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Dasam Granth - A Critical Study

Jul 30, 2004
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Re: Thus Das starts about Dasham Granth

Gurfateh

Das is soory to put another post but we did not have edit option there.

While reading Dasham Granth we need to remeber that target of Guru may not be people who were Punjabis or jatts or persons from 'Sikh family' but from diverse background .

Thing that we can not read Triya Charitar in front of our female folk or subject of morality itself proves that we are living in the morality or code either created by pseudo Brahmnaical people or Protestant hypocrates.

It is more endemic to pseudo Brahmnanical castes that talk of sex with feamle folk is tabbo.In west or in north east of India or in many part of world it is not tabbo.

It is more an attempt to put upper caste Punjabi culture perhaps which has made us rigid that talking of sex etc. infront of female folk is Bad.

In futre may be mother has to tell the son in Punjab itself to use condom if doing sex outside edlock else he may get AIDS.

As Time comes we will realise that Guru had foresight of future.

Personly Das can say that Das did talked of Dasham Granth with his hindu mother who herself is lerned in hindi.

She said that Guru could not write like that
1. There were derogatory referance for Lord Ramah which as per her saviours of hindu can not write.
2. Language of Triya Charitar is likie Kissa Tota Maina(folk stories) then later she agreed that such was the chronological influnece of language and to target of it at that time.

Das will request again that instead of ridiculing this scripture based upon the observations made by a few people who may not have understood Guru Granth Sahib so far correctly and not working yourself and studing it properly it is better to check it and if possbile bring out so called contradiction in front of das so that misunderstanding can be removed.

So Sahib Manbir Ji Das request you to read it yourself.Often there are many personas who have so far not read it correctly but but give conclusions based upon inference drwans by others.

If we have the intellect of rehgional or racial identiy and behold Guru as Hindu/Indian/Punjabi then only we find contradictions due to fear factors of Brahimn sitting in our own mind.

There are many Dera Wallahs(www.nirmalkutia.org) who inspite of being illitrate have converted all populatons of of varous villages in India in Panth and no Brahmin lives there as all are Sikh but we have Brahmin in our mind as mnay of our missionairies who due to there being too much logical have removed faith of devinity totaly from the hearts of Sikhs so they turn apostate(Patit) but they just as a cover up they blame Brahmin who does not exist at all.
 
Sep 4, 2005
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Vijay Deep Singh Ji

Have you gone through the book by Kala Afgana - Bipran Ke Reet To Sach Da Marg -- Vol No 10. The book deals with the Dasam Granth.
I read part of it and found the various Charit Kathas in the Dasam Granth nothing but repulsive and too degrating to be mentioned in any religious book and to call it as being written by Guru Gobind Singh Ji is nothing but blasphemous.
 
Jul 30, 2004
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Gurfateh

Respected Manbir Singh Ji,

das has read many of the writings of Sirdir Sahib and supports him for his real concern for the panth and without any hitch his delclaring of Tankhiya is unjust.

Most of his writings are in Punjabi(das is not expert but has workable knwoledge of it).

Yet Sirdir Sahib work based upon Dasham Granth is more near to work of Sirdir Sahib Bhag Singh Ji Ambala another great Sikh who underwent similer agony.

Das can say that Sirdir Sahib are not understanding the meaning of Guru Granth Sahib Ji in correct sense and therefore find it contradictory to Guru Granth Sahib Ji.

As it was in history like it was in meat issue we had a good lot of diffrances.

Das is from Nirmala order but not only in Nirmalas but in Taksalis also in past there was a great lot of diferances on weather the whole Dasham Granth is from Guru or not.

So if some missioariers are oppsoing it then it does not mean that it is some thing new.Even in past also there were idfferances on Raagmala also.

Coing back to objectionable part of Dasham Granth like Triya charitra.Das can say that vaste nationas are not made merely by spritual discourse.

We need Techniques like that of Armuray(Shastra Maal Puraan) .
non of the Missioaries like Ambala Sahib or Kala Afghana Sahib are from intelligense agency or politics or Army(in guirilla warfare) or diplomacy.

Reason for thier getting unfair deals by idiotic fake Akalis highjacking sgpc etc. ie main reason for that.

Yet had they have taken some tips from Triya Charitar then today they would have succesfully overthrown the cruppot people who are haivng control on sorry to say up to some extent Akal Takhat.

Das had already started one thread on Triaya Charitar and wil explain what it means.

Das is not going by any tranlation but what is writtan thier in Braj Bhasha and explantion of it in English will be given.Das will try to touch Hiqyats also which are in Farsi and try to give what message is it giving.

Das is reapeating that since old time there were many ways to transfer coded messages and at present too we are tought.

visit the thread Das started.

http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/sikhphilosophy/controversial-debates/5784-kanjer-kavita-title-triya-charitars.html

Das is trying to use the brain of missioariers so let them understand.

das has personal opinion that Dasham Granth is more to do with semitic faiths or say like Islam.And Panth could be termed as youngest of semitic faith ie Jews,Chrsitians,Islam and Latest the Panth.

In fact in India in order to attract Hindus Catholics have taken a few steps.
1. performing Arti of trinity in churches with lamp etc.
2. Learning Sanskrit and Vedas
3.Accpeting offering like Coconuts.

Similar acts in past ere done by sufies to preach Islam like Malik Moahmud Jayeesi who used Hindu Mythology to preach Islam.

Sunni preachers in India also quote Vedas to preach Islam.

So Dasham Granth was an attempt by Sikhs to preach Gurmat to Hindus and other non Sikhs.
 
Jul 30, 2004
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Gurfateh

Das recently got hard copy of S Bhag Singh Ji Ambala book on Dasham Granth Das is happy to know that he was also Bhamal before becomging Bhag Singh very much like das himslef.

Likewise das even supports him when he opposes the pligrimage or miracles attached to Hemkunt Sahib.

BUT as S. Gurbax Singh Ji Kala Afghan make fun of late Mahapurush of AKJ and Damdami Taksal das finds no reluctance to find fault in over zealus writng of late Amabal sahib also.

Das will first try to explain that where he went wrong while taking of Shaster Mala Puran as it asumed to be by Sakats(worshipper of Hindu godess durga etc.) and it comes first in the book.

Work of Ambala Sahib is based upon one Singh Sahib which surbname Ashok who did phd to prove that,Kala Afghana Sahib also seemed to inspireed from him.

Das would put one thing today to start.

Say in Guru Granth Sahib Ji,We have mention of Rama and Vedas in postive ways say in Anand Sahib for Vedas or say for Ram often.As he has tryed to define Name of Puranas or Bhagwati from acent hindu scriptures rahter then Dasham Granth themself or what it is litral meaning.

Say if das say that Rama or Veda in Guru Granth Sahib Ji are as per old Hindu defination then das is doing a sin as they meana new defination or true defination as per Gurmat as old definaton as per Hindu was false.

So as we see in Dasham Granth we have dirrent meaning of the same and infact Ambala sahib could not understand verse which he told was contradictory with Guru Granth Sahib even simple logic could have solved this misunderstanding.

Had das been unforgiving like Kala Afghana Sahib have been to Bhai Randheer Singh Ji or Baba Gubachan Singh Ji Khalsa of Bhindran das could have said for Gyanis or prophesers that when such person saw cow dung cakes being dreid struck to the wall (for readying them for fuel)he said that how could cow go there and excreate dung on wall(to be continued..)
 
Jul 30, 2004
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Gurfateh

without taking much time das there by starts the debunking the article on Shaster Naam Mala Puran.

Ambala Sahib at onces quotes some old Santan Dharmi Scriptures and say that this can not be a Puran at all.

He quotes a good lot of things which say that at that time when they were writtan there werer 18 Puranas and as per definations of Purans by Hindus also this does not becomes a Puran.

Das feels pity of our missionaryes that they respect person like Ambala Sahib and tell das to read his writing about Dasham Granth.As if Ambala Sahib has writtan somwe Atom Bomb.

So Das is defusing it and sorry but with ruthlessness.

Well when we read Japu Ji Sahib we have term Sito Sita Mahima Mahi.

Guru Isar Guru Gorakh Barmah Guru Parbati Mai.

Das if trys to prove the meanings of such based upon Hindu scriptures then our Gurus are demi gods of Hindus.

Term Jam,Narak if das trys to prove by Hindu scriptures then Guru Granth Sahib Ji will have totaly differant meanings.

Then Dwarka and Vrinda Vana and Gopal if Das uses Vaishnav meaning will be totaly to what it means in Gurmat.

Guru gave Janeu or Yagypweet a differant meaning.Brahmin as per Gurmat is Brahm Gyani.Often terms like Eys(Katakh) Feet(Charan) or Hands(Kar) are there used in differant meanings but not body and Nirankar or formless menaioned otherwise at other places is used to claerlfy.

If others Guru can give new mean ing to old termenalogy then what was bounding Tenth Guru to creat a new Puran of his likeing.

Vedas in postive or negitve terms often refer to scriptures.

And Ambala Sahib who might have underwent Amrit Sanskar with Chaupayee Sahib of Akal Ustat Pranvo Ad(i)...

Has missed the parts of Akal Ustat which call Akal as Puran.Refer behold Human race as one(one here is Akal) there it said That is Kuran and That itself is Kuran.

In fact to preach Islam poems of Sufi Jaysi Ji always called Kuran as Puran.

Pur means to fill in Farsi and its plural can be puran but in Sanskrit it has some thing to do with History or porv or before.

Here Guru writs what so ever he saw before in Puran.

A person who can make a new surname Singh can not make Puran.

It shows that Amabal Ji underestimated the Guru.

There are some Pitaks or Agams which are to be found in non Santan faiths like Jains and Budhists so why can Puran be common in Sikhs.

If we can have Vars both in Sikhs and Hindus or Raags then why can not Sikh make thier own Puran?

We have differant Arti also.And so on and so forth.

Das here just wanted to prove that usi9ng the STANDARDs of Hindu scriptures to check weather a Sikh scripture is as per Gurmat or not is disgrcefull.

Then see the these potions of Japu Sahib

ਪਰਮ ਬੇਦ ਪੁਰਾਣ ਜਾਕਹਿ ਨੇਤ ਭਾਖਤ ਨਿੱਤ ॥
परम बेद पुराण जाकहि नेत भाखत नित ॥
The Vedas and the Puransa always declare Thee the Supreme and the Greatest.

ਕੋਟਿ ਸਿੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਪੁਰਾਨ ਸਾਸਤ੍ਰ ਨ ਆਵਈ ਵਹੁ ਚਿੱਤਿ ॥੮੬॥
कोटि सिम्रित पुरान सासत्र न आवई वहु चिति ॥८६॥
None can comprehend thee completely through millions of Smritis, Puranas and Shastras.86.


So as per Guru Puran Sings glory of Akal and not what Ambala Sahib wants to prove and Guru made one Puran for that Task.

Ambala Sahib put obejctions to tow verse of first chapter of text concern and by the wording of Bhagwati sorry rather Bhagaouti.

Well any lame person can say that Bhagaoti is slang or Ampbransh of Bhagwati and Hindus prefer Tatsam or unaltered words for thier spells or verses as they have faith that correct proniciation has magical power.

We have term Bhagwati Chand twice used in Japu Sahib.

Other things from Japu Sahib and Akal Ustat as follows.


ਨਮੋ ਸਸਤ੍ਰਪਾਣੇ ॥ ਨਮੋ ਅਸਤ੍ਰ ਮਾਣੇ ॥
नमो ससत्रपाणे ॥ नमो असत्र माणे ॥
Salutation to Thee O Weapon-wielder Lord! Salutation to Thee O Weapon-user Lord!

ਨਮੋ ਪਰਮ ਗਿਆਤਾ ॥ ਨਮੋ ਲੋਕ ਮਾਤਾ ॥੫੨॥
नमो परम गिआता ॥ नमो लोक माता ॥५२॥
Salutation to Thee O Supreme Knower Lord! Salutation to Thee O Universal Mother Lord! 52.


But Akal is termed Anang or limbless also there itself.

It may measn that weapon of final assault means hand of God.God is also pride or posser of projectile.

It may also means that weapon in hand is addressed as manifestation of God.Last thing is logicaly and scintifiaclly correct as in Guru Granth Sahib Ji also in the verse of Siri Rag we have Ape Baho Bidh Rangla...

Where Swan,Lake,angel,fish and fisher man all are refered to as Akal.

Any way Das can misinterprte it by logic of Amabla Sahib Ji that in that verse perhaps we have some pagan fishing community worshipping thier tools ie Angal calling it God and thier fisherman ancestors are gods or fish as Matsy Avtar is sung in Guru Granth Sahib Ji.

isrIrwgu mhlw 1 Gru dUjw 2 ] (23-10)
sireeraag mehlaa 1 ghar doojaa 2.
Siree Raag, First Mehl, Second House:
Awpy rsIAw Awip rsu Awpy rwvxhwru ] (23-10, isrIrwgu, mÚ 1)
aapay rasee-aa aap ras aapay ravanhaar.
He Himself is the Enjoyer, and He Himself is the Enjoyment. He Himself is the Ravisher of all.
Awpy hovY colVw Awpy syj Bqwru ]1] (23-11, isrIrwgu, mÚ 1)
aapay hovai cholrhaa aapay sayj bhataar. ||1||
He Himself is the Bride in her dress, He Himself is the Bridegroom on the bed. ||1||
rMig rqw myrw swihbu riv rihAw BrpUir ]1] rhwau ] (23-11, isrIrwgu, mÚ 1)
rang rataa mayraa saahib rav rahi-aa bharpoor. ||1|| rahaa-o.
My Lord and Master is imbued with love; He is totally permeating and pervading all. ||1||Pause||
Awpy mwCI mCulI Awpy pwxI jwlu ] (23-12, isrIrwgu, mÚ 1)
aapay maachhee machhulee aapay paanee jaal.
He Himself is the fisherman and the fish; He Himself is the water and the net.
Awpy jwl mxkVw Awpy AMdir lwlu ]2] (23-12, isrIrwgu, mÚ 1)
aapay jaal mankarhaa aapay andar laal. ||2||
He Himself is the sinker, and He Himself is the bait. ||2||
Awpy bhu ibiD rMgulw sKIey myrw lwlu ] (23-13, isrIrwgu, mÚ 1)
aapay baho biDh rangulaa sakhee-ay mayraa laal.
He Himself loves in so many ways. O sister soul-brides, He is my Beloved.
inq rvY sohwgxI dyKu hmwrw hwlu ]3] (23-13, isrIrwgu, mÚ 1)
nit ravai sohaaganee daykh hamaaraa haal. ||3||
He continually ravishes and enjoys the happy soul-brides; just look at the plight I am in without Him! ||3||
pRxvY nwnku bynqI qU srvru qU hMsu ] (23-14, isrIrwgu, mÚ 1)
paranvai naanak bayntee too sarvar too hans.
Prays Nanak, please hear my prayer: You are the pool, and You are the soul-swan.
kaulu qU hY kvIAw qU hY Awpy vyiK ivgsu ]4]25] (23-14, isrIrwgu, mÚ 1)
ka-ul too hai kavee-aa too hai aapay vaykh vigas. ||4||25||
You are the lotus flower of the day and You are the water-lily of the night. You Yourself behold them, and blossom forth in bliss. ||4||25||


Then das would like to say that if Vars names after Raaga or Say persoan and Chand after Bhagwati then why can not be Dohra haivng the name Sri Bhagwati Ji Sahai.Master 10.

And then das would like to qoute Akal Ustat which is not considered as contrversial ie it is not the part of Mahishsur Mardan verse of about ten in number

have a look.

ਕਹੂੰ ਦੇਵਬਾਨੀ ਕਹੂੰ ਸਾਰਦਾ ਭਵਾਨੀ ਕਹੂੰ ਮੰਗਲਾ ਮਿੜਾਨੀ ਕਹੂੰ ਸਿਆਮ ਕਹੂੰ ਸੇਤ ਹੋ ॥
कहूं देवबानी कहूं सारदा भवानी कहूं मंगला मिड़ानी कहूं सिआम कहूं सेत हो ॥
Somewhere Thou art the divine speech, somewhere Sarada and Bhavani, somewhere Durga, the trampler of corpses, somewhere in black colour and somewhere in white colour.


just after a few verses of later then Pranvo Adi Ekoankar Chaupee.

Japu Sahib has verse Sarbang Kale,Sarb ko Pun Kal.

Start of Akal Ustan has word Sarab Kal.

And Chaupayee again has Sab Ka Kal.

Well in This text realted to Shasters it is very strange that Ambala Sahib took ntoice of Sri Bhauti Ji Sahee but forgot to read Ek Oankar Wahiguru Ji Ki Fateh Before hand.

Well as per him it could be ploy to attract Sikhs into the faith of godess worshippers.

Das wants to ask that by verse Sri Bhaouti Ji Sahyee could not that be a way to bring devi worshipper into Panth insted like in Adi Guru Granth Sahib Ji did use words likie Raghunath or Sarangpani or Murari and as per Hindus its meaning are differant but Guru gave treu and correct meaning and why can not happen with Bhaouti when it is already menaiuoned in Japu Sahib ji at least twice as type of Chhand.

Say we have Bhairav Raag in Guru Granth Sahib Ji,literaly it may means for Hindus as love of gods of Sakats Bhairav but it is true that it is tune of martial spirit.

http://www.sridasam.org/dasam?Action=Page&p=1356

Now das will give the linkk abvoe for due consideration.

And contrversian verses also.

ਅਸ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾਨ ਖੰਡੋ ਖੜਗ ਤੁਪਕ ਤਬਰ ਅਰੁ ਤੀਰ ॥ ਸੈਫ ਸਰੋਹੀ ਸੈਹਥੀ ਯਹੈ ਹਮਾਰੈ ਪੀਰ ॥੩॥
अस क्रिपान खंडो खड़ग तुपक तबर अरु तीर ॥ सैफ सरोही सैहथी यहै हमारै पीर ॥३॥
As, Kripan (sword), Khanda, Khadag (sword), Tupak (gun), Tabar (hatched), Teer (arrow), Saif (sword), Sarohi and Saihathi, all these are our adorable seniors.3.

ਤੀਰ ਤੁਹੀ ਸੈਹਥੀ ਤੁਹੀ ਤੁਹੀ ਤਬਰ ਤਲਵਾਰ ॥ ਨਾਮ ਤਿਹਾਰੋ ਜੋ ਜਪੈ ਭਏ ਸਿੰਧ ਭਵ ਪਾਰ ॥੪॥
तीर तुही सैहथी तुही तुही तबर तलवार ॥ नाम तिहारो जो जपै भए सिंध भव पार ॥४॥
Thou are the Teer (arrow), Thou are Saihathi, Thou art Tabar (hatchet), and Talwaar (sword); he, who remembers Thy Name crosses the dreadful ocean of existence.4.

As per Ambala Sahib first verses is there instance that writer is going to worship weapon so it is anti Gurmat thing.

Well what is peer.

As per Farsi old human is called peer like old man will be Maard E Peer.

old non living thinfgs are called Kunhe like old door Dar E Kunhe.

In Guru Granth Sahib we have verse Pir Wanjara Ram

here as we see pir term is used it is non Farsi and is from Hindi meaning beloved male or pia.

Yet term peer is used in another verse which like Peers will agree if dead is not eaten.

This does means that Peers were known to Gurus.

In fact peers(elder) is a guide which lets the murshid meet Allah.

Anyway at that time of Guru most of comon folks were after five dead peers like Guga ,Sakhi Sarvar,etc whom they thought will give them back some boom.

Guru used weapons to let us fight oppresion and gain salvtion while fighting foes.Guru Granth Sahib approves about Sura So Pahichaniye ..by Bhagat Kabeer Ji.

So needless to say that instead of going in Jungles or just siting at home and repeating the name of God when oppression is done outside may not be allowed.

As per Jaffernammah in trouble use of sword is OK.So sword as a tool of fight does becoems our route to God like peers are for thier Murshid.

It is interesting to see that During the time of first Master only did Tupak or Cannon came to India with Babber.And it is one of the Peer and no Trishool the most revered weapon of Sakats is menationed.

So perhaps Amabal Sahib were not perfect and were mortal only.And he missded this thing.

Gurus used Cannons but not the Sakat Matis who used Swords etc. to sacrifce thier lamp,fowel or young bullow but never took part in guns or cannon warfare so soon as at that time.

He could nopt have got the mention of Guns in Sanskrit text he was quoting .
Likewise Saif,Teer or Talwar are names in Arebic/Turkuish or Farsi and not to be used as Malchchh Bhasha.

When some tool is describe to unite with God.When person who write it knows the true Islam that Peer is medium and not the object of worship then how can a person about 300 years after say that these worship are talking of Anti Islamic peer worshiping thing.

We can say that Guru Granth Sahib Ji also are Meduim,Panth Khalsa could be another meduim but all are infact manifesations of Akal.

Then comes the next verse some one is termed as Arrow ,Hatchet,Sword etc. and we are told to take name of that someone
time and agina for salvation.We know that as it is in Guru Granth Sahib Ji Dasham Granth Ji also does not talko Mechanical Jap but with devotion.

So here is some one who is addressed and not the weapons as such people may say that Guru had some tool which acted in all the manners of sabre and arrow simultainously and this writer who wrote puran is trying to paint Guru as worshipping that weapon.

but see the next lines

ਕਾਲ ਤੁਹੀ ਕਾਲੀ ਤੁਹੀ ਤੁਹੀ ਤੇਗ ਅਰੁ ਤੀਰ ॥ ਤੁਹੀ ਨਿਸ਼ਾਨੀ ਜੀਤ ਕੀ ਆਜੁ ਤੁਹੀ ਜਗਬੀਰ ॥੫॥
काल तुही काली तुही तुही तेग अरु तीर ॥ तुही निशानी जीत की आजु तुही जगबीर ॥५॥
Thou art the KAL (death), thou art the goddess Kali, Thou art the saber and arrow, Thou art the sign of victory today and Thou art the Hero of the world.5.

ਤੁਹੀ ਸੂਲ ਸੈਹਥੀ ਤਬਰ ਤੂੰ ਨਿਖੰਗ ਅਰੁ ਬਾਨ ॥ ਤੁਹੀ ਕਟਾਰੀ ਸੇਲ ਸਭ ਤੁਮਹੀ ਕਰਦ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾਨ ॥੬॥
तुही सूल सैहथी तबर तूं निखंग अरु बान ॥ तुही कटारी सेल सभ तुमही करद क्रिपान ॥६॥
Thou art the Sool (spike), Saihathi and Tabar (hatched), Thou art the Nikhang and Baan (arrow), Thou art the Kataari, Sel, and all and Thou art the Kard (knife), and Kripaan (sword).6.

ਸ਼ਸਤ੍ਰ ਅਸਤ੍ਰ ਤੁਮਹੀ ਸਿਪਰ ਤੁਮਹੀ ਕਵਚ ਨਿਖੰਗ ॥ ਕਵਚਾਂਤਕ ਤੁਮਹੀ ਬਨੇ ਤੁਮ ਬਯਾਪਕ ਸਰਬੰਗ ॥੭॥
शसत्र असत्र तुमही सिपर तुमही कवच निखंग ॥ कवचांतक तुमही बने तुम बयापक सरबंग ॥७॥
Thou art the arms and weapons, Thou art the Nikhang (quiver), and the Kavach (armour); Thou art the destroyer of the armours and Thou art also all pervading.7.

If das is not mistaken there is only one God who is Wyapak Sarbang or in all parts or present in all parts and that is Akal.

Ambala Sahib often wrote that poet is misguiding the reader by writing all prevasive for demigod or weapon so that they must behold them as all prevasive.Logically swrod or Arrow which occupy space can never be like that and any child can tell this.

Only formless can be like that.

Das wants to ask why is is not possible that as it has Happened in Guru Granth Sahib also that Gurus used the name of mythological beings or objects etc(like angal or Spheriacal Manakas etc) to tell that truth behind all is Akal.

So why can not poet going to tell that in reality Time or Destrctive power of Time is Manifestaion of Akal and so are swrod and only Akal is to be relied for powers from them and they are nothing without Akal.

Why to think in opposite direction when direct thing is writtan?(to Be continued..)
 
Jul 30, 2004
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Gurfateh

Das took qoutes from Japu Ji Sahib regardign that Guru is Brhama,vishnu and Mahesh and Guru is Parwati Mai for some specific reason.

A person with duality will not understand due to Duja Bhav.

Guru of First Master and all of us Akal Purakh is truth behind Three hindu Gods and mother Godess.

Actulay Mother Parwati is Akal only.

Again Akal is Adressed As mother and Father(Tu Mat Pitah hum Barik Tere) and Har Ji Mata and Har Ji Pita.

Das would like to put some light on godess also.

There are threes godess ie Laxmi w/ god Vishnu,Parwati w/o god Shiva,Sarswati w/o Brahma Ji.

ones upon a time Parwati said that she seems to be a bit balck as as per legend she removed her blackness in another form.

that part was called Kali(Black lady) and remaining fair Part was Gauri(White Lady).

other forms of Kali are Tara,Chandika etc.

Gauri has names Shiva,Durga etc.

but all are synomous to Parwati which we can see in realty as per Panth is Akal so such name for Akal by Guru Granth Sahib Ji are not wrong.(to be continued..)
 
Jul 30, 2004
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Gurfateh

Das will again give more details of verses in Guru Granth Sahib JI which were used taking symbols of myth to let us understand sprituality by logic.

At other places we were givne true keys to it so we did corect explantions.Prof Sahib Singh Ji did and even S. Bhag Singh Ji also did.

Just take for example. from Sadu in Ramkali Raag.

We have verse which talsk of calling Kehav Pandit for the Katha of Puran.

Veryly that Puran is not out of 18 hindu Puranas but about Gurbani.

if we can have 19th Puran in Sikhs then why not 20th Puran on Shastra.

The riddles which follows have givne others names and qualties for weapons.

Such weapons could be utilesed and made as needed from definations and others names can used by users to tranfer secert informations evading government spys.

This Purn could be more like a dictionary of cryptography which only few users can have and with names they can communicate amongs themselve the vialt information about activitoes of thier forces.

In fact Brain Guru and Guru Khalsa was that which we still are trying to bulit up in our present day intelligence.(das will talk more on Triya Charitars as it was name to information or propganda warfatre people from intellignece community have just started to sue in west not long time ago).

Coming back to Purans of weapons in Dasham Granth.

Das posts first paragraph as a whole and again giving due respect to Amabala Sahib consider another possbileity of question he raised.

Das will deal about Bhagwati issue later as Amabala Sahib also levae it in his book.


शसत्र नाम माला
SHATRA NAM MALA

ੴ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕੀ ਫਤਹ ॥
ੴ स्री वाहिगुरू जी की फतह ॥
The Lord is One and the Victory is of the True Guru.

ਅਥ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਸ਼ਸਤ੍ਰ ਨਾਮ ਮਾਲਾ ਪੁਰਾਣ ਲਿਖਯਤੇ ॥
अथ स्री शसत्र नाम माला पुराण लिखयते ॥
Shastra-Nama Mala Purana (the Rosary of the Names of weapons) is now composed

ਸ੍ਰੀ ਭਗਉਤੀ ਜੀ ਸਹਾਇ ॥ ਪਾਤਿਸ਼ਾਹੀ ॥੧੦॥
स्री भगउती जी सहाइ ॥ पातिशाही ॥१०॥
With the support of the primal power by the Tenth King.

ਦੋਹਰਾ ॥
दोहरा ॥
DOHRA

ਸਾਂਗ ਸਰੋਹੀ ਸੈਫ ਅਸ ਤੀਰ ਤੁਪਕ ਤਲਵਾਰ ॥ ਸੱਤ੍ਰਾਂਤਕ ਕਵਚਾਂਤਿ ਕਰ ਕਰੀਐ ਰੱਛ ਹਮਾਰ ॥੧॥
सांग सरोही सैफ अस तीर तुपक तलवार ॥ सत्रांतक कवचांति कर करीऐ रछ हमार ॥१॥
O Lord ! Protect us by creating Saang, Sarohi, Saif (Sword), As, Teer (arrow) tupak (gun), Talwaar (sword), and other weapons and armours causing the destruction of the enemies.1.

ਅਸ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾਨ ਧਾਰਾਧਰੀ ਸੈਲ ਸੂਫ ਜਮਦਾਢ ॥ ਕਵਚਾਂਤਕ ਸੱਤ੍ਰਾਂਤ ਕਰ ਤੇਗ ਤੀਰ ਧਰਬਾਢ ॥੨॥
अस क्रिपान धाराधरी सैल सूफ जमदाढ ॥ कवचांतक सत्रांत कर तेग तीर धरबाढ ॥२॥
O Lord ! Creat As, Kripan (sword), Dharaddhari, Sail, Soof, Jamaadh, Tegh (saber), Teer (saber), Teer (arrow), Talwar(sward), causing the destruction of armours and enemies.2.

ਅਸ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾਨ ਖੰਡੋ ਖੜਗ ਤੁਪਕ ਤਬਰ ਅਰੁ ਤੀਰ ॥ ਸੈਫ ਸਰੋਹੀ ਸੈਹਥੀ ਯਹੈ ਹਮਾਰੈ ਪੀਰ ॥੩॥
अस क्रिपान खंडो खड़ग तुपक तबर अरु तीर ॥ सैफ सरोही सैहथी यहै हमारै पीर ॥३॥
As, Kripan (sword), Khanda, Khadag (sword), Tupak (gun), Tabar (hatched), Teer (arrow), Saif (sword), Sarohi and Saihathi, all these are our adorable seniors.3.

ਤੀਰ ਤੁਹੀ ਸੈਹਥੀ ਤੁਹੀ ਤੁਹੀ ਤਬਰ ਤਲਵਾਰ ॥ ਨਾਮ ਤਿਹਾਰੋ ਜੋ ਜਪੈ ਭਏ ਸਿੰਧ ਭਵ ਪਾਰ ॥੪॥
तीर तुही सैहथी तुही तुही तबर तलवार ॥ नाम तिहारो जो जपै भए सिंध भव पार ॥४॥
Thou are the Teer (arrow), Thou are Saihathi, Thou art Tabar (hatchet), and Talwaar (sword); he, who remembers Thy Name crosses the dreadful ocean of existence.4.

ਕਾਲ ਤੁਹੀ ਕਾਲੀ ਤੁਹੀ ਤੁਹੀ ਤੇਗ ਅਰੁ ਤੀਰ ॥ ਤੁਹੀ ਨਿਸ਼ਾਨੀ ਜੀਤ ਕੀ ਆਜੁ ਤੁਹੀ ਜਗਬੀਰ ॥੫॥
काल तुही काली तुही तुही तेग अरु तीर ॥ तुही निशानी जीत की आजु तुही जगबीर ॥५॥
Thou art the KAL (death), thou art the goddess Kali, Thou art the saber and arrow, Thou art the sign of victory today and Thou art the Hero of the world.5.

ਤੁਹੀ ਸੂਲ ਸੈਹਥੀ ਤਬਰ ਤੂੰ ਨਿਖੰਗ ਅਰੁ ਬਾਨ ॥ ਤੁਹੀ ਕਟਾਰੀ ਸੇਲ ਸਭ ਤੁਮਹੀ ਕਰਦ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾਨ ॥੬॥
तुही सूल सैहथी तबर तूं निखंग अरु बान ॥ तुही कटारी सेल सभ तुमही करद क्रिपान ॥६॥
Thou art the Sool (spike), Saihathi and Tabar (hatched), Thou art the Nikhang and Baan (arrow), Thou art the Kataari, Sel, and all and Thou art the Kard (knife), and Kripaan (sword).6.

ਸ਼ਸਤ੍ਰ ਅਸਤ੍ਰ ਤੁਮਹੀ ਸਿਪਰ ਤੁਮਹੀ ਕਵਚ ਨਿਖੰਗ ॥ ਕਵਚਾਂਤਕ ਤੁਮਹੀ ਬਨੇ ਤੁਮ ਬਯਾਪਕ ਸਰਬੰਗ ॥੭॥
शसत्र असत्र तुमही सिपर तुमही कवच निखंग ॥ कवचांतक तुमही बने तुम बयापक सरबंग ॥७॥
Thou art the arms and weapons, Thou art the Nikhang (quiver), and the Kavach (armour); Thou art the destroyer of the armours and Thou art also all pervading.7.
ਸ੍ਰੀ ਤੂੰ ਸਭ ਕਾਰਨ ਤੁਹੀ ਤੂੰ ਬਿੱਦਯਾ ਕੋ ਸਾਰ ॥ ਤੁਮ ਸਭ ਕੋ ਉਪਰਾਜਹੀ ਤੁਮਹੀ ਲੇਹੁ ਉਬਾਰ ॥੮॥
स्री तूं सभ कारन तुही तूं बिदया को सार ॥ तुम सभ को उपराजही तुमही लेहु उबार ॥८॥
Thou art the cause of peace and prosperity and the essence of learning; Thou art the creator of all and the redeemer of all.8.

ਤੁਮਹੀ ਦਿਨ ਰਜਨੀ ਤੁਹੀ ਤੁਮਹੀ ਜੀਅਨ ਉਪਾਇ ॥ ਕਉਤਕ ਹੇਰਨ ਕੇ ਨਮਿਤ ਤਿਨ ਮੋ ਬਾਦ ਬਢਾਇ ॥੯॥
तुमही दिन रजनी तुही तुमही जीअन उपाइ ॥ कउतक हेरन के नमित तिन मो बाद बढाइ ॥९॥
Thou art the day and night and Thou art the creator of all the Jivas (beings), causing disputes among them; Thou does all this in order to view Thy own sport.9.

ਅਸ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾਨ ਖੰਡੋ ਖੜਗ ਸੈਫ ਤੇਗ ਤਰਵਾਰ ॥ ਰੱਛ ਕਰੋ ਹਮਰੀ ਸਦਾ ਕਵਚਾਂਤਕ ਕਰਵਾਰ ॥੧੦॥
अस क्रिपान खंडो खड़ग सैफ तेग तरवार ॥ रछ करो हमरी सदा कवचांतक करवार ॥१०॥
O Lord ! Protect us by smashing the armour with the blows of Thy hands with the help of As, Kripaan (sword), Khanda, Kharag, Saif, Tegh, and Talwaar (sword).10.

ਤੁਹੀ ਕਟਾਰੀ ਦਾੜ੍ਹ ਜਮ ਤੂੰ ਬਿਛੂਓ ਅਰੁ ਬਾਨ ॥ ਤੋ ਪਤਿ ਪਦ ਜੇ ਲੀਜੀਐ ਰੱਛ ਦਾਸ ਮੁਹਿ ਜਾਨੁ ॥੧੧॥
तुही कटारी दाड़्ह जम तूं बिछूओ अरु बान ॥ तो पति पद जे लीजीऐ रछ दास मुहि जानु ॥११॥
Thou art Kataari, Jamdaadh, Bichhuaa and Baan, O power ! I am a serf of Thy Lord`s feet, kindly Protect me.11.

ਬਾਂਕ ਬੱਜ੍ਰ ਬਿਛੂਓ ਤੁਹੀ ਤਬਰ ਤਰਵਾਰ ॥ ਤੁਹੀ ਕਟਾਰੀ ਸੈਹਥੀ ਕਰੀਐ ਰੱਛ ਹਮਾਰ ॥੧੨॥
बांक बज्र बिछूओ तुही तबर तरवार ॥ तुही कटारी सैहथी करीऐ रछ हमार ॥१२॥
Thou art Baank, bajar, Bichhuaa, Tabar, and Talwaar, Thou art the kataari, and Saihathi; Protect me.12.

ਤੁਮੀ ਗੁਰਜ ਤੁਮਹੀ ਗਦਾ ਤੁਮਹੀ ਤੀਰ ਤੁਫੰਗ ॥ ਦਾਸ ਜਾਨ ਮੋਰੀ ਸਦਾ ਰੱਛਾ ਕਰੋ ਸਰਬੰਗ ॥੧੩॥
तुमी गुरज तुमही गदा तुमही तीर तुफंग ॥ दास जान मोरी सदा रछा करो सरबंग ॥१३॥
Thou art Gurj, Gadaa (mace), Teer (arrow) and Tufang; protect me ever considering me as Thy slave.13.

ਛੁਰੀ ਕਲਮ ਰਿਪ ਕਰਦ ਭਨਿ ਖੰਜਰ ਬੁਗਦਾ ਨਾਇ ॥ ਅਰਧ ਰਿਜਕ ਸਭ ਜਗਤ ਕੋ ਮੁਹਿ ਤੁਮ ਲੇਹੁ ਬਚਾਇ ॥੧੪॥
छुरी कलम रिप करद भनि खंजर बुगदा नाइ ॥ अरध रिजक सभ जगत को मुहि तुम लेहु बचाइ ॥१४॥
Thou art the Chhurri, the enemy-killing karad and the Khanjar (dagger) are Thy names; Thou art the adorable Power of the world, kindly protect me.14.

ਪ੍ਰਿਥਮ ਉਪਾਵਹੁ ਜਗਤ ਤੁਮ ਤੁਮਹੀਂ ਪੰਥ ਬਨਾਇ ॥ ਆਪ ਤੁਹੀ ਝਗਰਾ ਕਰੋ ਤੁਮਹੀ ਕਰੋ ਸਹਾਇ ॥੧੫॥
प्रिथम उपावहु जगत तुम तुमहीं पंथ बनाइ ॥ आप तुही झगरा करो तुमही करो सहाइ ॥१५॥
Firstly Thou createst the world, and then the Paths; then Thou crreatest the disputes and also help them.15.

ਮੱਛ ਕੱਛ ਬਾਰਾਹ ਤੁਮ ਤੁਮ ਬਾਵਨ ਅਵਤਾਰ ॥ ਨਾਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਬਉਧਾ ਤੁਹੀਂ ਤੁਹੀਂ ਜਗਤ ਕੋ ਸਾਰ ॥੧੬॥
मछ कछ बाराह तुम तुम बावन अवतार ॥ नार सिंघ बउधा तुहीं तुहीं जगत को सार ॥१६॥
Thou art Machh (fish incarnation), Kachh (tortoise incarnation) and Varaha (the boar incarnation); Thou art also the Dwarf incarnation; Thou art also narsingh and Buddha and Thou art the Essence of the whole world.16.

ਤੁਹੀਂ ਰਾਮ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਕ੍ਰਿਸ਼ਨ ਤੁਮ ਤੁਹੀਂ ਬਿਸ਼ਨ ਕੋ ਰੂਪ ॥ ਤੁਹੀਂ ਪ੍ਰਜਾ ਸਭ ਜਗਤ ਕੀ ਤੁਹੀਂ ਆਪ ਹੀ ਭੂਪ ॥੧੭॥
तुहीं राम स्री क्रिशन तुम तुहीं बिशन को रूप ॥ तुहीं प्रजा सभ जगत की तुहीं आप ही भूप ॥१७॥
Thou art Rama, Krishna and Vishnu; Thou art the subjects of the whole world and Thou art also the Sovereign.17.

ਤੁਹੀਂ ਬਿਪ੍ਰ ਛਤ੍ਰੀ ਤੁਹੀਂ ਤੁਹੀਂ ਰੰਕ ਅਰੁ ਰਾਉ ॥ ਸ਼ਾਮ ਦਾਮ ਅਰੁ ਡੰਡ ਤੂੰ ਤੁਮਹੀ ਭੇਦ ਉਪਾਉ ॥੧੮॥
तुहीं बिप्र छत्री तुहीं तुहीं रंक अरु राउ ॥ शाम दाम अरु डंड तूं तुमही भेद उपाउ ॥१८॥
Thou art the Brahmin, Kshatriya, the king and the poor; Thou art also Sama, Sama, Dand and Bhed and also other remedies.18.

ਸੀਸ ਤੁਹੀਂ ਕਾਯਾ ਤੁਹੀਂ ਤੈਂ ਪ੍ਰਾਨੀ ਕੇ ਪ੍ਰਾਨ ॥ ਤੈਂ ਬਿਦਯਾ ਜਗ ਬਕਤ੍ਰ ਹੁਇ ਕਰੇ ਬੇਦ ਬਖਯਾਨ ॥੧੯॥
सीस तुहीं काया तुहीं तैं प्रानी के प्रान ॥ तैं बिदया जग बकत्र हुइ करे बेद बखयान ॥१९॥
Thou art the head, trunk and the life-force of all the creatures; the whole world imbibes all the learning from Thee and elucidates the Vedas.19.

ਬਿਸਿਖ ਬਾਨ ਧਨੁਖਾਗ੍ਰ ਭਨ ਸਰ ਕੈਬਰ ਜਿਹ ਨਾਮ ॥ ਤੀਰ ਖਤੰਗ ਤਤਾਰਚੇ ਸਦਾ ਕਰੋ ਮਮ ਕਾਮ ॥੨੦॥
बिसिख बान धनुखाग्र भन सर कैबर जिह नाम ॥ तीर खतंग ततारचे सदा करो मम काम ॥२०॥
Thou art the significant arrow fitted in the bow and Thou art also called the warrior Kaibar; O Thou called by various names of the arrows ! You may also do my job.20.

ਤੈਣੀਰਾਲੈ ਸ਼ਤ੍ਰ ਅਰਿ ਮ੍ਰਿਗ ਅੰਤਕ ਸਸ ਬਾਨ ॥ ਤੁਮ ਬੈਰਣ ਪ੍ਰਥਮੈ ਹਨੋ ਬਹੁਰੋ ਬਜੈ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾਨ ॥੨੧॥
तैणीरालै शत्र अरि म्रिग अंतक सस बान ॥ तुम बैरण प्रथमै हनो बहुरो बजै क्रिपान ॥२१॥
Thy house is the quiver and Thou killest like deer the enemies by becoming the shaft-power; Thy reality is that Thou killest the enemies beforehand and the sword strikes later
ਤੁਮ ਪਾਟਸ ਪਾਸੀ ਪਰਸ ਪਰਮ ਸਿੰਧ ਕੀ ਖਾਨ ॥ ਤੇ ਜਗ ਕੇ ਰਾਜਾ ਭਏ ਦੀਅ ਤਵ ਜਿਹ ਬਰਦਾਨ ॥੨੨॥
तुम पाटस पासी परस परम सिंध की खान ॥ ते जग के राजा भए दीअ तव जिह बरदान ॥२२॥
Thou art the axe which tears away the enemies and also Thou art the noose, which binds down; Thou art Supremely Enduring One also; on whomsoever Thou didst bestow the boon, Thou didst make him the king of the world.22.

ਸੀਸ ਸ਼ਤ੍ਰ ਅਰਿ ਅਰਿਆਰ ਅਸਿ ਖੰਡੋ ਖੜਗ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾਨ ॥ ਸ਼ਕ੍ਰ ਸੁਰੇਸਰ ਤੁਮ ਕੀਯੋ ਭਗਤਿ ਆਪੁਨੋ ਜਾਨ ॥੨੩॥
सीस शत्र अरि अरिआर असि खंडो खड़ग क्रिपान ॥ शक्र सुरेसर तुम कीयो भगति आपुनो जान ॥२३॥
Thou art the sword and dagger chopping the enemies and considering Indra as Thy devotee; Thou didst bestow on him the position of the king of gods.23.

ਜਮਧਰ ਜਮਦਾੜਾ ਜਬਰ ਜੋਧਾਂਤਕ ਜਿਹ ਨਾਇ ॥ਲੂਟ ਕੂਟ ਲੀਜਤ ਤਿਨੈ ਜੇ ਬਿਨ ਬਾਂਧੇ ਜਾਇ ॥੨੪॥
जमधर जमदाड़ा जबर जोधांतक जिह नाइ ॥लूट कूट लीजत तिनै जे बिन बांधे जाइ ॥२४॥
Yamdhaar and Yamdadh and all other names of the weapons fro the destruction of the warriors, Thou hast folded up and bound all their power in Thyself.24.

ਬਾਂਕ ਬਜ੍ਰ ਬਿਛੂਓ ਬਿਸਿਖਿ ਬਿਰਹਬਾਨ ਸਭ ਰੂਪ ॥ ਜਿਨ ਕੋ ਤੁਮ ਕਿਰਪਾ ਕਰੀ ਭਏ ਜਗਤ ਕੇ ਭੂਪ ॥੨੫॥
बांक बज्र बिछूओ बिसिखि बिरहबान सभ रूप ॥ जिन को तुम किरपा करी भए जगत के भूप ॥२५॥
Baank, Bajar, Bichhuaa and the shafts of love, on whomsoever Thou didst shower Thy Grace, they all became the Sovereigns of the world.25.

ਸ਼ਸਤ੍ਰ ਸ਼ੇਰ ਸਮਰਾਂਤ ਕਰਿ ਸਿੱਪਰਾਰਿ ਸ਼ਮਸ਼ੇਰ ॥ ਮੁਕਤ ਜਾਲ ਜਮ ਕੇ ਭਏ ਜਿਮੈ ਕਹਿਯੋ ਇਕ ਬੇਰ ॥੨੬॥
शसत्र शेर समरांत करि सिपरारि शमशेर ॥ मुकत जाल जम के भए जिमै कहियो इक बेर ॥२६॥
The lion is Thy weapons like the sword in the war, which destroys the enemies; he, on whom, Thou didst shower Thy Grace, he was redeemed from th noose of Yama.26.

ਸੈਫ ਸਰੋਹੀ ਸ਼ੱਤ੍ਰ ਅਰਿ ਸਾਰੰਗਾਰਿ ਜਿਹ ਨਾਮ ॥ ਸਦਾ ਹਮਾਰੇ ਚਿਤ ਬਸੋ ਸਦਾ ਕਰੋ ਮਮ ਕਾਮ ॥੨੭॥
सैफ सरोही शत्र अरि सारंगारि जिह नाम ॥ सदा हमारे चित बसो सदा करो मम काम ॥२७॥
Thou art the Saif and Sarohi and Thy Name is the destroyer of the enemies; You abide in our heart and fulfil our tasks.27.

ਇਤਿ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਨਾਮ ਮਾਲਾ ਪੁਰਾਣੇ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਭਗਉਤੀ ਉਸਤਤ ਪ੍ਰਿਥਮ ਧਿਆਇ ਸਮਾਪਤਮ ਸਤੁ ਸੁਭਮ ਸਤੁ ॥
इति स्री नाम माला पुराणे स्री भगउती उसतत प्रिथम धिआइ समापतम सतु सुभम सतु ॥
End of the first chapter entitled "The Praise of the Primal Power" in Shri Nam-Mala Purana.


And let us say that Sakat mati person wants to make say peer wirshipper like Panj Peer worshipper to revert to weapon worship so do we have any such example in hisotry perhaps no.

So far Sultanis etc were told to worship Akal by our Gurus and Guru did oppose dead worship.

Sultanis worship dead by offering goat,swets etc. and so that by spritual power sultani givwe them boom.(more with Pagan Sultanis).

or say they may recomdedn there cause to God(more in Muslims Sultanis).

But one thing is must in Sultanis that is they will always have duality in thier mind.Other then God five peers or even more peers.


ਸਾਂਗ ਸਰੋਹੀ ਸੈਫ ਅਸ ਤੀਰ ਤੁਪਕ ਤਲਵਾਰ ॥ ਸੱਤ੍ਰਾਂਤਕ ਕਵਚਾਂਤਿ ਕਰ ਕਰੀਐ ਰੱਛ ਹਮਾਰ ॥੧॥
सांग सरोही सैफ अस तीर तुपक तलवार ॥ सत्रांतक कवचांति कर करीऐ रछ हमार ॥१॥
O Lord ! Protect us by creating Saang, Sarohi, Saif (Sword), As, Teer (arrow) tupak (gun), Talwaar (sword), and other weapons and armours causing the destruction of the enemies.1.

ਅਸ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾਨ ਧਾਰਾਧਰੀ ਸੈਲ ਸੂਫ ਜਮਦਾਢ ॥ ਕਵਚਾਂਤਕ ਸੱਤ੍ਰਾਂਤ ਕਰ ਤੇਗ ਤੀਰ ਧਰਬਾਢ ॥੨॥
अस क्रिपान धाराधरी सैल सूफ जमदाढ ॥ कवचांतक सत्रांत कर तेग तीर धरबाढ ॥२॥
O Lord ! Creat As, Kripan (sword), Dharaddhari, Sail, Soof, Jamaadh, Tegh (saber), Teer (saber), Teer (arrow), Talwar(sward), causing the destruction of armours and enemies.2.

in first row line if we read kar as hand and not has do then what will become.
ie Saang, Sarohi, Saif (Sword), As, Teer (arrow) tupak (gun), Talwaar (sword), and other weapons and armours hand protect us.

next lines also called all such weapons and amours as hand.Or saome one whose hand is all these weapons.

if we read the first line Kar(Hand) and Kariye(do) are wreattten separately.

There is not need to write it twice for the same do.But hand can have attrribute of terror to foe(Shartanatak) and Kawachant(end of aurmour).

first two lines may mean to pary to some one with hand as weapon or attributes like that.
ਅਸ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾਨ ਖੰਡੋ ਖੜਗ ਤੁਪਕ ਤਬਰ ਅਰੁ ਤੀਰ ॥ ਸੈਫ ਸਰੋਹੀ ਸੈਹਥੀ ਯਹੈ ਹਮਾਰੈ ਪੀਰ ॥੩॥
अस क्रिपान खंडो खड़ग तुपक तबर अरु तीर ॥ सैफ सरोही सैहथी यहै हमारै पीर ॥३॥
As, Kripan (sword), Khanda, Khadag (sword), Tupak (gun), Tabar (hatched), Teer (arrow), Saif (sword), Sarohi and Saihathi, all these are our adorable seniors.3.

ਤੀਰ ਤੁਹੀ ਸੈਹਥੀ ਤੁਹੀ ਤੁਹੀ ਤਬਰ ਤਲਵਾਰ ॥ ਨਾਮ ਤਿਹਾਰੋ ਜੋ ਜਪੈ ਭਏ ਸਿੰਧ ਭਵ ਪਾਰ ॥੪॥
तीर तुही सैहथी तुही तुही तबर तलवार ॥ नाम तिहारो जो जपै भए सिंध भव पार ॥४॥
Thou are the Teer (arrow), Thou are Saihathi, Thou art Tabar (hatchet), and Talwaar (sword); he, who remembers Thy Name crosses the dreadful ocean of existence.4

next line talks of nine weapons as peer.

Term peer a singular is used not peeran or peeraha or peergan ie plural.

That means all nine are termed as equal to one peer or elder.

let us say that let there be nine peers for nine weappons.

but the lines to come repaet that6 all are one.

Das hopes that adawaitism also finds one in all and so that Gurmat. See the whole of the paragraph to follow.

one if refer to four weapons and told that rembering the name of that one leads us away from sea of worldyness or let us have salvation.

And that one is further refered to as one.
Ambala Sahib also forgot Ek Oankar Sri Wahiguru Ji Ki Fateh.

Sri Mukhwak Patshahi Dasvin must also means totaly differnt so far people have not understood.(Das wil put light on it later and Trya Chartar 108 and 109 will be givne where some Marrige song was writtan and Amabala Sahib opposed.And what is Mitar Piarye Nu deals with as it is in his book(to be continued..)
 
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Das thereby starts why did one verse was oppsed to be sung by Amabala Sahib, regrading Jori Jiyo Jug Char Tihari.

it is from Triaya Charitar 108 but story expands to both 108 and 109 which Ambala sahib did not mentioned and let it reamin in 108.This is a very Big mistake.

Bhai Harbans Singh ji also did not mention it in Dasham Granth Darpan writtan to oppose Amabala sahib.

perhaps often das is told by welwishers including from AKJ(das recently had a sort of online debate with a person claiming to be from AKJ bing Anti to Kala Afghana Ji yet pro to Ambala Sahib,Das just for this asked another Brother like frind from AKJ about what he thinks.This brother from AKJ was pro to Vachitar Natak and told das to not to keep any doubt about Guru) to not to go too deep into it.

Das knows that by going to deep and thingking like Say Kala Afghan Sahib or Ambala Sahib Ji is itself very painful as thinking like Araya Samajis.But by undergoing mental torture of reading such things and loosing spritual bliss of das by thinking just like them ,if by this das is able to remove the doubts from the minds of coming genration of Panth about Dasham Granth.Das is ready for that mentalo pain.At the most das could be reborn but no problem.Das love Guru by Mercy of Guru and al is in hand of Guru.

Then das will first give one verse from Guru Granth Sahib Ji.This is often used by idiotic Hindus to prove that Sikh Gurus worshiped Hindu deities.

As we know that {censored} reomevs sandelwoods paste applied on it and washes as loves ash or dust.

So it is thier lover intellect which does not make them understand that this verse on page/part 1310 and 1309 and 1308is telling something anti caste.Ie person by birht does not becomes great but by mercy of Akal when person does loves akal things change.
कानड़ा महला ४ ॥
kaanrhaa mehlaa 4.
Kaanraa, Fourth Mehl:

ਜਪਿ ਮਨ ਹਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਤਰਾਵੈਗੋ
जपि मन हरि हरि नामु तरावैगो ॥
jap man har har naam taraavaigo.
O mind, chant the Name of the Lord, Har, Har, and be carried across.

ਜੋ ਜੋ ਜਪੈ ਸੋਈ ਗਤਿ ਪਾਵੈ ਜਿਉ ਧ੍ਰੂ ਪ੍ਰਹਿਲਾਦੁ ਸਮਾਵੈਗੋ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ
जो जो जपै सोई गति पावै जिउ ध्रू प्रहिलादु समावैगो ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥
jo jo japai so-ee gat paavai ji-o Dharoo par-hilaad samaavaigo. ||1|| rahaa-o.
Whoever chants and meditates on it is emancipated. Like Dhroo and Prahlaad, they merge in the Lord. ||1||Pause||


ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾ ਕਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਜੀਉ ਕਰਿ ਕਿਰਪਾ ਨਾਮਿ ਲਗਾਵੈਗੋ
क्रिपा क्रिपा क्रिपा करि हरि जीउ करि किरपा नामि लगावैगो ॥
kirpaa kirpaa kirpaa kar har jee-o kar kirpaa naam lagaavaigo.
Mercy, mercy, mercy - O Dear Lord, please shower Your Mercy on me, and attach me to Your Name.

ਕਰਿ ਕਿਰਪਾ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੂ ਮਿਲਾਵਹੁ ਮਿਲਿ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਨਾਮੁ ਧਿਆਵੈਗੋ ॥੧॥
करि किरपा सतिगुरू मिलावहु मिलि सतिगुर नामु धिआवैगो ॥१॥
kar kirpaa satguroo milaavhu mil satgur naam Dhi-aavaigo. ||1||
Please be Merciful, and lead me to meet the True Guru; meeting the True Guru, I meditate on the Naam, the Name of the Lord. ||1||

ਜਨਮ ਜਨਮ ਕੀ ਹਉਮੈ ਮਲੁ ਲਾਗੀ ਮਿਲਿ ਸੰਗਤਿ ਮਲੁ ਲਹਿ ਜਾਵੈਗੋ
जनम जनम की हउमै मलु लागी मिलि संगति मलु लहि जावैगो ॥
janam janam kee ha-umai mal laagee mil sangat mal leh jaavaigo.
The filth of egotism from countless incarnations sticks to me; joining the Sangat, the Holy Congregation, this filth is washed away.

ਜਿਉ ਲੋਹਾ ਤਰਿਓ ਸੰਗਿ ਕਾਸਟ ਲਗਿ ਸਬਦਿ ਗੁਰੂ ਹਰਿ ਪਾਵੈਗੋ ॥੨॥
जिउ लोहा तरिओ संगि कासट लगि सबदि गुरू हरि पावैगो ॥२॥
ji-o lohaa tari-o sang kaasat lag sabad guroo har paavaigo. ||2||
As iron is carried across if it is attached to wood, one who is attached to the Word of the Guru's Shabad finds the Lord. ||2||

ਸੰਗਤਿ ਸੰਤ ਮਿਲਹੁ ਸਤਸੰਗਤਿ ਮਿਲਿ ਸੰਗਤਿ ਹਰਿ ਰਸੁ ਆਵੈਗੋ
संगति संत मिलहु सतसंगति मिलि संगति हरि रसु आवैगो ॥
sangat sant milhu satsangat mil sangat har ras aavaigo.
Joining the Society of the Saints, joining the Sat Sangat, the True Congregation, you shall come to receive the Sublime Essence of the Lord.

ਬਿਨੁ ਸੰਗਤਿ ਕਰਮ ਕਰੈ ਅਭਿਮਾਨੀ ਕਢਿ ਪਾਣੀ ਚੀਕੜੁ ਪਾਵੈਗੋ ॥੩॥
बिनु संगति करम करै अभिमानी कढि पाणी चीकड़ु पावैगो ॥३॥
bin sangat karam karai abhimaanee kadh paanee cheekarh paavaigo. ||3||
But not joining the Sangat, and committing actions in egotistical pride, is like drawing out clean water, and throwing it in the mud. ||3||

ਭਗਤ ਜਨਾ ਕੇ ਹਰਿ ਰਖਵਾਰੇ ਜਨ ਹਰਿ ਰਸੁ ਮੀਠ ਲਗਾਵੈਗੋ
भगत जना के हरि रखवारे जन हरि रसु मीठ लगावैगो ॥
bhagat janaa kay har rakhvaaray jan har ras meeth lagaavaigo.
The Lord is the Protector and Saving Grace of His humble devotees. The Lord's Sublime Essence seems so sweet to these humble beings.

ਖਿਨੁ ਖਿਨੁ ਨਾਮੁ ਦੇਇ ਵਡਿਆਈ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਉਪਦੇਸਿ ਸਮਾਵੈਗੋ ॥੪॥
खिनु खिनु नामु देइ वडिआई सतिगुर उपदेसि समावैगो ॥४॥
khin khin naam day-ay vadi-aa-ee satgur updays samaavaigo. ||4||
Each and every instant, they are blessed with the Glorious Greatness of the Naam; through the Teachings of the True Guru, they are absorbed in Him. ||4||

ਭਗਤ ਜਨਾ ਕਉ ਸਦਾ ਨਿਵਿ ਰਹੀਐ ਜਨ ਨਿਵਹਿ ਤਾ ਫਲ ਗੁਨ ਪਾਵੈਗੋ
भगत जना कउ सदा निवि रहीऐ जन निवहि ता फल गुन पावैगो ॥
bhagat janaa ka-o sadaa niv rahee-ai jan niveh taa fal gun paavaigo.
Bow forever in deep respect to the humble devotees; if you bow to those humble beings, you shall obtain the fruit of virtue.

ਜੋ ਨਿੰਦਾ ਦੁਸਟ ਕਰਹਿ ਭਗਤਾ ਕੀ ਹਰਨਾਖਸ ਜਿਉ ਪਚਿ ਜਾਵੈਗੋ ॥੫॥
जो निंदा दुसट करहि भगता की हरनाखस जिउ पचि जावैगो ॥५॥
jo nindaa dusat karahi bhagtaa kee harnaakhas ji-o pach jaavaigo. ||5||
Those wicked enemies who slander the devotees are destroyed, like Harnaakhash. ||5||

ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ਕਮਲ ਪੁਤੁ ਮੀਨ ਬਿਆਸਾ ਤਪੁ ਤਾਪਨ ਪੂਜ ਕਰਾਵੈਗੋ
ब्रहम कमल पुतु मीन बिआसा तपु तापन पूज करावैगो ॥
barahm kamal put meen bi-aasaa tap taapan pooj karaavaigo.
Brahma, the son of the lotus, and Vyaas, the son of the fish, practiced austere penance and were worshipped.

ਜੋ ਜੋ ਭਗਤੁ ਹੋਇ ਸੋ ਪੂਜਹੁ ਭਰਮਨ ਭਰਮੁ ਚੁਕਾਵੈਗੋ ॥੬॥
जो जो भगतु होइ सो पूजहु भरमन भरमु चुकावैगो ॥६॥
jo jo bhagat ho-ay so poojahu bharman bharam chukaavaigo. ||6||
Whoever is a devotee - worship and adore that person. Get rid of your doubts and superstitions. ||6||

ਜਾਤ ਨਜਾਤਿ ਦੇਖਿ ਮਤ ਭਰਮਹੁ ਸੁਕ ਜਨਕ ਪਗੀਂ ਲਗਿ ਧਿਆਵੈਗੋ
जात नजाति देखि मत भरमहु सुक जनक पगीं लगि धिआवैगो ॥
jaat najaat daykh mat bharmahu suk janak pageeN lag Dhi-aavaigo.
Do not be fooled by appearances of high and low social class. Suk Dayv bowed at the feet of Janak, and meditated.

ਜੂਠਨ ਜੂਠਿ ਪਈ ਸਿਰ ਊਪਰਿ ਖਿਨੁ ਮਨੂਆ ਤਿਲੁ ਡੁਲਾਵੈਗੋ ॥੭॥
जूठन जूठि पई सिर ऊपरि खिनु मनूआ तिलु न डुलावैगो ॥७॥
joothan jooth pa-ee sir oopar khin manoo-aa til na dulaavaigo. ||7||
Even though Janak threw his left-overs and garbage on Suk Dayv's head, his mind did not waver, even for an instant. ||7||

ਜਨਕ ਜਨਕ ਬੈਠੇ ਸਿੰਘਾਸਨਿ ਨਉ ਮੁਨੀ ਧੂਰਿ ਲੈ ਲਾਵੈਗੋ
जनक जनक बैठे सिंघासनि नउ मुनी धूरि लै लावैगो ॥
janak janak baithay singhaasan na-o munee Dhoor lai laavaigo.
Janak sat upon his regal throne, and applied the dust of the nine sages to his forehead.

ਨਾਨਕ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾ ਕਰਿ ਠਾਕੁਰ ਮੈ ਦਾਸਨਿ ਦਾਸ ਕਰਾਵੈਗੋ ॥੮॥੨॥
नानक क्रिपा क्रिपा करि ठाकुर मै दासनि दास करावैगो ॥८॥२॥
naanak kirpaa kirpaa kar thaakur mai daasan daas karaavaigo. ||8||2||
Please shower Nanak with your Mercy, O my Lord and Master; make him the slave of Your slaves. ||8||2||

ਕਾਨੜਾ ਮਹਲਾ
कानड़ा महला ४ ॥
kaanrhaa mehlaa 4.
Kaanraa, Fourth Mehl:

ਮਨੁ ਗੁਰਮਤਿ ਰਸਿ ਗੁਨ ਗਾਵੈਗੋ
मनु गुरमति रसि गुन गावैगो ॥
man gurmat ras gun gaavaigo.
O mind, follow the Guru's Teachings, and joyfully sing God's Praises.

ਜਿਹਵਾ ਏਕ ਹੋਇ ਲਖ ਕੋਟੀ ਲਖ ਕੋਟੀ ਕੋਟਿ ਧਿਆਵੈਗੋ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ
जिहवा एक होइ लख कोटी लख कोटी कोटि धिआवैगो ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥
jihvaa ayk ho-ay lakh kotee lakh kotee kot Dhi-aavaigo. ||1|| rahaa-o.
If my one tongue became hundreds of thousands and millions, I would meditate on Him millions and millions of times. ||1||Pause||

ਸਹਸ ਫਨੀ ਜਪਿਓ ਸੇਖਨਾਗੈ ਹਰਿ ਜਪਤਿਆ ਅੰਤੁ ਪਾਵੈਗੋ
सहस फनी जपिओ सेखनागै हरि जपतिआ अंतु न पावैगो ॥
sahas fanee japi-o saykhnaagai har japti-aa ant na paavaigo.
The serpent king chants and meditates on the Lord with his thousands of heads, but even by these chants, he cannot find the Lord's limits.

ਤੂ ਅਥਾਹੁ ਅਤਿ ਅਗਮੁ ਅਗਮੁ ਹੈ ਮਤਿ ਗੁਰਮਤਿ ਮਨੁ ਠਹਰਾਵੈਗੋ ॥੧॥
तू अथाहु अति अगमु अगमु है मति गुरमति मनु ठहरावैगो ॥१॥
too athaahu at agam agam hai mat gurmat man thehraavaigo. ||1||
You are Utterly Unfathomable, Inaccessible and Infinite. Through the Wisdom of the Guru's Teachings, the mind becomes steady and balanced. ||1||

ਜਿਨ ਤੂ ਜਪਿਓ ਤੇਈ ਜਨ ਨੀਕੇ ਹਰਿ ਜਪਤਿਅਹੁ ਕਉ ਸੁਖੁ ਪਾਵੈਗੋ
जिन तू जपिओ तेई जन नीके हरि जपतिअहु कउ सुखु पावैगो ॥
jin too japi-o tay-ee jan neekay har japti-ahu ka-o sukh paavaigo.
Those humble beings who meditate on You are noble and exalted. Meditating on the Lord, they are at peace.

ਬਿਦਰ ਦਾਸੀ ਸੁਤੁ ਛੋਕ ਛੋਹਰਾ ਕ੍ਰਿਸਨੁ ਅੰਕਿ ਗਲਿ ਲਾਵੈਗੋ ॥੨॥
बिदर दासी सुतु छोक छोहरा क्रिसनु अंकि गलि लावैगो ॥२॥
bidar daasee sut chhok chhohraa krisan ank gal laavaigo. ||2||
Bidur, the son of a slave-girl, was an untouchable, but Krishna hugged him close in His Embrace. ||2||

ਜਲ ਤੇ ਓਪਤਿ ਭਈ ਹੈ ਕਾਸਟ ਕਾਸਟ ਅੰਗਿ ਤਰਾਵੈਗੋ
जल ते ओपति भई है कासट कासट अंगि तरावैगो ॥
jal tay opat bha-ee hai kaasat kaasat ang taraavaigo.
Wood is produced from water, but by holding onto wood, one is saved from drowning.

ਰਾਮ ਜਨਾ ਹਰਿ ਆਪਿ ਸਵਾਰੇ ਅਪਨਾ ਬਿਰਦੁ ਰਖਾਵੈਗੋ ॥੩॥
राम जना हरि आपि सवारे अपना बिरदु रखावैगो ॥३॥
raam janaa har aap savaaray apnaa birad rakhaavaigo. ||3||
The Lord Himself embellishes and exalts His humble servants; He confirms His Innate Nature. ||3||

ਹਮ ਪਾਥਰ ਲੋਹ ਲੋਹ ਬਡ ਪਾਥਰ ਗੁਰ ਸੰਗਤਿ ਨਾਵ ਤਰਾਵੈਗੋ
हम पाथर लोह लोह बड पाथर गुर संगति नाव तरावैगो ॥
ham paathar loh loh bad paathar gur sangat naav taraavaigo.
I am like a stone, or a piece of iron, heavy stone and iron; in the Boat of the Guru's Congregation, I am carried across,

ਜਿਉ ਸਤਸੰਗਤਿ ਤਰਿਓ ਜੁਲਾਹੋ ਸੰਤ ਜਨਾ ਮਨਿ ਭਾਵੈਗੋ ॥੪॥
जिउ सतसंगति तरिओ जुलाहो संत जना मनि भावैगो ॥४॥
ji-o satsangat tari-o julaaho sant janaa man bhaavaigo. ||4||
like Kabeer the weaver, who was saved in the Sat Sangat, the True Congregation. He became pleasing to the minds of the humble Saints. ||4||

ਖਰੇ ਖਰੋਏ ਬੈਠਤ ਊਠਤ ਮਾਰਗਿ ਪੰਥਿ ਧਿਆਵੈਗੋ
खरे खरोए बैठत ऊठत मारगि पंथि धिआवैगो ॥
kharay kharo-ay baithat oothat maarag panth Dhi-aavaigo.
Standing up, sitting down, rising up and walking on the path, I meditate.

ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਬਚਨ ਬਚਨ ਹੈ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਪਾਧਰੁ ਮੁਕਤਿ ਜਨਾਵੈਗੋ ॥੫॥
सतिगुर बचन बचन है सतिगुर पाधरु मुकति जनावैगो ॥५॥
satgur bachan bachan hai satgur paaDhar mukat janaavaigo. ||5||
The True Guru is the Word, and the Word is the True Guru, who teaches the Path of Liberation. ||5||

ਸਾਸਨਿ ਸਾਸਿ ਸਾਸਿ ਬਲੁ ਪਾਈ ਹੈ ਨਿਹਸਾਸਨਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਧਿਆਵੈਗੋ
सासनि सासि सासि बलु पाई है निहसासनि नामु धिआवैगो ॥
saasan saas saas bal paa-ee hai nihsaasan naam Dhi-aavaigo.
By His Training, I find strength with each and every breath; now that I am trained and tamed, I meditate on the Naam, the Name of the Lord.

ਗੁਰ ਪਰਸਾਦੀ ਹਉਮੈ ਬੂਝੈ ਤੌ ਗੁਰਮਤਿ ਨਾਮਿ ਸਮਾਵੈਗੋ ॥੬॥
गुर परसादी हउमै बूझै तौ गुरमति नामि समावैगो ॥६॥
gur parsaadee ha-umai boojhai tou gurmat naam samaavaigo. ||6||
By Guru's Grace, egotism is extinguished, and then, through the Guru's Teachings, I merge in the Naam. ||6||
ਸਤਿਗੁਰੁ ਦਾਤਾ ਜੀਅ ਜੀਅਨ ਕੋ ਭਾਗਹੀਨ ਨਹੀ ਭਾਵੈਗੋ
सतिगुरु दाता जीअ जीअन को भागहीन नही भावैगो ॥
satgur daataa jee-a jee-an ko bhaagheen nahee bhaavaigo.
The True Guru is the Giver of the life of the soul, but the unfortunate ones do not love Him.

ਫਿਰਿ ਏਹ ਵੇਲਾ ਹਾਥਿ ਆਵੈ ਪਰਤਾਪੈ ਪਛੁਤਾਵੈਗੋ ॥੭॥
फिरि एह वेला हाथि न आवै परतापै पछुतावैगो ॥७॥
fir ayh vaylaa haath na aavai partaapai pachhutaavaigo. ||7||
This opportunity shall not come into their hands again; in the end, they will suffer in torment and regret. ||7||

ਜੇ ਕੋ ਭਲਾ ਲੋੜੈ ਭਲ ਅਪਨਾ ਗੁਰ ਆਗੈ ਢਹਿ ਢਹਿ ਪਾਵੈਗੋ
जे को भला लोड़ै भल अपना गुर आगै ढहि ढहि पावैगो ॥
jay ko bhalaa lorhai bhal apnaa gur aagai dheh dheh paavaigo.
If a good person seeks goodness for himself, he should bow low in humble surrender to the Guru.

ਨਾਨਕ ਦਇਆ ਦਇਆ ਕਰਿ ਠਾਕੁਰ ਮੈ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਭਸਮ ਲਗਾਵੈਗੋ ॥੮॥੩॥
नानक दइआ दइआ करि ठाकुर मै सतिगुर भसम लगावैगो ॥८॥३॥
naanak da-i-aa da-i-aa kar thaakur mai satgur bhasam lagaavaigo. ||8||3||
Nanak prays: please show kindness and compassion to me, O my Lord and Master, that I may apply the dust of the True Guru to my forehead. ||8||3||


Das always try to bring the whole verse instead of one or two lines.
These verse anyone can tell do talk about person born with low family background yet got respect.

Das thinks that ambala Sahib Ji would have read this.

here Brahma is termed as son of lotus,Vysa as son of fish.

It is possible as in case of Baldev that his mother Rohini took feoutus from the womb of Devki during 7th time by pulling(Sankarshan so that also became another name of Baldev).and gave Birth to elder Brother of Lord Krishna.

That could be artifical inseminusation or test tube baby type concept in past.Or feoutus tranplan type thing.

It could be a mere concept but not the relity as Vysa or Brahmna may be just a sort of examples to clearlyfy concept and not the realy sons of lotus or fish.

anyway Vysa or Vidur both were bron outside wedlock yet find mention and respect.Due to thier devotion or good deeds.

Sa Jaat Sa Paat Hai Jei Tey Karan Kamaye.

This may mean that ,That(Akal) is Caste and That (Akal) is creed from that mercy is earned.

This may also mean that by self deeds castes and creeds are made.

This has a very big relation to this 108 and 109 chaercotors.

We have Kapil Muni often as per some deemed as incarnation of Vishnu who gets into contraol of a fairly called Rambha and keeps on seeing her that his seman gets emitted.

This shows the charector of great Hindu sages as satire and who can be some much ruthless to hindus then our Tenth Master who was expert in giving shock treatment as often very great intellectual Hindus use to not marry and use to remain calibatesand intellect in thier genes went to waste.

Guru proved that calibacy is more something to be shunned.Anyway Kapil was a Muni or one who does not speak and has restrain on voice but could not had it on lust.Supresing human feelings one day causes eruptions as it is shown here.

When Semen of Muni were fallen,Rambha became pregenant.

here it is repeated that semen fallen and emprageneted Rambha.This may means that after immission there could be sex and that made Rambha pragenant.

Ambala Sahib worte that she picked the sperm from ground and put it in her womb.Had he been from supressing Arya Samaji socity then ti could be expected from his state of mind.

Das repeats that as per text there are two lines.

At once semen of Muni fallen on/in land.(line ends)

when only(did) Semen of muni fall,rambha became pragnent.(line ends).

both could be taken as two differant lines.

Once emiission occured after seeing then lady.

Another fall could be at the place (vagina)which made Rambha prgenent.

Otherwise it may measn as Amabala sahib said that she took semen from ground and put it in womb but here it is clearly stating that jsut after falling pregency occured.no mention of all that process.

it could be symbolism as used in birth of vysa or Vidur when they were said to ahve born without sex.But here Semen is mentioned.

It is termed as bindu in Guru Granth Sahib JI.Bindu is bit more spritual and not as easy to understand by common lower caste till some one teaches them.But Viraj is.Birbani in Haryanivi means lady.birban or Viryawan ie full of seman is common term in Hindi Area.

Guru Ji did have good hold on hindi and it can not be contradicited at all.

Then it is writtan that that(Adhan or Garb or feutus) was put in river and she left for angels/gods city or heavan.

So how good was father and how good was mother aswe could see.one is emitting seman on seeing a lady and making her pragent.

if we again read the intial five lines or so we may find that in second line he serached(heri) lady and came under her control we are told to listen (being) intellectual(Sujan).While eximing her form/beuty did his semen got emitied).This may waves with some signal towards forplay and sex.

So Father was of low chactor and mother was eqauly bad who threw her feoutus/child /infant in river indus.

We can only asume that here Adhan refer to child and she did not put her feuotus in river but child there.Otherwise similar story could be there to do with Vysa as he is writtan as son of fish.No human by scince can be son of fish or lotus as Shri Guru Granth Sahib ji state.

either it is telling us by symbols or may be scince could be as strong as in past or Guru knew that in future such things could be possilbe.

Das anyway deem it symbol to let us understand the main thing.

so Bad parents of child who is girl are told in first five lines.

she laters comes sailing on water of indus where Sindhu's King was there.He saw her.Then made her his doughter(god doughter).

She was named Sasi and King did served her in many ways(God father was good and very good).

when youth came to her.King made a Mantra(das would like to say thatb when we talk in say RSS and make plan we are told that we are doing Mantrana,Mantra is another name of Plan.So in Sanskrit minster is called Mantri as he helps king to make plan).

Later on in two more location in 108 we have term Mantra used for plan.

Das wants rise another question.

Only lingusit and polygot like Guru can use term Mantra for plan.

while Mantra in Wam Margi or Sakat Margi is what we could use nearest term in English as spell.

Wamamrgi or people after miracle and worship of violent gods and ghosts etc, do use spells the world over.

But here term used for spell is used for plan and that is used by rulers only and expert in politics.

Term Matta in Punjabi is ampbransha (slang or chronological deformation)of Mantra of Sanskrit.

We all know that matta means plan in Punjabi.

Das will write further on it soon

(to be continued..)
 
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Jul 30, 2004
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Gurfateh

Das jsut got a link and copy of Letter of Bhai Mani Singh Ji to Mata Sundari Ji.
http://www.sikhiwiki.org/images/4/42/Bhai_ManiSinghLetter1.jpg

as per Gyani Surjeet Singh ji of Delhi,This leter is fake as he says that some language department people have reseached and found it to be writtan by nib and nib was not not yet made by 1820 so it is from latter half of ninteenth centuary and not as for early part of eiteenth centuary.

Das has the follwoing question?

From when did Language deparment people started to do the work of forensic scince people?

By Machine nib was made by 1820 but quill was there in europe and some frenchmen did made fountain pen(perhpas by stylus) much early by hand?

Did language deparment peeople ahve enough resource to find that ink had metal content(of nib) and not of reeds or quill contant?

Did they have real origeonal and no photo copy?

Just have a look at letter below.

you could youself judge that is it from nib or from quil or reeds.

Give an eye to irregularity of breadth of letters they can be by both nib and quill and reed also.
 
Jul 30, 2004
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May the Almighty help us.
Mani Singh makes his humble prostration at the holy feet of his venerable mother. Further news is that the climate of this place has aggravated my rheumatism and my health deteriorates fast. I will have to listen to the healing parable of the tertian fever. But my illness has caused no slackness in the performance of the holy service of the Hari Mandir (Golden Temple). The Khalsa no more hods away over the country and its power has waned. The Sikhs have migrated to the mountain retreats. The Malechhas reign supreme in the country. There is no security for the (Sikh) children and women in any habitation. They are hunted out and killed. The opposing states have also joined hands with them. The Hindalis spy on the Sikhs. All (the Sikhs) have deserted the Chak (The earliest name of Amritsar). The Mutsaddis (priests) have also fled. So far the Immortal Lord protects me. Tomorrow is uncertain. What is ordained by the Lord shall prevail. The adopted son of Binod Singh has passed away. Among the books I sent per Jhanda Singh, there is one entitled "303 Chritra Upakhyans" by the Lord (Guru Gobind Singh). Give that to Sihan Singh in the Mahal (Matia Mahal in the interior of Delhi City). So far there is no trace of the book "Nam Mala". I found the first part of "Krishna Avtar" but not the second. I shall send it when available. There is a rumour in the country that Banda (Bahadur) has made his good escape from the Emperor's jail. May the Guru protect him. The Guru's family (the descendants of the Guru) at Khandur have sent five tolas of gold as a gift for your son's bride(an adopted son of Mata Ji, as all of her four sons were martyred already). Recover seventeen rupees from Jhanda Singh ; I gave him five rupees to meet the expenses of the journey…(?) These expenses will be incurred by him. The Mutsaddis have not yet settled accounts, otherwise I would have sent a draft from the city (presumably Lahore) . If my health improves I shall come in the month of Kartik.
Baisakh 22
Signed - Mani Singh, Guruchak, Bunga
P.S. Reply in bamboo stick. (as being confidential)
 
Jul 30, 2004
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Gurfateh

Das will again start from intial line regarding Kapil Muni.

He is termed as incarnation of Vishnu and propogator of one of the Six Philosophies of old Sanatan Dharama by Amabla Sahib.

so due to these attribute Kapil Muni can not have semen discharge on seeing fairy.

Ambala Sahib if he was a Hindu he could have said that Guru was a Hindu and approver of Vishnu Ji and Six Darshan or Khat Darshan so he can not say.

As a Sikh das does not thing that Gurmat approves Khat Darshan or Vishnu as such.

Rahter it is more sattire on Vishnu and Darshan by Kapil Muni and Gurmat's disapproval to the same.


266 also write for Vishnu can not be God as was made stone by curse of feamel demon(Tulsi was wife of Jallendher,who could only be defeated if some one can spoli his wife and Vishnu does it.Tulsi curses him and he becomes stone.Latter Luxmi sister of Jallandher and wife of Vishnu tells Tulsi to forgive Vishnu and he is forgiven being Jija(sisters husband of Jallandher who be that time is killed by Shiva,worship of tulsi plant and saligram is due to this legend).When we see 109 we will find that when Kal(Akal) send urvasi then Shiva,his son and Brahma all become lattu(highly attracted )to her that is another porf that Kal is not the same as Shiva.



Das is only protesting that Ambala Sahib did gavean inpression that Guru considered Vishnu as infalliable,Kapil Ji and his philsosphy as imfaillable which is wrong as per Gurmat as imfalliable is God.

coming back to first five lines.
Dohra(couplets)

Muni Kapil went to one place one day.

Serached fairy and became controled listen oh knowledgable.

Name of fairy was Rambha and saw her form/beuty.

at once semen of muni was fallen on/in earth .

(Term Earth often mean for female reproductive organ and Beeraj or seman is often term as Beej or seed).

When Semen(Ret) did fall the Rambha there and then became Pargenent.

she put her pragency(foetus) in Indus Reiver ,went to city of angels.

(amabala Sahib wrote that Sindhu Sarita means sea while when here it is correclty writtan Sindhu(indus) Sarita(river).How can some one put same thing both in sea and river? how can sea river makes any sense or can sea(Sindhu) be a name of River which is true.

Chaupayee(quadrets).

There came (infant) girl floating.Ahead where King of Sind(a province in Pakistan named after river indus(sindhu)(was there).

Let us think here.

Ambala Sahib said that this girl was same which was from womb of Rambha.and it is unnatrual thing.(being born oput of lotus or fish are also unnatural things).And in river she became girl.

There are three things Sindhu Sarita,Flaoting and King of Sind.

The verse can be interpreted that she was from womb but we can deem it and interpret and and after proving otherwise das will agree that she was from Rambha and Kapil Muni.

Kapil had sex with Rambha and she did aborted the child by throwing the featus in Indus River.This proves that both were negitive.And in that place some thing negtive was done.

In Chaupayee Part.It is been told that there came a girl floating.This there could means in Indus river where Rambha did abortion and that girl can not be that feotis at all.

Five line scould be just to tell something about Indua and deeds of couple mention therein.Then it is writtan Agei(ahead in space or in time).that means in future where Sind king was there or Ahead where Sind king was there.

From some back place she(girl came flaoting) where King of sind was there(Indus does cross Sind,In fact in north it is called attock also and in Ladhakh and other tibbeteiann part there is a differant name).In Sind it is called Sindhu.

The first two line have some differant meaning.
1 .Floating in that(indus) Girl reached ahead where Sind king was there.
2.floating in that(indus) girl reached in future where king of sind was there.
3. Girl came floating at that place ahead where sind king was there.
4.Girl came flaoting in furte where sind king was there.

Das thinks that1 and 3 could be nearnest to the intenetion of wirter.


Das repeats that it is nowhere writtan that foetus became girl.

It is more story that a lady throws feotus in river just for shirking responsibility to go to angels city ,while a King of sind rescue and girl in trouble.

das thinks that it is clear but even then Das says that let this lady be doughter of Kapil and Rambh although it is doubfull be text itslef.(to be continued..)
 
Jul 30, 2004
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Gurfateh
He was father of Lord ParshuRam.

He was from the family of Bhrigu and was killed by some Sahstra Bahu Kstriyas as he did not conced to his unjust demads.To avenge his death his son Lord Jamdagini Rama killed Kastriyas.
 

soorma

SPNer
Apr 16, 2006
9
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guru fateh khalsa jiyo!

i am here with you only to learn about Sri Dasam Granth... i am studying the same from Giani Sher Singh Ji Ambale Walle ..a Nihang Singh From Budha Dal ..

i wish i will get to learn it in english and hence the synonomous vacabulary to punjabi

moreover i wish to learn the present day disscussion on Dasam Granth ..

once my B Tech is over i have planned to step into the field of research on sikh philosophy and history and to safeguard teh sarablohi traditions of panth from so called scholars

guru fateh
 

soorma

SPNer
Apr 16, 2006
9
0
letter By Shaheed Bhai Mani singh Ji written with metal nib???

guru fateh,
i did idsscussed this point with My teacher of Dasam Granth -Giani Sher Singh JI a Nihang Singh .
He is presently teaching historical sikh scriptures including dasam granth at 'Gurbani Brahm Videya Kendar Ambala'

i asked him about the metallic nib being used by Shaheed Bhai Mani Singh JI .. he answered me that even Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji used the metal nibs. Giani Ji said that these are present there at Paonta Sahib and there sikhs can have hteir Darshan, and Shaheed bhai Mani singh Ji was involved in Writing of Sri guru Granth Sahib Ji at Sri Damdama Sahib - Guru Ki Kashi so he did knew how to get them manufactured or may be carriying some along with from those good days at Paonta Sahib or Sri Anandpur Sahib

one point from my side is that if guru ji could get made so superior quality weapons on his own so how can we question that sikhs did'nt knew how to make a metal nib .. one more point Guru Ji used to put their nishan with arrows that had metal tip.

i totaly reject the theory that "letter by shaheed Bhai Mani singh ji is fake because it has been written(rather appears to be) with metalic nib".
 
Jul 30, 2004
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Gurfateh

Das at his visit to Paota Sahib recently so far could not get the Darshan of metalic nibs(of Guru's time).If at all this is true then invention of it can go to Sikhs.
 

drkhalsa

SPNer
Sep 16, 2004
1,308
54
Dear Vijaydeep Singh

Writing with quill pens changed little until the mid 19th century when metallic pens and pen nibs took over although again metal nibs have very early origins in that a pen with a bronze nib was found in the ruins of Pompeii so such instruments had to be used in classical times as they pre-date 79 AD. Other references are 'brazen' (bronze?) pens in 1465, and the 16th century Spanish calligrapher Juan de Yciar's 1548 Writing Manual mentioning Brass pens for very large writing. The wealthy had Gold and Silver nibbed pens in the 16th Century, often giving them as gifts but it is uncertain if these were truly writing pens. The nibs were curled at the upper end in an attempt to charge the nib with more ink giving an increased writing length between dipping.
There is a reference in the Old Testament Book of Job to an 'iron pen'.


I jsut searched net after talk with you on phone that day about history of metallic nib .
Above is the part of topic and full could be read on following adress

http://www.crazycolour.com/os/writing_09.shtml


In short history of metallic is very old but still the popular use was not done till mid of 19 century



Jatinder Singh
 
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