reopened again.

The problem I have with this statement is the one in bold. Until you can learn to accept every part of yourself as a part of who you are, no one else ever will. You were not TURNED a particular way, it is how you were created. You first have to learn to accept yourself, you are no less or more than anyone else who may be different than you. You were created whole, and you are such regardless of how you believe at the moment. I hope one day you will allow yourself to see that.

You can blame your childhood all you want, we all have a past and we all have stories we tell ourselves. Those 'stories' are not who you are, they are apart of your ego which keeps you trapped in the belief that you are some how less than. Until you are willing to let go of your stories that you have told yourself, you wont ever be content with who you are in this moment.

You want to be reconcile your sadness then figure out what is causing you to be sad? What are you afraid of and what are you ashamed of? You dont want to follow Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji thats fine, you dont have too. But searching for answers outside yourself is pointless unless you are willing to go within first.

Thanks so much for encouraging words .
But how can we be so sure that I was born this way . If thats the case , I will accept myself becoz thats how universe meant me to be in the grand plan of things

 

[Seeker2013]

The beautiful thing about faith is, you can walk away from it but it never really leaves you. Its a door that can always be reopened again.

The problem I have with this statement is the one in bold. Until you can learn to accept every part of yourself as a part of who you are, no one else ever will. You were not TURNED a particular way, it is how you were created. You first have to learn to accept yourself, you are no less or more than anyone else who may be different than you. You were created whole, and you are such regardless of how you believe at the moment. I hope one day you will allow yourself to see that.

You can blame your childhood all you want, we all have a past and we all have stories we tell ourselves. Those 'stories' are not who you are, they are apart of your ego which keeps you trapped in the belief that you are some how less than. Until you are willing to let go of your stories that you have told yourself, you wont ever be content with who you are in this moment.

You want to be reconcile your sadness then figure out what is causing you to be sad? What are you afraid of and what are you ashamed of? You dont want to follow Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji thats fine, you dont have too. But searching for answers outside yourself is pointless unless you are willing to go within first.

Seeker2013 ji



I had to ponder that myself. Then I realized there is such a thing as mental rituals. It makes sense. japjisahib is describing a mind going around in circles, creating mental traps that prevent making a fresh start that you can completely own. These are compulsive emotional reactions to images of future happenings and possible conversations, memories of past events and conversations, that trigger more of the same images and memories, and then more of the same fear. Rituals of the mind which drain a person and quite literally stand in the way of finding the confidence to move on to a place of your own choosing.

Whether you agree with him, to tell your parents now or later or never at all, telling them won't release you from the traps a thinking process creates. It was supposed to be a message of encouragement. Don't depend on a 'telling' to other people to release you. It takes some age on your bones to realize the truth of that.

true ! The more we age , I think the wiser we become . Thats why oldies are respected for their experience and seeked advice from !

 

[Seeker2013]

well for starters, the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji is not a sort of Moores Almanac where you open a page at random and then find some Bani to form some sort of punjabi tarot card reading.

If you treat the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji as such then do not be surprised if you get the same results as you would from a second rate palm reader.

When I need counsel from the divine, I search srigranth.org for relevant topics, and then when I find a shabad, I READ (licence fee in the post Gyaniji),it, not chant it, or repeat it throughout the day, READ it, then read it again, then try and understand it, then translate it, then compare the translations with the provided ones, then maybe post it here, debate it, and after some period of time, I may be lucky enough to understand the message. Some shabads are easier to understand than others, some contain such awe and wow that you have to work, but the results are worth it, it is information, guidance, life tips,

As for reincarnation, there are many many shabads that support a single life only, and there are many writers that have written in support of such, one favourite of mine is Baldev Singhji who has now sadly passed away.

You seem angry at God for your life, dont be, some people can lose holding 5 kings, some can win with nothing. You have more than nothing, you can feel, emotions, love, desire, some feel nothing, some are incapable of feeling, you have much to be grateful for, you have been given the gift of life and you clearly have intelligence, the rest is in your hands.

SGGS may not be an almanac, but at times the first pangti of hukamnama was like GGS is personally addressing me , my issue and what was in my heart that lead to the hukamnama . I remember many such incidences

 

[Harry Haller]

Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji may not be an almanac, but at times the first pangti of hukamnama was like GGS is personally addressing me , my issue and what was in my heart that lead to the hukamnama . I remember many such incidences

I understand, I have just had the same experience reading my fortune in todays newspaper!

 

[Harry Haller]

true ! The more we age , I think the wiser we become . Thats why oldies are respected for their experience and seeked advice from !

I have yet to find an oldie not mired in Vedic/Abrahamic Sikhism, I do not think age enough qualifies, it depends what you have done with that age.

anyway back to topic before the mods start deleting!

 

[japjisahib04]

Thanks so much for encouraging words .
But how can we be so sure that I was born this way . If thats the case , I will accept myself becoz thats how universe meant me to be in the grand plan of things

Every creation of His is perfect in itself. In His gravitational system there is no bias. Unlike the prevalent belief that killing, rape, arson, extortion are the grand plan of God, guru sahib says, 'ਜੈਸੇ ਹਰਹਟ ਕੀ ਮਾਲਾ ਟਿੰਡ ਲਗਤ ਹੈ ਇਕ ਸਖਨੀ ਹੋਰ ਫੇਰ ਭਰੀਅਤ ਹੈ ॥ ਤੈਸੋ ਹੀ ਇਹੁ ਖੇਲੁ ਖਸਮ ਕਾ ਜਿਉ ਉਸ ਕੀ ਵਡਿਆਈ ॥੨॥ SGGS 1329, it is all laws of nature, 'ਜੋ ਜੈਸੀ ਸੰਗਤਿ ਮਿਲੈ ਸੋ ਤੈਸੋ ਫਲੁ ਖਾਇ ॥੮੬॥ he develops thought process accordingly and transmit same to body organs.

As per guru sahib, there are two hukmis one, 'ਇਕਨਾ ਹੁਕਮੀ ਬਖਸੀਸ and the other ਇਕਿ ਹੁਕਮੀ ਸਦਾ ਭਵਾਈਅਹਿ ॥' so choice is ours which hukmi we follow.

best regards
sahni

 

[Inderjeet Kaur]

I think if you approach Siri Guru Granth Sahib ji with a clean heart and an open mind, whatever shabad you land on will speak directly to you. Unlike most other "sacred scriptures," Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji is all meat. There is no filler. Not a single line is a waste of time.

A wee bit off-topic perhaps, but I cannot understand how some people read 10 or more pages a day, every day. I wonder what they get out of it. I usually read a shabad or two or three everyday and that gives me more than I can really ponder on. I do get through the whole, although it may take several years to do so. I have done this several times and I learn quite a lot this way. I am not saying that reading a lot is wrong, only that it doesn't work for me.

From the sublime to the ridiculous, I am posting a picture for you. It might also give you something to think about.

 

[spnadmin]

Seeker2013 ji

I must ask you again what you really seek from this conversation. Are you convinced you are being punished for deeds of past lives? Has your perspective changed any in the past day? Do you want help to find a different perspective on your situation?

 

[Ishna]

Every creation of His is perfect in itself. In His gravitational system there is no bias. Unlike the prevalent belief that killing, rape, arson, extortion are the grand plan of God, guru sahib says, 'ਜੈਸੇ ਹਰਹਟ ਕੀ ਮਾਲਾ ਟਿੰਡ ਲਗਤ ਹੈ ਇਕ ਸਖਨੀ ਹੋਰ ਫੇਰ ਭਰੀਅਤ ਹੈ ॥ ਤੈਸੋ ਹੀ ਇਹੁ ਖੇਲੁ ਖਸਮ ਕਾ ਜਿਉ ਉਸ ਕੀ ਵਡਿਆਈ ॥੨॥ Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 1329, it is all laws of nature, 'ਜੋ ਜੈਸੀ ਸੰਗਤਿ ਮਿਲੈ ਸੋ ਤੈਸੋ ਫਲੁ ਖਾਇ ॥੮੬॥ he develops thought process accordingly and transmit same to body organs.

As per guru sahib, there are two hukmis one, 'ਇਕਨਾ ਹੁਕਮੀ ਬਖਸੀਸ and the other ਇਕਿ ਹੁਕਮੀ ਸਦਾ ਭਵਾਈਅਹਿ ॥' so choice is ours which hukmi we follow.

best regards
sahni

Veer Sahni ji

Can I please bother you to provide English translation to the Gurbani you've posted related to the two hukmis?

Many thanks
Ishna

 

[japjisahib04]

Veer Sahni ji

Can I please bother you to provide English translation to the Gurbani you've posted related to the two hukmis?

Many thanks
Ishna

When Guru sahib says, 'ਇਕਨਾ ਹੁਕਮੀ ਬਖਸੀਸ and the other ਇਕਿ ਹੁਕਮੀ ਸਦਾ ਭਵਾਈਅਹਿ ॥' - He is referring to two hukmis. The first hukmi - my beloved is so sweet - ਹਉ ਸੰਮਲਿ ਥਕੀ ਜੀ ਓਹੁ ਕਦੇ ਨ ਬੋਲੈ ਕਉਰਾ ॥ ਕਉੜਾ ਬੋਲਿ ਨ ਜਾਨੈ ਪੂਰਨ ਭਗਵਾਨੈ ਅਉਗਣੁ ਕੋ ਨ ਚਿਤਾਰੇ ॥ so sweet that He does not taunt or even consider my demerits Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 729.12 thus always keeps me in total bliss and productive and the second hukmi - my manh - my demon thought process 'ਸਦਾ ਭਵਾਈਅਹਿ ॥' always keep me in dilemma or in other word, 'ਨਦਰਿ ਉਪਠੀ ਜੇ ਕਰੇ ਸੁਲਤਾਨਾ ਘਾਹੁ ਕਰਾਇਦਾ ॥ - when I ignore divine message or innerself then -ਸੁਲਤਾਨਾ - my mind the ruler drags me into 'ਘਾਹੁ ਕਰਾਇਦਾ - superfluous, destructive or unnatural deed.

best regards
sahni

 

[Seeker2013]

Every creation of His is perfect in itself. In His gravitational system there is no bias. Unlike the prevalent belief that killing, rape, arson, extortion are the grand plan of God, guru sahib says, 'ਜੈਸੇ ਹਰਹਟ ਕੀ ਮਾਲਾ ਟਿੰਡ ਲਗਤ ਹੈ ਇਕ ਸਖਨੀ ਹੋਰ ਫੇਰ ਭਰੀਅਤ ਹੈ ॥ ਤੈਸੋ ਹੀ ਇਹੁ ਖੇਲੁ ਖਸਮ ਕਾ ਜਿਉ ਉਸ ਕੀ ਵਡਿਆਈ ॥੨॥ Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 1329, it is all laws of nature, 'ਜੋ ਜੈਸੀ ਸੰਗਤਿ ਮਿਲੈ ਸੋ ਤੈਸੋ ਫਲੁ ਖਾਇ ॥੮੬॥ he develops thought process accordingly and transmit same to body organs.

As per guru sahib, there are two hukmis one, 'ਇਕਨਾ ਹੁਕਮੀ ਬਖਸੀਸ and the other ਇਕਿ ਹੁਕਮੀ ਸਦਾ ਭਵਾਈਅਹਿ ॥' so choice is ours which hukmi we follow.

best regards
sahni

I really don't understand how can god be benevolent if he creates its creation and then sends him in a world where they are ridiculed/harassed/raped/denied rights - all this why ? jst becoz he's gay ?
he didn't even get a choice for his sexuality

Its like "would you purposely break leg of a dog and send him into a hounding dog's den and say to him 'well , stop being so negative , you can still crawl' "

 

[Tejwant Singh]

Thanks so much for encouraging words .
But how can we be so sure that I was born this way . If thats the case , I will accept myself becoz thats how universe meant me to be in the grand plan of things

Just ask yourself the following questions because the answers lie within as Angrisha ji mentioned so eloquently.

1. Did your parents choose their sexuality or were they born the way they are?

2. How about your friends and relatives?

3. When you realised you were gay, was it out of choice or something within you made you realise that?

4. Did you choose the colour of your eyes, the shape of your nose and other features?

Just find the answers within because eventually you have to come to grips with the truth that you are not responsible for.

Good luck.

Tejwant Singh

 

[Seeker2013]

Seeker2013 ji

I must ask you again what you really seek from this conversation. Are you convinced you are being punished for deeds of past lives? Has your perspective changed any in the past day? Do you want help to find a different perspective on your situation?

I am not sure ! But I am certainly gifted in some areas of my life . I don't want to sound dicey now but my mom/dad always say that before I was born , they would go spiritual places and serve there for number of days and that where they went , they always got 2 apples as a blessing and then I was born .

Also I have qualities of both girl and boy to some extent . Like , I am drawn to guy stuff but also desire men (womanly quality we may say !)

Again , sorry if I am sounding stupid but I do think its a blessing to have both female and male minds .

What I don't understand is Where is god when we suffer ? is he seeing tamasha and eating popcorn when we suffer and cry in desolation ?
why does shiit happen to people , like for eg me , I can't be myself with my life being easy at the same time

Epicurus once said few lines which have struck me since :
"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?"

 

[Seeker2013]

Just ask yourself the following questions because the answers lie within as Angrisha ji mentioned so eloquently.

1. Did your parents choose their sexuality or were they born the way they are?

2. How about your friends and relatives?

3. When you realised you were gay, was it out of choice or something within you made you realise that?

4. Did you choose the colour of your eyes, the shape of your nose and other features?

Just find the answers within because eventually you have to come to grips with the truth that you are not responsible for.

Good luck.

Tejwant Singh

thanks veerji !
And yes I did not choose to be who I am on a sexuality level . Atleast it was never a conscious decision I remember making . I was just attracted to guys , shy of them , like to be with them , flirting and all . I just don't feel lust for a woman , no desire to have physical relationship or any sort of life long relationship with one . In short , I prefer man as life partner , not a woman .

But being the only son/child of my parents is what bothers me .
I feel like I am not being fair to them . Apart from what people are gonna say (even if we forget all that but still .... how they going to feel

Sometimes I feel I should get married to a lesbian but even that feels like I am being violated ! This is a cognitive dissonance right now

 

[Tejwant Singh]

thanks veerji !
And yes I did not choose to be who I am on a sexuality level . Atleast it was never a conscious decision I remember making . I was just attracted to guys , shy of them , like to be with them , flirting and all . I just don't feel lust for a woman , no desire to have physical relationship or any sort of life long relationship with one . In short , I prefer man as life partner , not a woman .

But being the only son/child of my parents is what bothers me .
I feel like I am not being fair to them . Apart from what people are gonna say (even if we forget all that but still .... how they going to feel

Sometimes I feel I should get married to a lesbian but even that feels like I am being violated ! This is a cognitive dissonance right now

I know many gay indians who are married, have kids, their wives know about their sexuality and they have their boyfriends on the side including a couple of Sikh families. One can notice from their gestures about their real sexuality This is all due to the stigma in the Indian society where the drug addicts, the mentally weak, the gays and others are all kept in the closet.

The positive thing in the Indian society is men can hold hands while walking in the streets and no one is bothered.

In order not to disappoint your parents, you may have to marry a girl, have kids and lead your life in another closet if your spouse is not understanding.

But I hope you do not have to do that. You did not choose this, but it will be rather impossible for your parents to understand that part, not because of them, but because of the value system. I also hope you do not have to abandon your parents, and in order for that to happen, you have to prepare yourself to live a double life and find peace within till acceptance is cultivated.

Tejwant Singh

 

[Harry Haller]

I really don't understand how can god be benevolent if he creates its creation and then sends him in a world where they are ridiculed/harassed/raped/denied rights - all this why ? jst becoz he's gay ?
he didn't even get a choice for his sexuality

veerji what makes you so special lol

I really don't understand how can god be benevolent if he creates its creation and then sends him in a world where they are ridiculed/harassed/raped/denied rights - all this why ? jst becoz they are black/fat/ginger/short/white/yellow/simple/bald/hairy
they didn't even get a choice for his gift.....

 

[Harry Haller]

thanks veerji !
And yes I did not choose to be who I am on a sexuality level . Atleast it was never a conscious decision I remember making . I was just attracted to guys , shy of them , like to be with them , flirting and all . I just don't feel lust for a woman , no desire to have physical relationship or any sort of life long relationship with one . In short , I prefer man as life partner , not a woman .

But being the only son/child of my parents is what bothers me .
I feel like I am not being fair to them . Apart from what people are gonna say (even if we forget all that but still .... how they going to feel

Sometimes I feel I should get married to a lesbian but even that feels like I am being violated ! This is a cognitive dissonance right now

God has given you a gift, a way of expressing yourself and your love, you have no idea how lucky you are, think of the thousands with no passion, no love, no gift, they go through the motions of life, do as others do, aspire as to what others have, and then they die, never knowing the meaning of the word passion, not for the self, not for others and certainly not for God, God remains a distant deity that one fears, that one tries to please, to not let down, you have this, you have the gift, enjoy it, but never forget God in your passion, never forget to do his bidding here in this single life, do not waste a moment, live a full happy passionate life, share it with all around you.