Lack Of Female Participation In Discussion

[kds1980]

makes me wonder if these young turbaned sikh men are also not very religious, but just wearing turban for cultural identity? i know this is not uncommon in india.

in the US, i'd say only religious sikhs keep their turbans. maybe that's better, at least we can find them easily.

It depends how strict your family is.The urban sikhs are of mainly khatri,arora ,ramgarhia caste and many of them are very strict about boys wearing turban and not cutting their hair.beleive me they can forgive anything but not their boys cutting hairs.That's why many boys do wear turban the other hand the majority of punjab rural population which is jatt is now clean shaven.AS dr.khalsa ji was mentioning some days back that out of 12,000 sikh men he was unable to found a fully turbanned and bearded sardar in rural punjab in the age bracked of 18 to 25 so a lot depends on family and social presure.

 

[kds1980]

Also kelly ji you said that amritdhari women are unable to find turbaned husbands
as far as i know an amritdhari can marry only amrit dhari.and according to some orthodox your amrit is broken if you have relationship with non amritdhari. so if they are orthodox could they marry non amritdhari turbaned husbands.

 

[drkhalsa]

Really Nice disscusion going just love to read it !

what I have observed

I have been living in diffrenet places of India and Abroad in past 5 years and what I have observed is that No of religious Guys and Girls just go hand in hand in almost all the places
but the expresion is between bit different


there is lot of difference in Expression of religious intent by a girl as compared to boy .

there is basic difference in Psyche of Females that they are more grounded in thinking which mean to say they are more bent toward Dedication than the intellectual disscusion of Sikhism this is more common in eastern world due to their role in society.

Sikh teenage Girls and Boys feels little bit of extra pressure in India due to Bollywood and TV Industry just dont represent them enough or may be worse in bad shape so there is general trend that appears to be non Sikh but still spirtual .

I have met many Girls who wants to talk about spirtuality but not sikhism why? becasue they kind of carry too much assumptions about being a skh and how difficult it is

No matter ho wmuch trendy or otherwise any young man or woman is but deep down everybody want to be Spirtual as its our original Nature so most of the times I have found that many people who appears to quite un sikh are very spirtual just down there skin you just need to look little bit deeper and all this Fashion thing is very superficial


there were just too many random thougts coming by my mind but jsut have little time at the moment will write again

Thanks for the disscusion


Jatinder Singh

 

[spnadmin]

DrKhalsa ji

Not random thoughts. There is in each sentence a lot to ponder. One thing that you said we should all take note of. Dedication is an expression of spirituality. And it is an expression of sikhi. Selfless dedication to the responsibilities of life, to family and society -- that is one thing that is unique about Sikhism. Everyone believes in this but Sikhism makes a point of openly embracing it in every story of the Gurus, in prayer, in Bani. You pointed this out when you described the spirituality of Sikh women.

 

[Archived_Member1]

Also kelly ji you said that amritdhari women are unable to find turbaned husbands
as far as i know an amritdhari can marry only amrit dhari.and according to some orthodox your amrit is broken if you have relationship with non amritdhari. so if they are orthodox could they marry non amritdhari turbaned husbands.

can you show me where this is written? because i know of several families with one amritdhari parent/spouse...

 

[kds1980]

can you show me where this is written? because i know of several families with one amritdhari parent/spouse...

http://www.sgpc.net/sikhism/anand-sanskar.asp
q. Amritdhari Sikh ought to get his wife also Amritdhari

I have read many debates on this issue the most recent one is this

http://www.sikhnet.com/Sikhnet/disc...A02B5C7720FF03E087257331003FBE2A!OpenDocument

So marrying a non amritdhari is controversial.Also at present the difference's in rehat of many amritdhari's could contradict the life style's of other.so its much better if an amritdhari marry an amritdhari of its own instituion,jatha etc.

 

[Astroboy]

But after all that has been said so far, I still don't understand WHY THERE IS
a lack of female participation in discussion.

 

[drkhalsa]

But after all that has been said so far, I still don't understand WHY THERE IS
a lack of female participation in discussion.

__________________

We are slowly Getting there !
that was nice way to say it

 

[drkhalsa]

DrKhalsa ji

Not random thoughts. There is in each sentence a lot to ponder. One thing that you said we should all take note of. Dedication is an expression of spirituality. And it is an expression of sikhi. Selfless dedication to the responsibilities of life, to family and society -- that is one thing that is unique about Sikhism. Everyone believes in this but Sikhism makes a point of openly embracing it in every story of the Gurus, in prayer, in Bani. You pointed this out when you described the spirituality of Sikh women.

Dear Aad ji

you are very good Psychologist , you just read my thoughts . I just wanted to say exactly this .

as I remember form my own experience , I cant remember a single day when I was young and my mother used to tie my hair Knot and patka that she might have shown any reluntance to do so , although she suffered from severe allergic Rhinitis .

why I am saying this is becuase I had very long Hair when I was young and now a days the number one reason young boys give to cut there hair is that it is too hard to maintain it . Even some mothers gives this reason to why there Children has Short hair

So it is kind of Silent dedication of women that she express her Spirtuality

Thanks

Jatinder Singh

 

[Astroboy]

God teach me patience, but please hurry.

 

[bade_ustaad]

Here is one reason why?

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/1665053.cms
NRI girls turn criminals for money, boyfriends
20 Jun 2006, 2348 hrs IST , Gur Kirpal Singh Ashk , TNN

PATIALA: They are teenage girls of Indian origin, born and brought up in Canada. And, they are increasingly turning to a life of crime, peddling drugs for easy money and to be able to boast of toughie boyfriends on their arms.

This new generation of Indo-Canadian girls has set off alarm bells in the Canadian police force. So much so that the Royal Canadian Mounted Police (RCMP) has launched initiatives like weekend camps and after-school games to keep the young women off the streets.

While doing a special story on South Asian gangs, Canadian Broadcast Corporation (CBC) quoted Rosie Thakar, diversity coordinator for RCMP, Surrey (British Columbia), as saying that more and more Indian origin teenage girls are turning to prostitution and ending up as drug-runners for these gangs.

"Our younger girls are getting used in this process, whether it is for easy money or to get gangster boyfriends."

What has the RCMP worried is the fact that the number of Indo-Canadian teenage girls joining such gangs is increasing.

A 15-year-old girl taking part in Thakar’s programme said South Asian girls see this as a way to get rich fast.

"Girls just want money. They like to go shopping," the girl said. "They just need more money, so they sell drugs."

A worried RCMP has launched a new female-only programme to help teenage girls build self-esteem in Surrey. But the problem is not limited to that region.

Baltej Pannu, an NRI broadcaster who has lived in Canada for 19 years, told TOI : "The problem of South Asian gangs is very serious in all of Canada. Besides British Columbia, these gangs are also a huge headache for police of Ontario province, which also has a dense population of Punjabis."

 

[Archived_Member1]

interesting article, but thank God i don't see this as common place.

actually, most of the young amritdhari girls i know are canadian. they wear dastaar, they get up at amrit vela, they practice kirtan before school and attend smagams on their holidays. they're hardly this "life of crime" sort, thank God.

 

[Archived_Member1]

Indian Sikh Traditions, Sikh Marriage Ceremony, Sikh Wedding Conventions, Matrimonial Ceremony of Sikhs, India
q. Amritdhari Sikh ought to get his wife also Amritdhari

I have read many debates on this issue the most recent one is this

marrying amritdhari girl

So marrying a non amritdhari is controversial.Also at present the difference's in rehat of many amritdhari's could contradict the life style's of other.so its much better if an amritdhari marry an amritdhari of its own instituion,jatha etc.

hmm, i guess i see it more as a recomendation (and for good reason) than an injunction. also, it specifically mentions men... i wonder why? i do know several families with an amritdhari mother but not father. or even if she's not amritdhari, in most families i know it's the mother who wakes up at amrit vela to do her bani every day, the mother who attends gurdwara every day, the mother who does seva as often as possible, the mother who keeps her children's hair maintained...

honestly, i don't think i'll ever be able to swallow the idea that men are somehow more religious. it just doesn't mesh with what i've seen in my every day life.

(note: all of my sikh friends are indian born or of indian origin, i don't know any white sikhs, but from what i've read, among white sikhs women are even MORE religious... heading gurdwaras and participating in committies in larger numbers than men, etc).

 

[spnadmin]

Members

As promised, I polled the women who are members of a Sikh discussion network where discussions of Gurbani and Gurmat take place.
Those responding so far (ages 25 and older) are wives, mothers and career women, all at once. Their view is that they have very little time left in their day to spend on the net-- and the time they have to themselves is time when they would rather meditate and read Gurbani rather than discuss it. When more respond, I will give an update.

 

[Astroboy]

In Malaysia, the women generally internalise sikhi more than outwardly. Almost every sikh sehajdhari woman follows and keeps herself well informed about gurdwara programmes. There's hardly any sikh mother who doesn't know how to do paath. There are sikh families who can be termed "too westernised" and their very short hair is becoming a trend amongst most teenagers. Eventhough, they themselves are not following sikhi they do make their children adopt proper sikh discipline unlike themselves.

Currently, there is no proper sikh preacher who is able to lead them starting from their view point. This can cause the rift to widen even more. But surprisingly, they do not see amritdharis as fanatics anymore but seek to learn from them. Intermingling is very common. Amritdharis are not stressing nor imposing the sikh conduct upon the sehajdhari sikhs. They just accept them as part of the community.

Of course, there is this general tendency of sehajdharis to take the back seat in religious activities while the amritdharis are always at the fore-front and leading all gurdwara activities.
90% of teenage girls cut their hair and want to 'keep up' with the world.
There is no sikh preacher to keep them within the fold of core sikhi (without dogma). Hence, many are influenced by other religions like christianity.

There seem to be an increase in sikhs attending church mass but the overall numbers are negligible in percentage.

 

[kds1980]

Members

As promised, I polled the women who are members of a Sikh discussion network where discussions of Gurbani and Gurmat take place.
Those responding so far (ages 25 and older) are wives, mothers and career women, all at once. Their view is that they have very little time left in their day to spend on the net-- and the time they have to themselves is time when they would rather meditate and read Gurbani rather than discuss it. When more respond, I will give an update.

Antonia ji i agree with it,not only women but participation of married men is much less than single men on diffrent forums.

 

[kds1980]

Of course, there is this general tendency of sehajdharis to take the back seat in religious activities while the amritdharis are always at the fore-front and leading all gurdwara activities.
90% of teenage girls cut their hair and want to 'keep up' with the world.

What about boys? how many keep their hair and wear turban in malayasia

 

[Astroboy]

What about boys? how many keep their hair and wear turban in malayasia

Those who wear dastars,70% of all teenage sikh boys shave their beards . Even they do not participate actively in community service but rather are seen hanging around in small groups chit chatting amongst themselves. They are least interested in what's going on in the darbar sahib. With mona sikh teenagers, sky is the limit. What to say about them ?

Girls are more disciplined where gurdwara programmes are concerned.

But there are isolated groups of teenage girls who regularly visit discos and what not. They do not believe in religion. The kind of things they do could be tongue piercing, permanent tattoos, looking like a punk, weed smoking, alcohol and cigarettes, car racing, etc. This is a phase they go through and the lucky ones come out of it.

 

[kds1980]

It means that 70% boys shave their beards while 90% girls cut their hair.so number of keshdhari boys is three time than girls

am i right?

 

[TGill]

30 % boys may be less than 10% girls if total population of boys is lesser than girls.

3 times !! ... That is not necesary