Taking Amrit And After Taking Amrit

[Archived_Member1]

S. Shamsher Singh Ashok who has been an active member of the Singh Sabha movement and an erstwhile Research Scholar of the S.G.P.C., while discussing the prevalence of the use of 'Dastaar', states: "...and, consequently in the Amrit-Parchaar at the Akaal Takhat Sahib, this was a precondition even for ladies before they could be baptized there. Any woman who was not prepared to wear Dastaar was not baptized. This practice continued even after the end of the Gurudwara movement. Relaxation was made only when Giani Gurmukh Singh Musafar became the Jathedar of the Akaal Takhat."

Sikh Articles - Dastaar for Women

 

[Archived_Member1]

sorry for the duplicate posts, there was a glitch when i posted it.

 

[BhagatSingh]

Jasleen i know the story of mai bhago.2 years ago i raised this question with my late amritdhari grandmother.She clearly said that sikh women should not wear dastar
and my bhua (father' sister) who is also strict sikh woman also supported her .They said that nowhere it is written that it is mandatory for sikh women to wear dastar.There were
and are many amritdhari women in my relation's but not even a single woman wear dastar
.so I simply cannot beleive that if something is strictly recommended by guru gobind singh ji just vanished from sikh society.

is it mandatory for guys?? If it is then Sikhism does not say Women and Men are equal.

 

[Archived_Member1]

is it mandatory for guys?? If it is then Sikhism does not say Women and Men are equal.

your logic is a bit off... is it mandatory for guys? yes. that doesn't mean SIKHISM says men and women are not equal, that means modern rehet and/or punjabi culture do not acknowledge the inherent equality of sikhism.

 

[BhagatSingh]

your logic is a bit off... is it mandatory for guys? yes. that doesn't mean SIKHISM says men and women are not equal, that means modern rehet and/or punjabi culture do not acknowledge the inherent equality of sikhism.

Ok thanks for putting what I was trying to say, in better words. That's what I meant.

 

[spnadmin]

Jasleen ji

Duplicate post all taken care of.

 

[kds1980]

I just read 2 earlier debates about sikh women and dastar on sikhnet where inputs were provided by knowledgable persons and not even a single person said that dastar was mandatory for women for taking amrit

Also these days many sikh sites are publishing not so reliable facts to promote their agenda .

 

[kds1980]

I just read 2 earlier debates about sikh women and dastar on sikhnet where inputs were provided by knowledgable persons and not even a single person said that dastar was mandatory for women for taking amrit

Also these days many sikh sites are publishing not so reliable facts to promote their agenda .

 

[Archived_Member1]

I just read 2 earlier debates about sikh women and dastar on sikhnet where inputs were provided by knowledgable persons and not even a single person said that dastar was mandatory for women for taking amrit

Also these days many sikh sites are publishing not so reliable facts to promote their agenda .

a google search on S. Shamsher Singh" shows him to be a researcher and historian... probably a knowledgeable person.

just because it's not said on SPN doesn't mean it's not true.

but i'll look for more evidence. i too had never heard of it until today.

 

[kds1980]

Here is the portrait of Mata sundri ji

It is without dastar


The main question is if dastar was mandatory for women then why just it vanished from
sikh society until it was revived by akj and some other jatha's.The sikh's were spread in large area of india and if dastar vanished from one area due to some circumstances even then it could have survived in other area's.I simply cannot beleive that sikh women wearing dastar's just vanished from sikh society.

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The Sikhism Home Page: The Khalsa
Dastar:
Turban. A symbol of royalty and dignity. Historically the turban has been held in high esteem in eastern and middle eastern cultures. Guru Gobind Singh transformed this cultural symbol into a religious requirement so that the Khalsa would always have high self-esteem. It differentiates Sikhs from other religious followers who keep long hair but wear caps or keep matted hair. The turban cannot be covered by any other head gear or replaced by a cap or hat. The turban is mandatory for Sikh men and optional for Sikh women.
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So I think we should accept that it is optional for women and if sikh women feel's
stronger in dastar then they have every right to wear it but if sikh women want's to cover their head in chunni then too have right to do it.

 

[Archived_Member1]

that's a nice painting. who painted it? what year? were they working from menory? a description of her? or were they painting what they thought she should look like a hundred years after her death?

 

[Archived_Member1]

The main question is if dastar was mandatory for women then why just it vanished from
sikh society until it was revived by akj and some other jatha's.The sikh's were spread in large area of india and if dastar vanished from one area due to some circumstances even then it could have survived in other area's.I simply cannot beleive that sikh women wearing dastar's just vanished from sikh society.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The Sikhism Home Page: The Khalsa
Dastar:
Turban. A symbol of royalty and dignity. Historically the turban has been held in high esteem in eastern and middle eastern cultures. Guru Gobind Singh transformed this cultural symbol into a religious requirement so that the Khalsa would always have high self-esteem. It differentiates Sikhs from other religious followers who keep long hair but wear caps or keep matted hair. The turban cannot be covered by any other head gear or replaced by a cap or hat. The turban is mandatory for Sikh men and optional for Sikh women.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------]
So I think we should accept that it is optional for women and if sikh women feel's
stronger in dastar then they have every right to wear it but if sikh women want's to cover their head in chunni then too have right to do it.

ok, first, i never said it was required. you're the one who said women shouldn't wear it (according to your grandmother). yes, rehet says it's optional. i encourage it because i love the way it feels and so does every other kaur i've met who wears one.


also, descriptions and paintings of sikh women in battle showed them in dastaar. my guess would be that for riding horses into battle, a chunni is simply not enough to keep the head covered (it's hardly enough in daily life, let alone riding a horse!) so it's only natural to assume the women would wear a dastaar like the men. however, since the vast majority of sikh women did not fight in battles, they probably didn't see any need to wear it.

btw, i got a confirmation on the akal takht issue... my husband's family has been in amritsar for a couple hundred years. according to his father, women of his grandmother's generation did have to wear dastaars to take amrit at akal takht. however, most of them did not continue to wear the dastaar after the amrit ceremony.

 

[kds1980]

that's a nice painting. who painted it? what year? were they working from menory? a description of her? or were they painting what they thought she should look like a hundred years after her death?

You are right it could be the imagination of painter

Sikh Information Guru Nanak Gobind Singh

 

[kds1980]

ok, first, i never said it was required. you're the one who said women shouldn't wear it (according to your grandmother). yes, rehet says it's optional. i encourage it because i love the way it feels and so does every other kaur i've met who wears one.

I was just telling you some of traditional views held by sikhs like my grandmother

also, descriptions and paintings of sikh women in battle showed them in dastaar. my guess would be that for riding horses into battle, a chunni is simply not enough to keep the head covered (it's hardly enough in daily life, let alone riding a horse!) so it's only natural to assume the women would wear a dastaar like the men. however, since the vast majority of sikh women did not fight in battles, they probably didn't see any need to wear it.

Agreed that sikh women in battle wore dastar that's why i beleive its optional

btw, i got a confirmation on the akal takht issue... my husband's family has been in amritsar for a couple hundred years. according to his father, women of his grandmother's generation did have to wear dastaars to take amrit at akal takht. however, most of them did not continue to wear the dastaar after the amrit ceremony.

Good to know it .But what was the reason that they discontinued wearing dastar.

 

[Archived_Member1]

Good to know it .But what was the reason that they discontinued wearing dastar.

i wish i knew. probably the same reason they started wearing bindis, saris, and tying their hair low on their neck rather than in the traditional sikh topknot.

fashion, society, fitting in... who knows.

 

[BhagatSingh]

i wish i knew. probably the same reason they started wearing bindis, saris, and tying their hair low on their neck rather than in the traditional sikh topknot.

fashion, society, fitting in... who knows.

Ya I think that's the main reason.
But Kds Ji and Jasleen Ji cehck this painting out!

Google Image Result for http://asht.info/assets/images/BM_akalinihung_Large.jpg
As you can see the Akali's wife has a turban on.

 

[Archived_Member1]

Ya I think that's the main reason.
But Kds Ji and Jasleen Ji cehck this painting out!

Google Image Result for http://asht.info/assets/images/BM_akalinihung_Large.jpg
As you can see the Akali's wife has a turban on.

beautiful! this painting fits the description the british gave of sikh women they encountered... they said that the women had a high topknot with a white cloth draped over it, so that their head looked conical. just like in this pic.