Sex, Girlfriend, Am I Allowed?

[Archived_Member4]

Aad0002

You are not reading what I am writing. I said at a higher frequency not right frequency. And for me to explain this state of mind, I must be a fool it cannot be explained but it sure can be achieved by anyone that believes in God and has an open mind to all possibilities. If you do not believe me that I am vibrating at a certain frequency I cannot do anything about that its either you trust me or you don’t.


Also between married couples, if they are having sex just for lust then they also are committing a sin. Sex is used for one purpose and that is having a child."


I stand by this comment and I cannot find this exact quote word for word. Like I wrote in my pervious comment I have an understanding of lust and marriage in this manner and if you do not want to accept this I would really appreciate it if you told me your point of view on this account.

Once again I am going to stress that I did not say, only I can achieve this higher frequency but anyone can achieve this state if they mediate on God.

 

[spnadmin]

I am still wondering what all this about "frequency" is about.

Sex with your girlfriend -- that is the topic of the thread. We should be able to get the answer from Shabad Guru, and any combination of Shabad Guru with SRM, logic and/or common sense. We are not short wave radio sets, but rather have been given the gift of Guruji and beautiful minds. So we don't need to tune into a "frequency" to figure it out.

 

[Lee]

Aad0002

You are not reading what I am writing. I said at a higher frequency not right frequency. And for me to explain this state of mind, I must be a fool it cannot be explained but it sure can be achieved by anyone that believes in God and has an open mind to all possibilities. If you do not believe me that I am vibrating at a certain frequency I cannot do anything about that its either you trust me or you don’t.


Also between married couples, if they are having sex just for lust then they also are committing a sin. Sex is used for one purpose and that is having a child."


I stand by this comment and I cannot find this exact quote word for word. Like I wrote in my pervious comment I have an understanding of lust and marriage in this manner and if you do not want to accept this I would really appreciate it if you told me your point of view on this account.

Once again I am going to stress that I did not say, only I can achieve this higher frequency but anyone can achieve this state if they mediate on God.

I don't understand this mindset at all?

We are of course allowed to enjoy our life while we are here, to be happy, to engage in things just for fun.

Yes, yes, yes, of course beware the 5 thives, yet this idea that sex is only for procreation porpouses is plain madness. Why did God make is fun?

I am married and have been so for 20 years, I have children, neither my wife or I have any desire to have any more children, I am 41 years old and my wife is 38. Should we just stop having sex, is it un-Sikh that we both still enjoy it?

No I don't think so. It makes us both happy, it contributes to the smooth running of our relationship, when one of us does not feel like 'doing it' then neither of us does. We do not let sex for fun control our lives so it is not even lust that we give into.

It is both fun and harmonious for the pair of us, a sin? Hardly.

 

[BhagatSingh]

The 5 "thieves" are normal part of our lives, without which we would not be able to function properly.
Does the SGGS say to eradicate them completely or not let them out of control?

If your parents did not exhibit lust to some degree, you would not be here. So be glad that they did.

 

[Tejwant Singh]

Who has sex after marriage?

Just thinking aloud, as usual.

 

[spnadmin]

The really clean "adult" humor.

 

[BhagatSingh]

Who has sex after marriage?

Just thinking aloud, as usual.

Is that why Indian people are always grumpy because they don't have sex after marriage?

 

[Navdeep88]

love and lust go together and there is a reason why marriage exists, its to make use of them both in the best way possible. and thats the truth.
yea, when you fall in love, it seems like there's nothing else. everything else becomes meaningless. and if you prepare yourself like that, and it doesnt work out, IT HURTS. AND ITS SO HARD TO GET BACK TO WHO YOU WERE BEFORE. seriously, just focus on school and stuff, i know its hard at this age but have faith that god made one person for you and when you're prepared to start a family, things will come together.
there is a consequence of sex: children. not always physical children but something is born spiritually. women have a tendency to get attached. and if you both get attached at a young age, it'll put a lot of pressure on your individual growth. apparently, your self-identity isn't fully formed till your like 25 or something...so you've gotta make some choices about when your ready.
you gotta be careful about the race thing too...yea, its good to be openminded and see all of humanity as one but in your everday life, culture does play a role. if you aren't willing to give up your culture, don't expect your girlfriend to either. that could possibly strain the relationship you have with your family.


so pretty much...love at this age, its amazing when it happens. and it SUCKS when it doesn't work out, so my advice: unless you're ready to marry the person your in love with, you gotta control your desires. because if you don't end up marrying her: you just had sex with someone else's wife.

 

[N.Kaur]

Plain answer: NO
Its in our Rehat Maryada too, Parai nar , dhee bhen jano..See all girls as your sisters and daughters, except the one you are/will be married to ..
Having a girlffriend is not bad, as I belive in Love marriages, but at your age NO, you are too young todecide what is right and wrong(though you are thinking right now, No , I am an adult now)anyway, I feel Control your emotions till you are mature enough to get into some relationship, just the time when you feel you should settle down to marry someone..
Its easy to get into relationships with soemone, but its really heartbreaking when you or she cant make it up..
so better concentrate on your studies and read Bani.

 

[ballym]

Is that why Indian people are always grumpy because they don't have sex after marriage?

A balanced diet is most healthy. Take it seriously, balaced approach always wins.
Before and after... always.:tongue:
Yes, we must meditate too. There is no bad karma... it is only excess or lack of action/karma/ duty, that is bad.
I am not sure if original poster is following this thread but this applies to all... having it in a balanced contolled way is OK but the problem with this is that our brain signals for more an dmore and this is what we need to be aware and afraid of. If you can have control of this , everything is fine.
Self-conficence plays a big role in improving your control capability.Here these Goras ( Whites... a general term, do not pinpoint this) score over us. They look happy even when working a lousy job and we look grumpyeven when working as DBA, Ananlysts, engineers, administrators, software experts, running microsoft, Cisco:happy:.

 

[rajneesh madhok]

Dear Mr. Singh,
Sikhism evolved from the anti-casteism and anti-ritualism movement. Casteism was only one of the Kureetis prevalent in Hinduism at that time and Gurus did their best to make it extint. Guru Gobind Singh's creation of the KHALSA was the highest point of war against casteism but it is very painful to see that guru's own khalsas ae disobeying him by keeping the castes alive. Sure the differences are not as sharp as in Hinduism but still they are there otherwise we should not use the words like Jat Sikh, Khatri Sikh Ramdasia Sikh so on and so forth.....this way they people feel proud of declaring that rather than feeling ashamed.

Now the question come regarding marriage. Our Gurus did not performed one practical to erase casteism from society, means were not able to offend their own parents and caste/ community and as their guru lineage was based on within caste or relatives so they have never taken courage to marry intercaste. If people can unite by getting baptism from same Amrit/nectar bowl why they cannot unite by intercaste mariiages. So, it is Guru's duty to show the path to followers.
Now if we consider Guru's preachings----Brahminism and superstition has been abolished by Gurus by providing practical scenes or examples like****** Watering to direction of fields to remove superstition about Ganga river and Sun worship, Curing poor from leprosy, dining with poors or low castes.
Now we discuss the point of Pre-marital sex. From the bakti movement saints have preached and awaken the masses and they preached to become self role model and adopt chastity till marriage. The preaches of the saints and Gurus always awaken the masses so we should adopt the ideologies framed by our Gurus and should avoid such sort of relations like Pre-marital sex relations.
Rajneesh madhok

 

[Zahim Nasir]

If sex is a 'personal decision', then your religion seems incomplete ?

Ask yourself if you marry a woman would you expect her to have been ***ed?

If the answer is No, then do the math

 

[Archived_Member_18]

GURUFATEH JI
a frnd is a frnd whether its a boy or a girl or a sikh ,hindu or any other religion but it all depends hw u treat ur relationship
according to sikhism i think it is wrong to indulge in any sort of sexual intercourse before marriage but today about 90% of the relationships r about lust nt love
so its nt wrong to have a girl frnd but to invole yourself in any sort of sex is wrongg.........

as in guru ji tell us again and again to keep ourselves away frm kAAM..

 

[rajneesh madhok]

If sex is a 'personal decision', then your religion seems incomplete ?

Ask yourself if you marry a woman would you expect her to have been ***ed?

If the answer is No, then do the math

Mr. Zahim Nasir,
I am elaborating both the subject regarding Sikhism and Islam with specific intention to focus on your subject as you said that Sex is a personal decision then your religion seems incomplete? I have done the calculations of Maths now it is your turn to do the calculations yourself:
Now come to Extracts from Holy Quran 33:35: The Subject of SALAVTION:
“For muslim men and women, for believing men and women, for devout men and women, for true men and women, for men and women who are patient and constant, for men and women who humble themselves, for men and women who give in charity, for men and women who fast, for men and women who guard their chastity, and for men and women who engage much in Allah’s praise, for them has Allah prepared forgiveness and great reward.”

Dear we have never objected to Holy Quran’s teachings:
“Allah (thus) directs you As regards your children’s (inheritence). A portion equal to that of two females; if only daughters, two or more, Their share is two-thirds of the inheritanc. If only one, her share is a half.” (Holy Quran 4:11)

In Sikh Rehat Maryada (Code of Sikh Conduct), There is nothing to state otherewise regarding women. “ Since all Children, both male and female are equal in all respects, the property of the father is equally divisible amongst the children; women married and unmarried have equal share alongwith the male progeny. Thus in Sikhism the women and men have been considered at par and so they are entitled to an equal share regardless of their gender.

Now we come to the subject of Pre-marital sex:

Kindly go through Holy Quran, 4:34): Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, Because Allah has given the one more (strength) than the other, and because they support them from their means.”

Guru Granth Sahib pp. 473: “From the woman is our birth, in the woman’s womb are we shaped; To the woman we are engaged, to the woman we are wedded; the woman is our friend and from woman is the family; Through the woman are the bonds of the world; why call woman evil who gives birth to the world’s leaders? From the woman is the woman, without woman there is none”

The Holy Quran 2:282: “And if there are not two men, then a man and two women, such as ye choose, for witnesses. So that if one of them errs, the other can remind her. -------Elaboration:
When there is a requirement for witnesses on a transaction and one of two men is unavailable, then two women can take the role of one man. This is to ensure that if one of them makes a mistake, the other woman can correct her.
In the conclusion we go through the teachings of Holy Quran:
The muslim woman is always associated with an old tradition known as the veil. It is Islamic that the woman should beautify herself with the veil of honour, dignity, chastity, purity and integrity. She should refrain from all deeds and gestures tht might stir the passions of people other than her legitimate husband or cause evil suspicion of her morality. She is warned not to display her charms or expose her physical attractions before strangers.

Marriage Ceremony:
In Sikhism the marriage ceremony is referred as Ananad karaj. Anand means Bliss and karaj means deed (Something one does). Marriage is uniting of two souls. So, accordingly we can declare it as the path of spirituality. So, the responsibility of householder is considered spiritual.
Concluding part of discussion:
According to Islam, Obedient women are more likely to receive the rewards of God. So, it stresses on chastity before marriage.
I hope Mr. Nasir kindly go through the teachings of Islam and then argue on the subject.
Rajneesh madhok

 

[Lee]

Plain answer: NO
Its in our Rehat Maryada too, Parai nar , dhee bhen jano..See all girls as your sisters and daughters, except the one you are/will be married to ..
Having a girlffriend is not bad, as I belive in Love marriages, but at your age NO, you are too young todecide what is right and wrong(though you are thinking right now, No , I am an adult now)anyway, I feel Control your emotions till you are mature enough to get into some relationship, just the time when you feel you should settle down to marry someone..
Its easy to get into relationships with soemone, but its really heartbreaking when you or she cant make it up..
so better concentrate on your studies and read Bani.

This is a strange way of seeing things, well at least to my mind N Kaur ji.

Let me explain.

Guru ji tells us that only humans are blessed enough to reach for God, that no other animal can do this. Blessed then indeed are we, and we must then think are we at the pinicle, are we the ultimate, are we in fact suppireor and above all other animal life here on Earth?

We can certianly produce arguments claiming that we must so be.

Then if that is the case, God wants us to reach God, and only us humans can do this, then why ask or command us to do that which goes contray to the very nature that God has given us?

It is normal at a certian age for us humans to begin to notice those of the opposite sex, and have those thoughts about them that we never used to. Then why should it be so, if every human shares this in common, that we should try to deny or ignore these feelings?

There are soooo many studies around on the effect of what happens when a human tries to repress normal emotions and feelings, we know that doing so is not good for our mental health, so again why would God ask to?

I don't belive that God has done any such thing. What does Guru ji say?

 

[rajneesh madhok]

This is a strange way of seeing things, well at least to my mind N Kaur ji.

Let me explain.

Guru ji tells us that only humans are blessed enough to reach for God, that no other animal can do this. Blessed then indeed are we, and we must then think are we at the pinicle, are we the ultimate, are we in fact suppireor and above all other animal life here on Earth?

We can certianly produce arguments claiming that we must so be.

Then if that is the case, God wants us to reach God, and only us humans can do this, then why ask or command us to do that which goes contray to the very nature that God has given us?

It is normal at a certian age for us humans to begin to notice those of the opposite sex, and have those thoughts about them that we never used to. Then why should it be so, if every human shares this in common, that we should try to deny or ignore these feelings?

There are soooo many studies around on the effect of what happens when a human tries to repress normal emotions and feelings, we know that doing so is not good for our mental health, so again why would God ask to?

I don't belive that God has done any such thing. What does Guru ji say?

Dear Mr. Lee, Madam N.Kaurji has written rightly, Firstly believe in God. You are finding satisfaction in sexual activities which has no lasting. I am talking about those people those have every possession in the world but still they are very empty inside. The beauty of the Guru (God) is that which every man can rejoice. Guru can take you from darkness to light. You are finding satisfaction in those deeds by which you can never be satisfied unto death. So, dear there are millions of ways in which mankind can find satisfaction. There are a lot feelings, and there are lot of emotions. There are a lot desires. You can take dish but you can’t know others wish.
Dear there is a lot of difference between the West and the East. You want and think the way YOU want, but on the other hand your aggressiveness, your faith, your desire shall make it prevail. That is not the end of your desire. Just concentrate on the almighty. Follow the teachings Ang Sang Wahe Guru. Our projections, rejections, in pain and in pleasure in richness---------when we find HIM in everything then you will feel the pleasure of life.
This is the difference between animal and man. When a man desires something, his state of ecstasy, in micro consciousness to macro consciousness to his magnetic field, has the projection of that attraction but under no circumstances it is finalized but an animal desires something, it is one pointed. Either it gets it or it does not. Our totality is something so limited, our desires are sometimes so few.

So, dear don’t try to find happiness in the mortal world (Kshan Bhangur in hindi---lasts in moments).
“Ik onkar Sat nam karta purkh nirbao nirvair akal moorat ajoonee saibhang, Gur prasad.” This is very tall order and Guruji guided us to achieve it.
“Jap, Aad Sach, Jugaad Sach, Heibhee Sach, naanak Hosee bhee Sach.” See the truth in all. See that dignity in all. Do not separate the creator and the creation.

So save your energy. You need energy. Without this you cannot live. Don’t think about taking vitamins and taking that kind of stuff you are going to be fine. That’s not true. Your spirit is hungry.

You will get MOKSHA ---eternity by SEWA (Service) to humanity.
We should find all---in his name, in his grace, and in his privilege, and let us prevail through us.

Wahe Guru ji ka khalsa, Wahe Guru ji ki Fateh.

Rajneesh madhok

 

[Lee]

Dear Mr. Lee, Madam N.Kaurji has written rightly, Firstly believe in God. You are finding satisfaction in sexual activities which has no lasting. I am talking about those people those have every possession in the world but still they are very empty inside. The beauty of the Guru (God) is that which every man can rejoice. Guru can take you from darkness to light. You are finding satisfaction in those deeds by which you can never be satisfied unto death. So, dear there are millions of ways in which mankind can find satisfaction. There are a lot feelings, and there are lot of emotions. There are a lot desires. You can take dish but you can’t know others wish.
Dear there is a lot of difference between the West and the East. You want and think the way YOU want, but on the other hand your aggressiveness, your faith, your desire shall make it prevail. That is not the end of your desire. Just concentrate on the almighty. Follow the teachings Ang Sang Wahe Guru. Our projections, rejections, in pain and in pleasure in richness---------when we find HIM in everything then you will feel the pleasure of life.
This is the difference between animal and man. When a man desires something, his state of ecstasy, in micro consciousness to macro consciousness to his magnetic field, has the projection of that attraction but under no circumstances it is finalized but an animal desires something, it is one pointed. Either it gets it or it does not. Our totality is something so limited, our desires are sometimes so few.

So, dear don’t try to find happiness in the mortal world (Kshan Bhangur in hindi---lasts in moments).
“Ik onkar Sat nam karta purkh nirbao nirvair akal moorat ajoonee saibhang, Gur prasad.” This is very tall order and Guruji guided us to achieve it.
“Jap, Aad Sach, Jugaad Sach, Heibhee Sach, naanak Hosee bhee Sach.” See the truth in all. See that dignity in all. Do not separate the creator and the creation.

So save your energy. You need energy. Without this you cannot live. Don’t think about taking vitamins and taking that kind of stuff you are going to be fine. That’s not true. Your spirit is hungry.

You will get MOKSHA ---eternity by SEWA (Service) to humanity.
We should find all---in his name, in his grace, and in his privilege, and let us prevail through us.

Wahe Guru ji ka khalsa, Wahe Guru ji ki Fateh.

Rajneesh madhok

Rajneesh Ji,

Yes what you say here is of course true, yet still I see no command from God nor Guru ji to abstaine from sex, nor to attempt to turn the mind from the natural thoughts that we all have once we reach a certian age.

Guru ji tell us that by obeying the Hukam of God, and emersing ourselfs in the Shabad of Gods Bani, then all human desire will leave us, we will go from Manmukh to Gurmukh.

Yet I have never heard Guru ji tell a teenage boy or girl not to engage in thoughts about each other, nor to not court a relationship with each other. Can any of our sangat here perhaps show me wrong?

In addition we have as I say many studies which shows the damage done to the mental health of a person that tries too hard to deny such normal thoughts and feelings.

In the USA for example there is a Christian movement promoting sexual abstinace for Christian teenagers. Now as a result of this studies have shown that more of these teenagers(more than is normal for such a small set) have a skiwed and unhealty view of sex. That Anal and Oral sex is not sex for example. Can you see what this means?

Some American Christian teens are engaing in sodomy as a direct result of this absitince movement, sodomy is contray to what the bible preaches, yet these people do not belive they are having sex.

Guru ji warns us against the 5 thieves, and tells us that to be free of them we must be Gurmukh, we must not let these theives control us, but we can hardly deny them us all being human and mamukh, but as Sikhs we should endeavour not to let them control us.

 

[Zahim Nasir]

Rajneesh, I asked a simple question, you don't need to paste text from Islamic texts, trsut me I read more in my life than you have.

Simple question requires a Yes or No answer.

Would you expect your wife do have been ****ed ? :8-

 

[spnadmin]

Sorry Zahim ji

Rajneesh has said "no. " Because he is not as dumb as a plank of wood, he has been kind enough to give his answer with reasons. He is pointing out the implications of different choices and decisions. This demonstrates that he is capable both of making a decision and explaining his thought processes in a rational way. It is a gift from the Guru to be able to do that, decide in a rational way, rather than live in a mental straight-jacket where choices are made based solely on what a dangerously emotional authority figure orders you to do

 

[rajneesh madhok]

Dear friends,

Youth gets bail in elopement case Kolkata: - Kolkata - City - The Times of India

Kidnapping and marrying a girl below 18, is a crime which is to be charged under KIDNAPPING AND RAPE because marriage with an underage girl is supposed to be not legal. However a Muslim youth has claimed h has done it under Muslim Personal Law. So the judges have indirectly ruled. FOR MUSLIMS IT IS ALLOWED, MUSLIMS CAN KIDNAP 7 MARRY GIRLS UNDER 18 (MUSLIM OR HINDU)
Friends “Har Shakh pe ullu baitha hai anjam-e-gulistan kya hoga”
“Ek hi ullu kafi hai gulistan ki veerani ko, har shakh pe ullu baitha hai, anzam-e-gulistan kya hoga”

These are the kind of Court rulings which arouse community’s feeling of hatred towards each other.

Now come to the point had it been a Hindu/ Sikh/ Christian Boy who had kidnapped an underage girl (Muslim or Hindu) he would not have got Anticipatory Bail under any circumstances….

Now the question arise:

• Under such circumstances when the guardians have filed the petition to deliver the child-girl back to the custody of parents—guardians or in the alternative the court itself may be a guardian and send the child to a remand home for protection and further upbringings until the final disposal of the case.
• Why there is not a uniform civil code. When the country is one, one law should be applicable. Why the need of Personal laws came in to force, whether to benefit the individuals. Why not under such conditions any Social laws or civil laws are being followed.
• These type of cases have not been highlighted in media. Why it is so? It is because when such type of news are being aired and published then it is called that specific paper or channel is communal.
• The communities do not like to have such type of situation.
• Whether this is not the wrong interpretation of the Islamic law, in which before the Nikah consent of the girl’s parent is a must.
  

Rajneesh Madhok