Yogism Why Not Yoga Practices?

[simpy]

Why Guru Ji says 'NO' to yoga practices:


yoga saadhna and other practices are used to bring mind into a state of peace/calmness. but these effects are not permanent as mind is not 100% at peace. so need to use these methods again and again to bring your mind back into that state.

GURMAT- Dhan Dhan Guru Sahibaan da hukam, if we abide by Guru Ji's Wil, we come under Waheguru's Will, that in turn kills the EGO, which further leads to SANTOKH-> PEACE OF MIND-> ANAND. This state of mind is permanent. you don't need to depend on any breathing or chakra balance exercises to achieve it or improve it or to maintain it- IT IS ALL HAPPENING SAHAJ......

Mind becomes like water- READ

http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/spiritual-articles/15877-writing-on-water.html

Mind is easy to be tilted towards the JeevAtma- READ

http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/spiritual-articles/15874-the-spiritual-pendulum.html


ANOTHER IMPORTANT NOTE:


by using breathing or other chakra and else techniques to do Sadhna: your concentration is on HUMAN BODY AND ITS ENERGY- A TEMPORARY STATE OF BEING. All this withers away with body's death. not everlasting.

But by using these techniques you are creating a bond between mind and body, mind is getting permanently attached to physical body and its energy. Everytime you want to do Sadhna you need to use that bond. So even after physical death the yearning for a body and its energy remain.

Guru Sahib has given us many POINTERS, many many times.


humbly asking for everybody's forgiveness

 

[spnadmin]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Surinder ji, Welcome back!

Here is what you say a different way.

DnwsrI mhlw 5 ]

mWgau rwm qy siB Qok] mwnuK kau jwcq sRmu pweIAY pRB kY ismrin moK ]1] rhwau ] GoKy muin jn isMimRiq purwnW byd pukwrih GoK ] ikpw isMDu syiv scu pweIAY dovY suhyly lok ]1] Awn Acwr ibauhwr hY jyqy ibnu hir ismrn Pok ] nwnk jnm mrx BY kwty imil swDU ibnsy sok ]2]19]50]

DHANAASAREE, FIFTH MEHL:

I beg only from the Lord for all things. I would hesitate to beg from other people. Remembering God in meditation, liberation is obtained. || 1 || Pause || I have studied with the silent sages, and carefully read the Simritees, the Puraanas and the Vedas; they all proclaim that, by serving the Lord, the ocean of mercy, Truth is obtained, and both this world and the next are embellished.||1|| All other rituals and customs are useless, without remembering the Lord in meditation. O Nanak, the fear of birth and death has been removed; meeting the Holy Saint, sorrow is dispelled. || 2 || 19 || 50 || SGGS page 682

Sorry if Gurbani fonts aren't showing.

 

[Anoop]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

I respect your views on these. But ofcourse, Yoga does hellp one achieve salvation and a state of dive. For example, in order to have a good mind, you have to have good health. A healthy mind, and body, is important to run the healthy soul. Everything is connected. There is likely to be more diseases in this world, then before, because many people live unhealthy lifestyles, but cleaningness, of the mind through breathing exercises, and good habits do help people reach spiritual minds. The thing is, these pranayama exercises are benefited to people to build their roots in the spiritual missions in life. Of course nothing is a match when it comes to Waheguru Ji, but these yoga practices are for good causes, and its to help people to have fresh minds so that they can remember Waheguru ji. Its not always for the selfish part of the human body. It is to hard to actually become too pure. Cleaningness to mind and body is important for the soul. Otherwise, without good habbits, there is likely to be dirty thoughts, and a exhausted body, whethere is no use for participating in god actions

 

[simpy]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Respected Anoop Ji,

just a thought- why take a longer unsure route through small streets when there is a sure shorter straight highway?

and the purpose of this thread is to make people aware that YOGA SAADHNA IS NOT RECOMENDED BY GURU JI, Rather Guru Ji says:

pwTu piVE Aru bydu bIcwirE invil BuAMgm swDy ] pMc jnw isau sMgu n CutikE AiDk AhMbuiD bwDy ]1] ipAwry ien ibiD imlxu n jweI mY kIey krm Anykw ] hwir pirE suAwmI kY duAwrY dIjY buiD ibbykw ] rhwau ]




English Translations-They read scriptures, and contemplate the Vedas; they practice the inner cleansing techniques of Yoga, and control of the breath. But they cannot escape from the company of the five passions; they are increasingly bound to egotism. || 1 || O Beloved, this is not the way to meet the Lord; I have performed these rituals so many times. I have collapsed, exhausted, at the Door of my Lord Master; I pray that He may grant me a discerning intellect. || Pause ||


Anoop Ji Gurmat does not support any yoga etc. for Sipiritual uplift.
these yoga methods do not kill EGO, infact they glorify it.
the action of Being faithful to God/Guru purifies(cleanse) mind for GOOD.
Cleanliness of body should not have anything to do with yoga.
the very first good habit for a gursikh should be- try to come under Guru Ji's Hukam.


We want to use these yoga and other things as physical exercise, fine. we are becoming health conscious more and more everyday, why not. BUT THIS IS NOT CLASSIFIED AS GURMAT, only this me neech is trying to convey.

another point me neech want to make:

The thing is, these pranayama exercises are benefited to people to build their roots in the spiritual missions in life.

Anoop Ji most of these people are mixing up Sidhies with the spritual advancement. With yoga practices only Sidhies are achieved. no spiritual progress. Spritual mission requires a calm mind with a good control over kaam krodh lobh moh and hankaar.

forgive me please

 

[simpy]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Surinder ji, Welcome back!

Here is what you say a different way.

DnwsrI mhlw 5 ]

mWgau rwm qy siB Qok] mwnuK kau jwcq sRmu pweIAY pRB kY ismrin moK ]1] rhwau ] GoKy muin jn isMimRiq purwnW byd pukwrih GoK ] ikpw isMDu syiv scu pweIAY dovY suhyly lok ]1] Awn Acwr ibauhwr hY jyqy ibnu hir ismrn Pok ] nwnk jnm mrx BY kwty imil swDU ibnsy sok ]2]19]50]

DHANAASAREE, FIFTH MEHL:

I beg only from the Lord for all things. I would hesitate to beg from other people. Remembering God in meditation, liberation is obtained. || 1 || Pause || I have studied with the silent sages, and carefully read the Simritees, the Puraanas and the Vedas; they all proclaim that, by serving the Lord, the ocean of mercy, Truth is obtained, and both this world and the next are embellished.||1|| All other rituals and customs are useless, without remembering the Lord in meditation. O Nanak, the fear of birth and death has been removed; meeting the Holy Saint, sorrow is dispelled. || 2 || 19 || 50 || SGGS page 682

Sorry if Gurbani fonts aren't showing.

Respected aad0002 ji,

it is ok, Gurbani font thing is really something confusing. anyways i simply read it in a word document as i have all different kinds of gurmukhi fonts. i am going to make a request to Aman ji about this issue. may be something can be done . we will see.

thanks for the Gurbani Shabad. let us add even more shabdas in this thread. this issue must be addressed.

thanks

humbly asking for everybody's forgiveness

 

[spnadmin]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Surinder ji

There is always a pattern. The hukamnamas for the past several days have been speaking to your thoughts on this thread. There should be many more posts that echo your thinking. Your words and these banis are important because they make us focus on what is important , and help us to develop a "discerning intellect" (Guru Nanaak's words) -- to separate those things that are at the core of belief from things that are interesting but not at the core of belief.

Thank you for looking into the font problem. I know there are some frustrated readers out there.


Thanks back to you on both counts. The font problem and the hope for more shabds.

 

[ekmusafir_ajnabi]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Surinder Kaur ji,

Is this your personal experience? Your statement is not qualified!

Try yoga assans for 6 months and then make a statement based on your experience.

I feel you misunderstand Yoga and have misunderstood Bani too. You are being too impulsive.

I put forward to you the last verse of the shabad. Please contemplate!


ਕਹੁ ਨਾਨਕ ਤਿਸੁ ਭਇਓ ਪਰਾਪਤਿ ਜਿਸੁ ਪੁਰਬ ਲਿਖੇ ਕਾ ਲਹਨਾ ॥੮॥
कहु नानक तिसु भइओ परापति जिसु पुरब लिखे का लहना ॥८॥
Kaho Nānak ṯis bẖa­i­o parāpaṯ jis purab likẖė kā lahnā. ||8||
Says Nanak, he alone obtains it, who is pre-destined to receive it. ||8||
ਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਫੁਰਮਾਉਂਦੇ ਹਨ, ਕੇਵਲ ਓਹੀ ਇਸ ਨੂੰ ਪਾਉਂਦਾ ਹੈ ਜਿਸ ਦੇ ਲਈ ਇਸ ਦਾ ਮਿਲਣਾ ਮੁੱਢ ਤੋਂ ਲਿਖਿਆ ਹੋਇਆ ਹੈ।

Mind becomes like water

This is a very poor analogy. Water always flows downhill. It is for every changing and does not know right or wrong. It does not have its own identity and assumes the identity it harbours. Once water has completed its journey, ask it if it remembers its original shape? It does not know. Can it find its origin? Can it get back? Answer will be No!! It carries unnecessary rubbish on its way and polutes. We need to be free our rubbish and our pollutants and need to remember our Origin to go back home.

Apollogies for this interruption.

Mera mujme kuj nahi, Jo kuj hai so tera
Tera tujko sompte kya lage mera.

 

[simpy]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Respected Saadh Sangat Ji,

Guru Ji da kehna hai-

kar kar karna likh le jah.......

and Dear Respected Ekmusafir Ji,

the line that you are saying comes in the following Shabad- if you still dont believe it, your choice.

soriT mhlw 5 Gru 2 AstpdIAw​

sorath mehulaa 5 ghur 2 asuttupudheeaa​

Sorat'h, Fifth Mehl, Second House, Ashtapadees:​

​

<> siqgur pRswid ]​

ik ounkaar sathigur prusaadh ​

One Universal Creator God. By The Grace Of The True Guru:​

​

pwTu piVE Aru bydu bIcwirE invil BuAMgm swDy ]​

paath parriou ar baedh beechaariou nival bhuangum saadhae​

They read scriptures, and contemplate the Vedas; they practice the inner cleansing techniques of Yoga, and control of the breath.​

​

pMc jnw isau sMgu n CutikE AiDk AhMbuiD bwDy ]1]​

punch junaa sio sung n shuttakiou adhik ahunbudh baadhae​

But they cannot escape from the company of the five passions; they are increasingly bound to egotism. ||1||​

​

ipAwry ien ibiD imlxu n jweI mY kIey krm Anykw ]​

piaarae ein bidh milun n jaaee mai keeeae kurum anaekaa​

O Beloved, this is not the way to meet the Lord; I have performed these rituals so many times.​

​

hwir pirE suAwmI kY duAwrY dIjY buiD ibbykw ] rhwau ]​

haar pariou suaamee kai dhuaarai dheejai budh bibaekaa​

I have collapsed, exhausted, at the Door of my Lord Master; I pray that He may grant me a discerning intellect. ||Pause||​

​

moin BieE krpwqI rihE ngn iPirE bn mwhI ]​

mon bhaeiou kurupaathee rehiou nugun firiou bun maahee​

One may remain silent and use his hands as begging bowls, and wander naked in the forest.​

​

qt qIrQ sB DrqI BRimE duibDw CutkY nwhI ]2]​

thutt theeruth subh dhuruthee bhramiou dhubidhaa shuttukai naahee​

He may make pilgrimages to river banks and sacred shrines all over the world, but his sense of duality will not leave him. ||2||​

​

mn kwmnw qIrQ jwie bisE isir krvq Drwey ]​

mun kaamunaa theeruth jaae basiou sir kuruvuth dhuraaeae​

His mind's desires may lead him to go and dwell at sacred places of pilgrimage, and offer his head to be sawn off;​

​

mn kI mYlu n auqrY ieh ibiD jy lK jqn krwey ]3]​

mun kee mail n outhurai eih bidh jae lukh juthun kuraaeae​

but this will not cause the filth of his mind to depart, even though he may make thousands of efforts. ||3||​

​

kink kwimnI hYvr gYvr bhu ibiD dwnu dwqwrw ]​

kanik kaaminee haivur gaivur buhu bidh dhaan dhaathaaraa​

He may give gifts of all sorts - gold, women, horses and elephants.​

​

AMn bsqR BUim bhu Arpy nh imlIAY hir duAwrw ]4]​

ann busuthr bhoom buhu arupae neh mileeai har dhuaaraa​

He may make offerings of corn, clothes and land in abundance, but this will not lead him to the Lord's Door. ||4||​

​

pUjw Arcw bMdn fMfauq Ktu krmw rqu rhqw ]​

poojaa aruchaa bundhun ddunddouth khutt kurumaa ruth rehuthaa​

He may remain devoted to worship and adoration, bowing his forehead to the floor, practicing the six religious rituals.​

​

hau hau krq bMDn mih pirAw nh imlIAY ieh jugqw ]5]​

ho ho kuruth bundhun mehi pariaa neh mileeai eih juguthaa​

He indulges in egotism and pride, and falls into entanglements, but he does not meet the Lord by these devices. ||5||​

​

jog isD Awsx caurwsIh ey BI kir kir rihAw ]​

jog sidh aasun chouraaseeh eae bhee kar kar rehiaa​

He practices the eighty-four postures of Yoga, and acquires the supernatural powers of the Siddhas, but he gets tired of practicing these.​

​

vfI Awrjw iPir iPir jnmY hir isau sMgu n gihAw ]6]​

vuddeeaarujaa fir fir junumai har sio sung n gehiaa​

He lives a long life, but is reincarnated again and again; he has not met with the Lord. ||6||​

​

rwj lIlw rwjn kI rcnw kirAw hukmu APwrw ]​

raaj leelaa raajun kee ruchunaa kariaa hukum afaaraa​

He may enjoy princely pleasures, and regal pomp and ceremony, and issue unchallenged commands.​

​

syj sohnI cMdnu coAw nrk Gor kw duAwrw ]7]​

saej sohunee chundhun choaa nuruk ghor kaa dhuaaraa​

He may lie on beautiful beds, perfumed with sandalwood oil, but this will led him only to the gates of the most horrible hell. ||7||​

​

hir kIriq swDsMgiq hY isir krmn kY krmw ]​

har keerath saadhusungath hai sir kurumun kai kurumaa​

Singing the Kirtan of the Lord's Praises in the Saadh Sangat, the Company of the Holy, is the highest of all actions.​

​

khu nwnk iqsu BieE prwpiq ijsu purb ilKy kw lhnw ]8]​

kuhu naanuk this bhaeiou puraapath jis purub likhae kaa lehunaa​

Says Nanak, he alone obtains it, who is pre-destined to receive it. ||8||​

​

qyro syvku ieh rMig mwqw ]​

thaero saevuk eih rung maathaa​

Your slave is intoxicated with this Love of Yours.​

​

BieE ik®pwlu dIn duK BMjnu hir hir kIrqin iehu mnu rwqw ] rhwau dUjw ]1]3]​

bhaeiou kirupaal dheen dhukh bhunjun har har keeruthan eihu mun raathaa​

The Destroyer of the pains of the poor has become merciful to me, and this mind is imbued with the Praises of the Lord, Har, Har. ||Second Pause||1||3||​

​

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​

there is no need of proof from others if one believes in Guru Ji. Proofs are asked by those who have doubts, Gurmukhs follow Guru Ji's word.​

humbly asking for everybody's forgiveness​

 

[simpy]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Respected Saadh Sangat Ji,

mention of water in Dhan Dhan Siri Guru Granth Sahib Ji:

pwxI ivchu rqn aupMny myru kIAw mwDwxI ]

pauxu pwxI suMnY qy swjy ]
isRsit aupwie kwieAw gV rwjy ]
Agin pwxI jIau joiq qumwrI suMny klw rhwiedw ]

pvxu gurU pwxI ipqw mwqw Driq mhqu ]


it all depends what is our approach and how we take everything. a drug can be used properly and a disease can be cured, OR it can be miused to whatever wrong measures................


humbly asking for everybody's forgiveness

 

[spnadmin]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Respected Saadh Sangat Ji,

mention of water in Dhan Dhan Siri Guru Granth Sahib Ji:

pwxI ivchu rqn aupMny myru kIAw mwDwxI ]

pauxu pwxI suMnY qy swjy ]
isRsit aupwie kwieAw gV rwjy ]
Agin pwxI jIau joiq qumwrI suMny klw rhwiedw ]

pvxu gurU pwxI ipqw mwqw Driq mhqu ]


it all depends what is our approach and how we take everything. a drug can be used properly and a disease can be cured, OR it can be miused to whatever wrong measures................


humbly asking for everybody's forgiveness

Surinder ji, Ekmusafir ji, Anoop ji, and respected forum readers,

No one is questioning whether yoga practices make you feel better, physically and mentally poised, relaxed, etc. There are even those who argue that yoga will create a proper state of focus and relaxation that cleanses and readies a person for meditation. Perhaps they are correct. Rather, the question becomes: Is one of necessity closer to spiritual cleansing and ultimately to Waheguru because of sadhana?

Think of the fable of the frog and the centipede. They met not far from a pond. The frog asked the centipede, How do you manage to walk so well with 100 legs? Which leg do you move first, and second, and then third? The centipede said, I will demonstrate. He focused his mind. To the dismay of the centipede, he was unable to move. To the delight of the frog, he had a quick snack.

The point of the story-- there are times when conscious effort will lead to failure. What is lost, again in the words of Nanaak , is "intuitive ease" .

And from my personal experience , Veer ji-- the effort to extend the effort just 5, 10, 15 more minutes of this pose or that pose comes from the sneaky side of my Ego. Think about it!

How wise Nanaak ji!

 

[simpy]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Respected Saadh Sangat Ji,

Dhan Dhan Siri Guru Nanak Dev Ji Sache Patshah De Bachan-




jogu n iKMQw jogu n fMfY jogu n Bsm cVweIAY ]
jogu n muMdI mUMif mufwieAY jogu n isM|I vweIAY ]
AMjn mwih inrMjin rhIAY jog jugiq iev pweIAY ]1]
glI jogu n hoeI ]
eyk idRsit kir smsir jwxY jogI khIAY soeI ]1] rhwau ]
jogu n bwhir mVI mswxI jogu n qwVI lweIAY ]
jogu n dyis idsMqir BivAY jogu n qIriQ nweIAY ]
AMjn mwih inrMjin rhIAY jog jugiq iev pweIAY ]2]
siqguru BytY qw shsw qUtY Dwvqu vrij rhweIAY ]
inJru JrY shj Duin lwgY Gr hI prcw pweIAY ]
AMjn mwih inrMjin rhIAY jog jugiq iev pweIAY ]3]
nwnk jIviqAw mir rhIAY AYsw jogu kmweIAY ]
vwjy bwJhu isM|I vwjY qau inrBau pdu pweIAY ]
AMjn mwih inrMjin rhIAY jog jugiq qau pweIAY ]4]1]8]



English Translation(SikhiToTheMax):

Soohee, First Mehl, Seventh House:
One Universal Creator God. By The Grace Of The True Guru:
Yoga is not the patched coat, Yoga is not the walking stick. Yoga is not smearing the body with ashes.
Yoga is not the ear-rings, and not the shaven head. Yoga is not the blowing of the horn.
Remaining unblemished in the midst of the filth of the world - this is the way to attain Yoga. ||1||
By mere words, Yoga is not attained.
One who looks upon all with a single eye, and knows them to be one and the same - he alone is known as a Yogi. ||1||Pause||
Yoga is not wandering to the tombs of the dead; Yoga is not sitting in trances.
Yoga is not wandering through foreign lands; Yoga is not bathing at sacred shrines of pilgrimage.
Remaining unblemished in the midst of the filth of the world - this is the way to attain Yoga. ||2||
Meeting with the True Guru, doubt is dispelled, and the wandering mind is restrained.
Nectar rains down, celestial music resounds, and deep within, wisdom is obtained.
Remaining unblemished in the midst of the filth of the world - this is the way to attain Yoga. ||3||
O Nanak, remain dead while yet alive - practice such a Yoga.
When the horn is blown without being blown, then you shall attain the state of fearless dignity.
Remaining unblemished in the midst of the filth of the world - this is the way to attain Yoga. ||4||1||8||

Gurmukhi Translation(Bhai Sahib Bhai Sahib Singh Ji):

ਗੋਦੜੀ ਪਹਿਨ ਲੈਣਾ ਪਰਮਾਤਮਾ ਨਾਲ ਮਿਲਾਪ ਦਾ ਸਾਧਨ ਨਹੀਂ ਹੈ, ਡੰਡਾ ਹੱਥ ਵਿਚ ਫੜ ਲਿਆਂ ਹਰੀ-ਮੇਲ ਨਹੀਂ ਹੋ ਜਾਂਦਾ, ਜੇ ਸਰੀਰ ਉਤੇ ਸੁਆਹ ਮਲ ਲਈਏ ਤਾਂ ਭੀ ਪ੍ਰਭੂ ਦਾ ਮਿਲਾਪ ਨਹੀਂ ਹੁੰਦਾ। (ਕੰਨਾਂ ਵਿਚ) ਮੁੰਦ੍ਰਾਂ ਪਾਇਆਂ ਰੱਬ ਦਾ ਮੇਲ ਨਹੀਂ, ਜੇ ਸਿਰ ਮੁਨਾ ਲਈਏ ਤਾਂ ਭੀ ਪ੍ਰਭੂ-ਮਿਲਾਪ ਨਹੀਂ ਹੋ ਸਕਦਾ, ਸਿੰਙੀ ਵਜਾਇਆਂ ਭੀ ਜੋਗ ਸਿੱਧ ਨਹੀਂ ਹੋ ਜਾਂਦਾ।
ਪਰਮਾਤਮਾ ਨਾਲ ਮਿਲਾਪ ਦਾ ਢੰਗ ਸਿਰਫ਼ ਇਸ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਹੀ ਹਾਸਲ ਹੁੰਦਾ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਮਾਇਆ ਦੇ ਮੋਹ ਦੀ ਕਾਲਖ ਵਿਚ ਰਹਿੰਦਿਆਂ ਹੀ ਮਾਇਆ ਤੋਂ ਨਿਰਲੇਪ ਪ੍ਰਭੂ ਵਿਚ ਜੁੜੇ ਰਹੀਏ।੧।
ਨਿਰੀਆਂ ਗੱਲਾਂ ਕਰਨ ਨਾਲ ਪ੍ਰਭੂ-ਮਿਲਾਪ ਨਹੀਂ ਹੁੰਦਾ। ਉਹੀ ਮਨੁੱਖ ਜੋਗੀ ਅਖਵਾ ਸਕਦਾ ਹੈ ਜੋ ਇਕੋ ਜੇਹੀ ਨਿਗਾਹ ਨਾਲ ਸਭ (ਜੀਵਾਂ) ਨੂੰ ਬਰਾਬਰ (ਦੇ ਇਨਸਾਨ) ਸਮਝੇ।੧।ਰਹਾਉ।
(ਘਰੋਂ) ਬਾਹਰ ਮੜ੍ਹੀਆਂ ਵਿਚ ਮਸਾਣਾਂ ਵਿਚ ਰਿਹਾਂ ਪ੍ਰਭੂ-ਮੇਲ ਨਹੀਂ ਹੁੰਦਾ, ਸਮਾਧੀਆਂ ਲਾਇਆਂ ਭੀ ਰੱਬ ਨਹੀਂ ਮਿਲਦਾ। ਜੇ ਦੇਸ ਪਰਦੇਸ ਵਿਚ ਭੌਂਦੇ ਫਿਰੀਏ ਤਾਂ ਭੀ ਪ੍ਰਭੂ-ਮਿਲਾਪ ਨਹੀਂ ਹੁੰਦਾ। ਤੀਰਥ ਉਤੇ ਇਸ਼ਨਾਨ ਕੀਤਿਆਂ ਭੀ ਪ੍ਰਭੂ-ਪ੍ਰਾਪਤੀ ਨਹੀਂ।
ਪਰਮਾਤਮਾ ਨਾਲ ਮਿਲਾਪ ਦਾ ਢੰਗ ਸਿਰਫ਼ ਇਸ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਹੀ ਆਉਂਦਾ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਮਾਇਆ ਦੇ ਮੋਹ ਦੀ ਕਾਲਖ ਵਿਚ ਰਹਿੰਦਿਆਂ ਹੀ ਮਾਇਆ ਤੋਂ ਨਿਰਲੇਪ ਪ੍ਰਭੂ ਵਿਚ ਜੁੜੇ ਰਹੀਏ।੨।
ਜਦੋਂ ਗੁਰੂ ਮਿਲ ਪਏ ਤਾਂ ਮਨ ਦਾ ਸਹਿਮ ਮੁੱਕ ਜਾਂਦਾ ਹੈ, ਵਿਕਾਰਾਂ ਵਲ ਦੌੜਦੇ ਮਨ ਨੂੰ ਰੋਕ ਕੇ ਰੱਖ ਸਕੀਦਾ ਹੈ, (ਮਨ ਵਿਚ ਪ੍ਰਭੂ ਦੇ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਨਾਮ ਦਾ ਇਕ) ਚਸ਼ਮਾ ਚੱਲ ਪੈਂਦਾ ਹੈ, ਅਡੋਲ ਅਵਸਥਾ ਦੀ ਰੌ ਬਣ ਜਾਂਦੀ ਹੈ; ਹਿਰਦੇ ਦੇ ਅੰਦਰ ਹੀ ਪਰਮਾਤਮਾ ਨਾਲ ਸਾਂਝ ਬਣ ਜਾਂਦੀ ਹੈ।
ਪਰਮਾਤਮਾ ਨਾਲ ਮਿਲਾਪ ਦੀ ਜਾਚ ਸਿਰਫ਼ ਇਸੇ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਆਉਂਦੀ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਮਾਇਆ ਦੇ ਮੋਹ ਦੀ ਕਾਲਖ ਵਿਚ ਰਹਿੰਦਿਆਂ ਹੀ ਮਾਇਆ ਤੋਂ ਨਿਰਲੇਪ ਪ੍ਰਭੂ ਵਿਚ ਜੁੜੇ ਰਹੀਏ।੩।
ਹੇ ਨਾਨਕ! ਪਰਮਾਤਮਾ ਦੇ ਮਿਲਾਪ ਦਾ ਅੱਭਿਆਸ ਇਉਂ ਕਰਨਾ ਚਾਹੀਦਾ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਦੁਨੀਆ ਦੇ ਕਾਰ-ਵਿਹਾਰ ਕਰਦਿਆਂ ਹੀ ਵਿਕਾਰਾਂ ਵਲੋਂ ਪਰੇ ਹਟੇ ਰਹਿਣਾ ਚਾਹੀਦਾ ਹੈ। (ਜੋਗੀ ਤਾਂ ਸਿੰਙ ਦਾ ਵਾਜਾ ਵਜਾਂਦਾ ਹੈ, ਪਰ ਸਿਮਰਨ-ਅੱਭਿਆਸ ਕਰਨ ਵਾਲੇ ਦੇ ਅੰਦਰ ਇਕ ਅਜੇਹਾ ਸੁਰੀਲਾ ਆਨੰਦ ਬਣਦਾ ਹੈ ਕਿ, ਮਾਨੋ) ਬਿਨਾ ਵਾਜਾ ਵਜਾਇਆਂ ਸਿੰਙ ਦਾ ਵਾਜਾ ਵੱਜ ਰਿਹਾ ਹੈ। (ਜਦੋਂ ਮਨੁੱਖ ਇਸ ਆਤਮਕ ਆਨੰਦ ਨੂੰ ਮਾਣਨ ਲੱਗ ਪੈਂਦਾ ਹੈ) ਤਦੋਂ ਉਹ ਐਸੀ ਆਤਮਕ ਅਵਸਥਾ ਪ੍ਰਾਪਤ ਕਰ ਲੈਂਦਾ ਹੈ ਜਿਸ ਵਿਚ ਕਿਸੇ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਦਾ ਕੋਈ ਡਰ ਨਹੀਂ ਰਹਿ ਜਾਂਦਾ।
ਜਦੋਂ ਮਾਇਆ ਦੇ ਮੋਹ ਦੀ ਕਾਲਖ ਵਿਚ ਰਹਿੰਦਿਆਂ ਹੀ ਮਾਇਆ ਤੋਂ ਨਿਰਲੇਪ ਪ੍ਰਭੂ ਵਿਚ ਜੁੜੇ ਰਹਿ ਸਕੀਏ, ਤਦੋਂ ਪ੍ਰਭੂ-ਮਿਲਾਪ ਦੀ ਜਾਚ ਆ ਜਾਂਦੀ ਹੈ।੪।੧।੮।

It is very clearly described in Gurbani: ‘WHAT IS THE REAL JOG’- it is not in yoga asnaa/sadhna, it is in the MANN Di SADHNAA, It is in remaining dead while alive……………

Mann sadhe sidh hoi
Mann jeetay jag jeet

Jog happens, it is not done by controlling breath and other assanaas. Jog happens if mind is in waheguru ji's sharan, if mind has lost its iness......................

humbly asking for everybody’s forgiveness

 

[Satyaban]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

My respected friends

It is my understanding that Yoga is whatever one practises to attain total reunion with ""God" the creator. Hatha Yoga or posturing is one, Bahkti Yoga practices total love for "God", meditation is another plus there is Karma Yoga and others.

Of course I am not a Sikh but I think it is spiritual to seek contact The Creator by lossing our attachments to this temporary ever changing
realm of time and space.

Peace
Satyaban

 

[simpy]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Respected dear Satyadab Ji

Yoga/Jog is the union of atma and parmatma.

the term- 'yoga practices' widely used for YOGA SADHNA- like rajaa yoga, hathaa yoga etc.
These practices are used to bring the mind to a state of calmness, BUT THIS STATE OF MIND ONLY STAYS FOR A LIMITED PERIOD OF TIME. one has to use the same methods again and again to bring that state of mind. JUST LIKE RUNNING etc. EFFECT IS NOT PERMANENT. So by Yoga practitioners Sadhna/arradhna is done using these techniques

our Guru Sahibaan has given us a permanent way out to get to Anand, living under God's Will.

Sikh way of Bhagti includes-
recognizing the truth-GOD
coming under God's Will
His Simran
Kirtan of Gurbani
Contemplation of Gurbani
Selfless Seva

needs pure spiritual devotion, unshakable faith and
unconditional love.

satyaban ji, you may be equating it with bhagti yoga and karma yoga- but REMEMBER SIKHS DONT BELIEVE IN ANY RITUALS AND PAKHANDS LIKE murti puja, fasting, shirking responsibilities etc-

murti puja is done by bhagti yoga practitioners, this is one of their main practice. For a sikh God is in all, not just in a piece of stone...

And Sikhs live a life of full social and family resposibilities, not like Bhagti yoga practitioners who completely shirk from responsibilities.

Sikhs live family life, they dont believe in celebacy like bhagti yoga practitioners do.

Sikhs sing Kirtan from Dhan Dhan Siri Guru Granth Sahib Ji- DHUR KI BANI- not the songs written by anybody like Bhagti yoga practitioners do.

Sikhs dont believe in concentrating on deep breathing exercises and chakra meditations as many bhagti yoga practitioners do these days.

Sikhs contemplate on Gurbani, they follow Shabad Guru. They contemplate on Gurbani in Sangat. no tell tales.


Sikhs live a normal life- no indulgence in the practices of Silence(moan vart), fasting etc. not like bhagti yoga people do....

NO FALSE RITUALS are practiced by True Sikhs.

humbly asking for everybody's forgiveness

 

[jag1t]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Respected Surinder Kaur Cheema ji,

Thanks for your learned thoughts on the subject.
Apparently you have a good knowledge about Gurbani and sikhism as well as knowledge about Yog (not as generally referred to as Yoga). [Yog is mentioned (pronounced) as Jog in Punjabi, happens to be my nick name (lol).]

But what about experience. Tasting a single grain of mustard is of more consequence than seeing a camel load.

Sikhs are human. Therefore what applies to humans also applies to Sikhs. Spiritually (not necessarily religously), it is generally taken that the goal is union of the human individual soul with God, the universal soul. Yog and Gurbani have this same aim. Yog is thousands of years old Gurbani is hundreds. Gurbani mentions its own view and concept of Yog/Jog. It does not deny or reject Yog per se, but states (according to our Gurus) as to what is not Yog and what it is.

Over the long passage of time many types and concepts of Yog have evolved and continue to do so. Should we say to each his own?

Yog is union,if we say that Gurbani too is also about an ultimate union (jall with jall) then its about Yog / Jog.

A few thoughts maybe many more will follow.

Dont do just be.

Regards.

jag1t

 

[simpy]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Respected Saadh Sangat Ji,

first of all- this is not my thoughts/knowledge(nothing is mine)- i am only emphasising Guru Ji's WORD. and i will keep doing it...................


Respected and Righteous jag1t ji,

first of all, Is 'Guru's word' more important or my experience/your experience??????
How can you say- "i am a better judge than Guru Ji", " my experience is over and above Guru Ji's WORD"?????
And if one is thinking like this- what it shows, me neech doesn't have to say anything, every word is speaking for itself....


We are discussing this topic under Gurmat Vichar-And very clearly - We are talking about Guru Ji's WORD. All over it says- Naam Simar...... Guru Ji very CLEARLY rejected Yoga Sadhna through yoga Asnaa, inner cleansing techniques of Yoga, and control of the breath. SO I STARTED THIS THREAD, TO MAKE PEOPLE AWARE-WHAT GURU JI IS SAYING, as me neech noticed some members were suggesting breath control techniches of yoga under Gurmat Section.

JUST MAKING GURSIKHS AWARE OF THE TRUTH, MY DEAR. YOU LIKE THESE METHODS, GOOD FOR YOU. BUT GURU JI DOESN'T APPROVE IT. ME NEECH IS ONLY TRYING TO BRING THE MISLEAD ONES BACK ON THE RIGHT TRACK. BUT NOT FORCING ANYBODY, IT IS ALL THEIR CHOICE, ONLY REPEATING AGAIN AND AGAIN- GURU JI'S WORD, somebody may be able to hear it .................

For a Sikh WHO IS THE GURU- Dhan Dhan Siri Guru Granth Sahib Ji

i hope you agree with me neech on this.

if not, nobody stops anybody from following whoever......

Sikh follows Guru Granth Sahib Ji- WORD- Dhur Ki Bani------

And Gursikh is supposed to OBEY Guru Ji- DO YOU AGREE???????

If you are really into yoga asnaa/sadhna or other things like that, i suggest start something under interfaith or general disscussion sections- as per 'Guru Ji': 'Naam Simran and Hukam ch rehna, contemplation of Naam.....' is THE ONLY WAY-

nwim rqw siqgurU hY kiljug boihQu hoie ]
gurmuiK hovY su pwir pvY ijnw AMdir scw soie ]
nwmu sm@wly nwmu sMgRhY nwmy hI piq hoie ]
nwnk siqguru pwieAw krim prwpiq hoie ]


rwmu ismir rwmu ismir iehY qyrY kwij hY ]

Ab klU AwieE ry ]
ieku nwmu bovhu bovhu ]

forgive me please

 

[simpy]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Yog is thousands of years old Gurbani is hundreds.

Respected and Righteous Jag1t Ji,

some Gurbani for you: As Gurbani is not limited to time and space


vwhu vwhu bwxI inrMkwr hY iqsu jyvfu Avru n koie ]
Nirankaar has no age.........


bwxI vjI chu jugI sco scu suxwie ]
Throughout the four ages- Gurbani is Vibrating my dear.....


AMimRq bwxI hir hir qyrI ]
Amrit does not get old............




and there is no limit to truth or is there any????

Sach ta pur jaaneeay je riday sacha hoey...................

humbly asking for everybody's forgiveness

 

[spnadmin]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Jagjit ji

An eagle is a bird; a raven is a bird. They are not the same bird. A Baptist is a Christian; a Lutheran is a Christian. These are not the same religion. Yog can lead to union with God; Simran can lead to union with God. They are not the same. ???????? WHY NOT? The answer is important.

Plant the Naam, the Name of the One Lord.
It is not the season to plant other seeds.

Apologies Surinder but I borrowed your verse from another thread.

 

[jag1t]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Respected respondents,

Would like to thankyou both for your indulgence.

May i mention a few points which may appear to be out of context but may also be the core:

All is One and there is nothing (else) but one.

Then who is Guru, who are you (others) and most important and crucial, Who am I?

Regards.

jag1t

 

[simpy]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

very well said Righeous jag1t ji, then why even yoga?????

all those who are not at your level of realization need GURU JI , and all those who love Guru Ji need Guru Ji irrespective of their state of mind....................................


humbly asking for everybody's forgiveness

 

[jag1t]

Surinder ji nice hearing from you.

May i seek your permission to jump quite a little way ahead.

For the knower of Truth (the word) why disappears.

It also disappears for One who is tottaly in submission to 'Hukam' (same as knower of Truth).