BHOOTS (Ghosts) And PRETS (Demons) In GURBANI ? Must We THROW WATER AT HARDWAAR ?

[spnadmin]

The question here is "do evil spirits exist in view of Gur Vichar"?

Gurbani gives remedy for countering evil spirits. A remedy can only be suggested if there is a cause of threat. To overcome the threat from evil spirits Gurbani says "Repeat the name of God and no evil spirit can harm you".

This thread has been twisting in circles for days now. There is probably no room for compromise where supernatural creatures are concerned. But the thread needs to refocus.

Before I continue, will all glance to the top of the thread, read the title, and reflect on its meaning? Guru Nanak, in the face of devotees who were throwing water toward the sun to honor their ancestors at Haridwaar (doorway to Hari), decided instead to throw water in the opposite direction, toward his far away fields where more good would be done.

Now I continue. Does anyone agree that the story of Haridwaar signals Guru Nanak wanted to free us from superstitions that had become deeply buried in the imagination, folklore and religious traditions of the civilization of the Indus valley?

If you do agree, then why the references to bhoots and prets and other supernatural forms in Gurbani?

If you do not agree, then what was Guru Nanak's real purpose at Haridwaar, other than turning his back on the door to Hari and insulting the devotees?

 

[Gyani Jarnail Singh]

In order to have a Happy LIFE..
we must get rid of 2 things..

DEBTS and DOUBTS. BOTH these are discussed in GURBANI.....DUALITY is to be discarded...DOUBTS thrown aside..and an Honest hard worker who earns and Shares cant have "DEBTS".

2. Since Guru nanak ji did "THROW WATER"...are we also saying we too MUST THROW WATER - even if its in the OPPOSITE DIRECTION ?? The Proof is there..Guru ji DID IT !!

SAME argument is being used to push us into "beleiving" GURBANI admits imps exist...IT DOES NOT. PERIOD.

 

[Harry Haller]

Gurbani has given us the remedy for threats (if one has) FROM EVIL SPIRITS to rely on GurbanI and repete of God's name.

I believe this to be a basic interpretation of a solution to a basic interpretation of a problem. What you are lauding amounts to the very thing I believe Guru Nanak was protesting against, the chanting of Gods name alone achieves nothing.

Man faces threats from several angles and he looks around for remedies. The threat from evil spirits to be met with repetition of God's name "Sas Giras"

This reminds me of a story in the press a while back, a nigerian christian nurse was called to a young baby who was quite ill, as the baby got worse, according to the parents, the nurse kept running round the room shouting 'jesus help me, jesus help me', I think the child died....

There is a threat to India from China. We contemplate on how to overcome this threat. Saying there is no China will not help. China exists, a threat is also there

a bad analogy, I can see China...

I have not started this discussion but Harry Haller has. Put this question to him and let us know his answer in the light of your sermon to me.

My answer is that what Guru Nanak was doing at Hardwaar was showing us that pointless ritual and superstition needs to be replaced with hard facts and common sense, logic, wisdom, not blind faith. Repeating the name of God, with no understanding of why or how it is working is superstition and blind faith.

You had also given your experience with a Road-Magician which you retracted. I have stood my ground and it was very much there that I had experienced.

Gyaniji has not seemed to have developed an obsession with it, it happened, he cannot explain it, I cannot explain it, we all moved on.

Now the ball is in your court as to (1) accept the existence of evil spirits and (2) why Harry Haller is wasting time? (like you said above, but directing the question towards me instead of Harry Haller). I am not afraid of Bhoots. I had only related an experience I had during 1945. If you still feel it was my hallucination, then you have to answer "WHY MY FRIEND DIED THE SAME NIGHT ASKING FOR BHAT MACHI?" which the doctor in attendance advised not to give.

I note this quite a lot in your posts, it is not just sharing a story or making a point, why do you feel the need that we all have to accept the existence of evil spirits? I accept that you believe, and thats fine, thats your business, I have no need to change your view, why do you feel the need to change mine, or indeed anyone elses?

I have answered your post in the spirit of the thread, ie, it is relevent to the topic, and there are no personal attacks on you, just questions, I would kindly ask you to do the same

 

[Admin]

so dear friends..GET out of this cesspool of bhoots prets singhs shaheeds doing pehras and all this time WASTING..and go towards the REAL MESSAGE of Gurbani...DO Naam japp...BHAGTEE SINGH !!!

Gyani ji, what is naam japp...

 

[Sikhilove]

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji KI fateh.

Almost daily I come across "Sikhs" who tell me they have so much shardha in Gurbani..they beleive every single word of Gurbani..and this tells them that there are BHOOTS and PRETS.( also YUGS and Reincarnations..84 lakh joons and jamraaj and chitragupts..and and ..and..) I ask them..Have you really studied Gurbani ?? or just read gurbani..superficially...
The Difficulty and problem stems from the fact that we Sikhs always proclaim that GURU NANAK began a NEW RELIGION...a NEW system of THOUGHT...a Brand New Philosophy...etc etc BUT then we put on the Same old "spectacles" of Brahminism/vedas/purans...when we attempt to "look" at GURMATT Philosphy espoused in GURBANI. The "technique" Guru Ji used in Wriiting Gurbani is called PRODAWAAD...USE the "same old words" that already well known..BUT GIVE them NEW MEANINGS in line with the NEW GURMATT PHILOSOPHY. Thus we have mention of YUGS, REINCARNATION, BHOOTS, PRETS, 84 Lakh Joons etc etc..ALL these are used just as EXAMPLES..UDHARANS ONLY....to explain the new GURMATT. we cannot see the new gurmatt if we continue to BORROW the Brahmins" spectacles to see what Guru Ji wrote. WHY DID GURU JI THROW WATER at HARDWAAR ?? Does this Mean that We MUST also "THROW WATER" ?? Guru Ji is clearly THROWING WATER...But to TEACH his NEW GURMATT PHILOSOPHY....that THROWING WATER is a useless act...and even IF GURU JI also threw water..we are NOT to DO IT anymore after we read and understand GURBANI.

Lets see what are the BHOOTS and PRETS mentioned in Gurbani..
1.Page 289..SGGS "Saar BHOOT seh Har ka nao sehaj subhai nanak gun gao..... Here "BHOOT" is used for MATERIAL THINGS
2.Page 1202 SGGS "Kart buraee manas te chhapaee, Sathi BHOOT bhavaan"... Here BHOOT is TIME
3. Page 714 SGGS "Bhasma bhoot hoa khin bheetr Keea aapna paiya.." Here BHOOT is BODY
4. Page 839 SGGS " Panchmee panch BHOOT betala, aap agochar purakh nirala" Here BHOOT is Panch tatt Five Tatts
5. Page 1031 SGGS. " Dundar dhoot Bhoot bhehaleh,khinchotan kareh bheetaleh." Here BHOOT is used for VISHA VIKAARS
6. Page 513 SGGS " Maiya moh PRET hai, Kaam Krodh hankaara.." Here BHOOT PRET is MAYA..kaam, krodh,,hankaar
7. Page 890 SGGS. " Pasu pret mugadh te bureetiseh na bujheh jin eh siree..." Here BHOOT is for HUMAN BODY
8. Page 224 SGGS. "Kar kirpa rakhoh ravaleh..bin bujheh pasu paiyeah betaleh.." GIANHEEN..those without KNOWLEDGE are
BHOOTS
9. Page 311 SGGS.." Sach sacha jineh na sevaiah se MANMUKH moorrh BETaleh.." here the MANMUKH is the BHOOT
10. Page 149.SGGS " Navoh bhoolah jag phireh betalia.." Here the WORLD is BHOOT
11. Page 556 SGGS ." kali andhar nanaka jinah da autaar..PUTT jnoora dhee janoree Joru jinah da sikdaar..Here the FAMILY is BHOOT
12. Page 1374 SGGS " Kabir ja ghar saadh na seviah...Har kee seva nahin..se ghar marthakh sarkheh BHOOT baseh tin maheh...
People WITHOUT any GUNN...are like "Houses with BHOOTS"
13. Page 802 SGGS.."Pasu pret mugadh ko tareh pahan paar utareh.. nanak dass teri sarnaii sada sada balihareh...Here GURU has the
ability to Make "BHOOTS" ( those without Gunn, Knowledge etc) into GOOD HUMAN BEINGS
14. Page323 SGGS.." Pretoh kettan devta tin karneh hareh.. sabhe SIKH swarean Prabh kaaj swareh.." Guru has the ability to make
Bhoot like Bad Human Beings into GOOD Angel like Devtas
15. Page 706.SGGS " Har bhagat bhav heenangNanak PRABH bisrteh preteh..." PRET is one who has forgotten Name of GOD

Only Prof sahib Singh ji in His Guru Garanth Darpan has stepped out of the BRAHMIN LKEER ( line of CONTROL) and doen justice to Gurbani aarths...all others have doen these arrths by remaining firmly TIED DOWN to Brahminic/Vedic Thoughts and Rituals..and our so callaed DERAWADEE SANTS and SAADHS and even Taksali Gyanis are lakeer de fkeer..makee te makhee maree jaan walleh..who mindlessly keep repeating these "bhoot bhoot" when GURBANI is s ayign the Direct OPPOSITE of what they preach...and keep pushing the unwary sikh towards the deep ocean of Hinduism and its bhoot prets and 33 krorr devtas and such myths...
Actually there are no Bhoot Pret Joonis...there is not a single tuk of Gurbani that declares that such a BHOOT pret can enter a Human Body and take possesiion of it..all such are MANSAK Sicknesses..sickness of the MIND and should be treated as such by medical professionals...not akhautee saadhs and sants reading gurbani over glasses of water and sprinkling them over such mentally disturbed persons..
Har ke naam heen BETAAL..Jeta karan karavan teta Sabh bandhan Janjaal..and also.....Koi Kaheh BHOOTNA koi BETALLA.... if such a Modern SAADH-SANT say from baba Wadbhag Singh Dera had come across GURU NANAK JI...he would have sat down to take out "Guru nanak Ji's BHOOT also...because Guru Ji declares ..People call me Bhootna, betalla..so whose "bhoot" is in GURU NANAK JI ?? Gurbani clearly declares that humans who dont have Naam, gunns, good deeds, knowledge of God are the BHOOTS in HUMAN FORM...

a small story. A man approached Guru Gobind Singh ji and pleaded that he saw BHOOTS/PRETS..and was frightened. Guru Ji asked him.. Have you taken Khandeh batte dee Pahul..Do you Do Nitnem...Do you read Gurbani Paath... and he repleid NO Guru Ji. Guru Ji then replied..to me YOU are the BHOOT/PRET...for without the Naam of Gurbani a Human is BHOOT/PRET. Any human who is not having love of God in him, does bad things, cannot see God in everyone...is a Living BHOOT/PRET..and GURBANI hs the Power to make such a bhoot into a good Human being. NO "DEAD" person can enter into any living human...so dont fall for that saadh/Sant/Tantrik trick to relieve you of your money...and SANITY and PEACE of MIND.

Jarnail Singh Gyani "Arshi"



The Following Comment was posted by Respected Prof devinder Singh ji Chahal....

:"...Mr Jarnail Singh Arshi Giani Ji has explained wonderfully that in all the phrases quoted by him the word’ Bhoot’ and ‘Pret’ have been used by Gurus as metaphors to convey their philosophy. According to Nanakian Philosophy embodied in the Bani of Guru Nanak the so-called Soul does not go into reincarnation of 8.4 million life-cycles or into the Bhoot or prêt form.. There is no such thing in this universe.

It is very important for the Sikhs to first understand the ‘Nanakian Methodology’ used by Guru Nanak and other Sikh Gurus to write their Bani. One of the various methods used by the Gurus is that they have used ALLEGORIES, METAPHORS, AND SIMILES extensively to convey their philosophy. As soon as one understands Nanakian Methodology it would be much easier to interpret Gurbani in its real perspective.

One can read about it on the following site:

Nanakian Methodology
http://www.iuscanada.com/journal/articles/nanakianMethodology.pdf


For more articles on scientific and logical interpretations of Gurbani go to the following Net:
www.iuscanada.com


Prof Devinder Singh Chahal, PhD
Institute for Understanding Sikhism
4418 Martin-Plouffe
Laval, Quebec, Canada
H7W 5L9
Phone: 450-681-1254

Lol, I love the Guru Gobind Ji story, it's so true
There are more prets, humans after they die, demons and ghosts in netherworlds.

His creation is infinite so why on earth would humans be the only beings in the universe. Angels, Demi gods, demons, all named in Gurbani.

Open your heart, to accept Him you must Accept His entire creation as Him.

 

[ravneet_sb]

You are missing the point in relation to the discussion. Let us confine to "Do evil spirits exist in the light of Gur Vichar"?
Evil spirits are not in my mind. I had related an experience of having seen imps relishing rice and fish placed on a big leaf by the road side along which runs a canal where I stopped and my friend overtaking me crossed the thing while proceeding on his path. He must have disturbed the evil spirits. He fell ill and all the time asking for Bhat Machi and, on refusal died the same night.

The question here is "do evil spirits exist in view of Gur Vichar"?

Gurbani gives remedy for countering evil spirits. A remedy can only be suggested if there is a cause of threat. To overcome the threat from evil spirits Gurbani says "Repeat the name of God and no evil spirit can harm you".

Sat Sri Akaal

There is response mechanism of heat pressure touch pain responders are doots.

Many a times response of common cold and small injury is hai mar gaya or gayi. Is it response of jam doot.

But with GURUBANI education it knows that
it is nature has pre decided time and place of death, so they dont fear it.

Bhoot is Past events as sometimes it is sticky past, one is repeatedly thinking of bad past.

So Gurusbani make seekers aware of sticky strokes of memory and are never struck by way of awareness, they have not to go to.touts for jhara or other foolish acts. etc

Still remember when magnetic tapes get struck, stereo was beaten to get a play.

And same way I find jhara. But hardly any
Schizophrenic has recovered except the tout.
gaining out of it.

Its human contact experience shared while dealing with different mind sufferings, people have property assets good education, but with lost operative, due to lack of awareness, precious human life is lost, and unable to resolve, becoming helpless many a times due to social political and other causes, but only have Ardas to help people.

These cases prompted for giving priority at least for few minutes for all children, to develop spirit values, along with formal education

Lucky are those in human life who gets connected to internal TRUTH. Else life has intoxication of Maya. Observe negative aspects and deal to understand positive one has.

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa
Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh