Unfortunately it fails to address the point that the most greenest lifestyle is that of the hunter gatherer. Farming has caused untold damage to our environment!!
Fools Who Wrangle Over Flesh
- Thread starter Randip Singh
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Unfortunately it fails to address the point that the most greenest lifestyle is that of the hunter gatherer. Farming has caused untold damage to our environment!!
- Jul 11, 2012
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Har Har Har be praised
I'm sorry I'm coming rather late to this discussion. In His/Her mercy, Har has allowed humans the constitution which may, in times of need, extract nutrients from a broad range of sources, rather like a goat. But it should be clear that, at least for spiritual people, our natural diet is a vegetarian one. Others have broken down the anatomical details that identify the human body as corresponding to the anatomies of other vegetarian animals, which is hard to dispute. But let us also use our sense:
Observe a predator animal when it sees movement. Most of us will have seen a cat stalking a bird in the grass, or else seen nature programs showing a lion pursuing its prey in the savannahs. When a predator detects the movement of an animal it regards as food, it becomes very tense, nervous, begins twitching and salivating, and makes ready to pounce and kill. This is the way of low predator beasts.
I have not yet seen a man or woman who, upon encountering a cow or chicken, becomes highly agitated and begin to salivate. Of course not, because this is not really food for us. Our food is a ripe mango, a watermelon, these will make us salivate, if we are genuinely hungry. Because these are food for us. A tiger will have no use for these.
It is really a testimony to our waywardness as a species that so much of what we see in the marketplace (especially Chinese or African markets!), is things that ran, creeped, swam or jumped; specifically the things humans ought have no business eating. These are foods to low beasts; our foods hang from trees and vines. But we are a lawless and ungovernable race, given over to low impulses too often, as the state of our world will readily testify.
So, as creatures of free will, yes we are at liberty to eat either high foods of spiritual, peace-loving souls, or else low foods, which perpetuate suffering and disease. But as a holy people, let us choose the high way.
May the Naam of Waheguru continue to be praised.
I'm sorry I'm coming rather late to this discussion. In His/Her mercy, Har has allowed humans the constitution which may, in times of need, extract nutrients from a broad range of sources, rather like a goat. But it should be clear that, at least for spiritual people, our natural diet is a vegetarian one. Others have broken down the anatomical details that identify the human body as corresponding to the anatomies of other vegetarian animals, which is hard to dispute. But let us also use our sense:
Observe a predator animal when it sees movement. Most of us will have seen a cat stalking a bird in the grass, or else seen nature programs showing a lion pursuing its prey in the savannahs. When a predator detects the movement of an animal it regards as food, it becomes very tense, nervous, begins twitching and salivating, and makes ready to pounce and kill. This is the way of low predator beasts.
I have not yet seen a man or woman who, upon encountering a cow or chicken, becomes highly agitated and begin to salivate. Of course not, because this is not really food for us. Our food is a ripe mango, a watermelon, these will make us salivate, if we are genuinely hungry. Because these are food for us. A tiger will have no use for these.
It is really a testimony to our waywardness as a species that so much of what we see in the marketplace (especially Chinese or African markets!), is things that ran, creeped, swam or jumped; specifically the things humans ought have no business eating. These are foods to low beasts; our foods hang from trees and vines. But we are a lawless and ungovernable race, given over to low impulses too often, as the state of our world will readily testify.
So, as creatures of free will, yes we are at liberty to eat either high foods of spiritual, peace-loving souls, or else low foods, which perpetuate suffering and disease. But as a holy people, let us choose the high way.
May the Naam of Waheguru continue to be praised.
- Aug 28, 2010
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This I find the longest discussion without any conclusion.
We must accept the conclsive decision from a Quote from Gurbanee as
ਸਲੋਕ ਮਃ ੧ ॥ ਪਹਿਲਾਂ ਮਾਸਹੁ ਨਿੰਮਿਆ ਮਾਸੈ ਅੰਦਰਿ ਵਾਸੁ ॥ ਜੀਉ ਪਾਇ ਮਾਸੁ ਮੁਹਿ ਮਿਲਿਆ ਹਡੁ ਚੰਮੁ ਤਨੁ ਮਾਸੁ ॥ ਮਾਸਹੁ ਬਾਹਰਿ ਕਢਿਆ ਮੰਮਾ ਮਾਸੁ ਗਿਰਾਸੁ ॥ ਮੁਹੁ ਮਾਸੈ ਕਾ ਜੀਭ ਮਾਸੈ ਕੀ ਮਾਸੈ ਅੰਦਰਿ ਸਾਸੁ ॥ ਵਡਾ ਹੋਆ ਵੀਆਹਿਆ ਘਰਿ ਲੈ ਆਇਆ ਮਾਸੁ ॥ ਮਾਸਹੁ ਹੀ ਮਾਸੁ ਊਪਜੈ ਮਾਸਹੁ ਸਭੋ ਸਾਕੁ ਸਤਿਗੁਰਿ ਮਿਲਿ ਐ ਹੁਕਮੁ ਬੁਝੀਐ ਤਾਂ ਕੋ ਆਵੈ ਰਾਸਿ ॥ ਆਪਿ ਛੁਟੇ ਨਹ ਛੂਟੀਐ ਨਾਨਕ ਬਚਨਿ ਬਿਣਾਸੁ ॥੧॥ {ਪੰਨਾ 1289}
It seems to be very pertinent to understand the message of last two lines
ਸਤਿਗੁਰਿ ਮਿਲਿ ਐ ਹੁਕਮੁ ਬੁਝੀਐ ਤਾਂ ਕੋ ਆਵੈ ਰਾਸਿ ॥ ਆਪਿ ਛੁਟੇ ਨਹ ਛੂਟੀਐ ਨਾਨਕ ਬਚਨਿ ਬਿਣਾਸੁ ॥੧॥ {ਪੰਨਾ 1289}
and in response to this context we come to know next that ---- those are foolish who
discuss on flesh..flesh..
So this is a topic which is ever going to be inconclusive .In fact Guru ji is telling us
not to discuss such an issue.
This is my personal understanding .
Prakash.s.Bagga
We must accept the conclsive decision from a Quote from Gurbanee as
ਸਲੋਕ ਮਃ ੧ ॥ ਪਹਿਲਾਂ ਮਾਸਹੁ ਨਿੰਮਿਆ ਮਾਸੈ ਅੰਦਰਿ ਵਾਸੁ ॥ ਜੀਉ ਪਾਇ ਮਾਸੁ ਮੁਹਿ ਮਿਲਿਆ ਹਡੁ ਚੰਮੁ ਤਨੁ ਮਾਸੁ ॥ ਮਾਸਹੁ ਬਾਹਰਿ ਕਢਿਆ ਮੰਮਾ ਮਾਸੁ ਗਿਰਾਸੁ ॥ ਮੁਹੁ ਮਾਸੈ ਕਾ ਜੀਭ ਮਾਸੈ ਕੀ ਮਾਸੈ ਅੰਦਰਿ ਸਾਸੁ ॥ ਵਡਾ ਹੋਆ ਵੀਆਹਿਆ ਘਰਿ ਲੈ ਆਇਆ ਮਾਸੁ ॥ ਮਾਸਹੁ ਹੀ ਮਾਸੁ ਊਪਜੈ ਮਾਸਹੁ ਸਭੋ ਸਾਕੁ ਸਤਿਗੁਰਿ ਮਿਲਿ ਐ ਹੁਕਮੁ ਬੁਝੀਐ ਤਾਂ ਕੋ ਆਵੈ ਰਾਸਿ ॥ ਆਪਿ ਛੁਟੇ ਨਹ ਛੂਟੀਐ ਨਾਨਕ ਬਚਨਿ ਬਿਣਾਸੁ ॥੧॥ {ਪੰਨਾ 1289}
It seems to be very pertinent to understand the message of last two lines
ਸਤਿਗੁਰਿ ਮਿਲਿ ਐ ਹੁਕਮੁ ਬੁਝੀਐ ਤਾਂ ਕੋ ਆਵੈ ਰਾਸਿ ॥ ਆਪਿ ਛੁਟੇ ਨਹ ਛੂਟੀਐ ਨਾਨਕ ਬਚਨਿ ਬਿਣਾਸੁ ॥੧॥ {ਪੰਨਾ 1289}
and in response to this context we come to know next that ---- those are foolish who
discuss on flesh..flesh..
So this is a topic which is ever going to be inconclusive .In fact Guru ji is telling us
not to discuss such an issue.
This is my personal understanding .
Prakash.s.Bagga
Respected parkash Singh bagga Ji..
You a re absolutely Correct.
However a SIKH is duty bound to set matters right when he/she sees it wrong...
Thats About ALL we are doing here. The Pro Vege Lobby always INSIST they are telling us Guru jis commands when thats a LIE.a BRAZEN white faced LIE......so we have to set that right by saying GURU JI SAYS NO SUCH THING...if we dont do that..the LIE like declared by goebells may become "TRUTH" because no CHALLENGE MOUNTED. BTW Goebells was Hitlers Propoganda Minister who believed that if a LIE is told a THOUSAND TIMES..most begin to beleive in it as ""truth"... LIE must alwys be Challenged.:swordfight-kudiyan:
You a re absolutely Correct.
However a SIKH is duty bound to set matters right when he/she sees it wrong...
Thats About ALL we are doing here. The Pro Vege Lobby always INSIST they are telling us Guru jis commands when thats a LIE.a BRAZEN white faced LIE......so we have to set that right by saying GURU JI SAYS NO SUCH THING...if we dont do that..the LIE like declared by goebells may become "TRUTH" because no CHALLENGE MOUNTED. BTW Goebells was Hitlers Propoganda Minister who believed that if a LIE is told a THOUSAND TIMES..most begin to beleive in it as ""truth"... LIE must alwys be Challenged.:swordfight-kudiyan:
- Aug 28, 2010
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Maan Yog Giyani Jarnail Singh ji,
I fully appreciate your stand but my concern is only the discission of this topic in context of Gurbanee.I know people are more curious about this issue from our Gurbanee which can be answered as a quote given in Gurbanee.
I think the messages from Gurbanee for INTOXICATED THINGS and DRINKS are more clear directions for Sikhs rather than issue of being veg or non veg.
.This we all shun to accept and take a pledge to follow.
With regards
Prakash.S.Bagga
This problem is moe serious in dimensions
I fully appreciate your stand but my concern is only the discission of this topic in context of Gurbanee.I know people are more curious about this issue from our Gurbanee which can be answered as a quote given in Gurbanee.
I think the messages from Gurbanee for INTOXICATED THINGS and DRINKS are more clear directions for Sikhs rather than issue of being veg or non veg.
.This we all shun to accept and take a pledge to follow.
With regards
Prakash.S.Bagga
This problem is moe serious in dimensions
well said. hypocrisy can vanish with introspection. A sikh who trims is a patit. How about a sikh who is not honest minimum at finances. Is he not Patit? In improving ourselves, let Gurbani be the reference but let us also appreciate the good things told even before Sikhism evolved. ( May 11,2013)
prakash s. bagga ji
Your very directed and pointed references to Gurbani are needed in this thread from time to time. That is where the thread began and sometimes that focus is lost. "Fools who wrangle over meat..." and other matters is directly taken from Guru Nanak whose meaning appears to be the discussion itself can be a distraction from more important matters of life and the soul.
From your conversation with Gyani ji, we can see how the interpretation of the shabad has at least 2 positive results. It helps us to introspect on values we need to thrive morally and spiritually. The Shabad along with the introspection helps us to turn the shabad into a beacon and guide for living a moral and spiritual life.
The two of you help this thread along at a point where it was needed.
Your very directed and pointed references to Gurbani are needed in this thread from time to time. That is where the thread began and sometimes that focus is lost. "Fools who wrangle over meat..." and other matters is directly taken from Guru Nanak whose meaning appears to be the discussion itself can be a distraction from more important matters of life and the soul.
From your conversation with Gyani ji, we can see how the interpretation of the shabad has at least 2 positive results. It helps us to introspect on values we need to thrive morally and spiritually. The Shabad along with the introspection helps us to turn the shabad into a beacon and guide for living a moral and spiritual life.
The two of you help this thread along at a point where it was needed.
Prakash Singh ji,
Guru Fateh.
I beg to differ with your following claim:
In fact Guru ji is telling us to discuss this subject or any other subject openly but by always putting it into contextual perspective.
The partial Gurbani verses you have quoted above from the Shabad do not do justice to the idea Guru Nanak is expressing. It is unfair on our part to throw one liner or two to prove our point when the context lies in the whole Shabad. But let's not wrangle over it.
Regards
Tejwant Singh
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Fish n Chips or a chalice of Burgundy?
The carbohydrate content from chips is a good and fast fuel source after a strenuous workout - a small portion though !
itsmaneet
SPNer
I got a chance to hear the vyakhya of Krishn Avtar from Dasam Grath in which Dasam Pitaji very openly disclosed certain facts. Guru never hid what Krishn did like ate sort of drugs...alchohols...etc but Guruji appreciated one thing giving more stress on it ... that was that Krishan was a core Nitnemi ... no matter what he did he never gave up Amritvela & every second use to remain merge in God. So my point is that as the old saying goes 'an elephant have different teeth to show & to eat' ... we humans have two lives one is to do karam being in this birth chakar (cycle) & second which is the most important is to remain merge in Almighty. People who are merged in Almighty are the blessed ones.
Another fact is eating meat has nothin to do with God coz if it was so there are pleces on the earth where people are more dependent on animals & plantation harly exists so in tht case they can never get Almighty which in somewhat not digestable.
So eating meat or avoiding it solely depends on one's health may be...for example I tried eating meat/eggs few times but it upsets my mind & digestion. But for others it may benefit. So I feel previous times & even now core Nitnemis take thorough care of what they eat so that it so not disturb their health & hence causing intruption in Nitnem...
Please let me have your kind views on above as I might be wrong ....
Gurfateh !!
Another fact is eating meat has nothin to do with God coz if it was so there are pleces on the earth where people are more dependent on animals & plantation harly exists so in tht case they can never get Almighty which in somewhat not digestable.
So eating meat or avoiding it solely depends on one's health may be...for example I tried eating meat/eggs few times but it upsets my mind & digestion. But for others it may benefit. So I feel previous times & even now core Nitnemis take thorough care of what they eat so that it so not disturb their health & hence causing intruption in Nitnem...
Please let me have your kind views on above as I might be wrong ....
Gurfateh !!
Of course Ji...
Didnt bahgat kabir ji declare..Why shave the head when you have failed to shave the MIND ??..Mann moondiah nahi ??
A Dishonest Sikh, a Corrupt Sikh, A murder Sikh, A chor sikh, a womaniser sikh.a LIAR sikh, a deceiver Sikh, a LAZY SIKH...are ALL PATITS..and much WORSE than the KESH REMOVER !! The KESH REMOVER can STOP being a PATIT more EASILY than the other patits...and GURBANi says so...Its infinetly MORE EASIER to "keep sikhi" OUTSIDE (just dont use scissors/visit the naii)..BUT the REAL SIKHI INSIDE...is almost IMPOSSIBLE..a 24/7 hour job..!! Even while SLEEPING a dream can shatter this INSIDE SIKHI...
YET Many HUNDRED THOUSAND will proudly claim that they are "SIKHS INSIDE "....I find that difficult to swallow... Another couple of HUNDRED THOUSAND fit into the SECOND category.." NO SIKHI INSIDE"...but long flowing beards, huge cholas, 3 ft kirpans and rounder turbans..OUTSIDE like "Sajjan THUGGHS Oojal keha chilkanna !!! HOLLOW DRUMS..just for making NOISE...no substance inside.
2. As for the Good things said before Sikhi came along..thats exactly WHY Guru nanak ji chose Kabir Jis bnai, Ravidass jis Bani, Namdev, etc etc etc..even Sheikh farid who was long before Guru ji....so the SGGS is complete... SAMPOORAN
arshdeep88
SPNer
- Mar 13, 2013
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i asked about this forum from spnadmin sister few days back and that's how i came about to this forum.The main thing to give this forum a read was because few days back someone posted a picture of two amrithdari sikhs cutting down chickens to eat.To my amazement i found so many abuses in the comments for the amritdhari sikhs.All got an excuse to lay down the frustation of their day to day lifes on poor amritdhari guys.People ranging from having profile named "Bhuka Jatt " to "Singh Khalsa" came and commented with words "shame on them "
while someother chose abusive words.To my amazement those who dont know the abc of sikhism started fighting with anyone who chose to defend the amritdhari guys.The whole idea of judging others is really absurd.if instead of we can jugde ourselves rather than others the whole world could be a beatiful place.If people who were abusing and taking up fights and sending life threatening messages could judge their actions that do there abuses and life threatening messages are need of the time then it would have served them better instead of such things.The whole idea of judging others is really abusrd till you are perfect yourself and it was a shame that people were really fighting over this issue to which i found the title of this forum really appropriate
while someother chose abusive words.To my amazement those who dont know the abc of sikhism started fighting with anyone who chose to defend the amritdhari guys.The whole idea of judging others is really absurd.if instead of we can jugde ourselves rather than others the whole world could be a beatiful place.If people who were abusing and taking up fights and sending life threatening messages could judge their actions that do there abuses and life threatening messages are need of the time then it would have served them better instead of such things.The whole idea of judging others is really abusrd till you are perfect yourself and it was a shame that people were really fighting over this issue to which i found the title of this forum really appropriate
arshdeep88 ji
This thread is one of our older threads going back a long way in SPN history. One really does need to read from the beginning to get the most from the discussion. The thread is also the most popular. Seeing how abusive posters can be is a let-down as you have pointed out. Tarring amritdhari Sikhs whether they deserve it or not is demoralizing. I do sincerely hope that the language threatening other members, and similar abuses, tapered off some time back.
When the world-wide web took off, it was an Internet trend to use forums to work out personal frustrations in an uncontrolled way through extreme language. The theory used to be that Internet users would police one another and themselves.
Heavy moderation will chase abusers away from a forum. Light moderation chases responsible members away because they tire of the craziness. There are those who are willing to spend free time for the Internet in a gladiator's arena. My own untested theory is that more women participate when a forum supports debate and not warfare; they are not the same thing.
The goal of debate is to learn. Your words need to be heeded if we are to learn from debate. On any of these threads the point is not to win but to learn.
This thread is one of our older threads going back a long way in SPN history. One really does need to read from the beginning to get the most from the discussion. The thread is also the most popular. Seeing how abusive posters can be is a let-down as you have pointed out. Tarring amritdhari Sikhs whether they deserve it or not is demoralizing. I do sincerely hope that the language threatening other members, and similar abuses, tapered off some time back.
When the world-wide web took off, it was an Internet trend to use forums to work out personal frustrations in an uncontrolled way through extreme language. The theory used to be that Internet users would police one another and themselves.
Heavy moderation will chase abusers away from a forum. Light moderation chases responsible members away because they tire of the craziness. There are those who are willing to spend free time for the Internet in a gladiator's arena. My own untested theory is that more women participate when a forum supports debate and not warfare; they are not the same thing.
The goal of debate is to learn. Your words need to be heeded if we are to learn from debate. On any of these threads the point is not to win but to learn.
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arshdeep88
SPNer
- Mar 13, 2013
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well the picture i am talking about was posted on facebook in some community not here ,just out of curiosity i started reading comments so as i could learn ,as the one who posted picture had posted it with big caption saying "vekho gursikhan di kartoot" .
For me watching people fight and throwing tantrums and coming up with abusive languages came as a blessing in disguise as then i came forward to this forum and watched few videos too in relation to this context and to the subject
indeed its a really long thread and i did read.
whether eating meat is right or wrong i cant comment as people who said its wrong talked of daya and compassion but at the same time couldn't explain about the killing of pests and insects required to cultivate a particular growth.
what about if they are put up on a bed for one night in an area full of mosquitoes ?
will they be so much tolerant to allow the mosquitoes to feed on their blood or will they just kill those mosquitoes?
we walk daily to our offices and for household work and nobody knows how many insects are executed by our just walking beneath our shoes and cars.
An oax is struck most of the time to carry a load of fruits and vegetables from village to city doesnt the oax feels the pain then ?
what more if the oax would have had mind like us he might be thinking its better to die than to live such with so much of thrashing daily.
If eating meat is sin according to some peoples own perception that he should give a thought that then whole world is sinful including him too.
recently i read an article stating that plants also feel pain and how they performed scientific experiments to prove this
thought provoking for people who love eating saag (aur banao kut kut ke saag)
but ONE thing is sure according to guru nanak dev ji
"Maas Maas Kar Moorakh Jhaghrrey.
Gian dhian Nahin Jaaney.
Kaun Maas Kaun Saag Kahaavey
Kis Mah Paap Samaaney" which i myself witnessed many times
i dont find this shabad either encouraging or discouraging people from eating flesh ,but it is rather a direct comment on those people who dont know anything about spirituality and make up their own rules just as pandits and bharamins use to do earlier time at the time of Guru Nanak.Those people were good in religious studies only but spiritually they were blind and they would at that time just direct people blindly to perform certain rituals without even explaining the reason behined it as most of them themselves didnt knew .It was just used as a tool by bharamins to create a class so that they could rule over people by claiming them to be true knowledgeable of religion and god.Kings too use to come to these bharamins to seek help and guidance ,thats how they ruled people.
Hypocricy was mainy prevaling that time hidden behined religious robes.
i find Guru Nanak ji always rubbishing and directly attacking such hyporicy by putting up such questions to so called religious scholars and showing the world how we ourselfes sometimes sleep in this darkness of hypocricy not only by just closing our eyes but by then covering our eyes with blanket.Only by self examining we can know about ourselves and no one is perfect to claim what is right and what is wrong.We all make mistakes then learn from them in the journey of our lives for the better.
Gyani ji talked about pleasures in this thread relating to food items and i think he has a valid point regarding this.Addiction to pleasures including food items be it vegetarian or non vegetarian has always been our downfall.
For me watching people fight and throwing tantrums and coming up with abusive languages came as a blessing in disguise as then i came forward to this forum and watched few videos too in relation to this context and to the subject
indeed its a really long thread and i did read.
whether eating meat is right or wrong i cant comment as people who said its wrong talked of daya and compassion but at the same time couldn't explain about the killing of pests and insects required to cultivate a particular growth.
what about if they are put up on a bed for one night in an area full of mosquitoes ?
will they be so much tolerant to allow the mosquitoes to feed on their blood or will they just kill those mosquitoes?
we walk daily to our offices and for household work and nobody knows how many insects are executed by our just walking beneath our shoes and cars.
An oax is struck most of the time to carry a load of fruits and vegetables from village to city doesnt the oax feels the pain then ?
what more if the oax would have had mind like us he might be thinking its better to die than to live such with so much of thrashing daily.
If eating meat is sin according to some peoples own perception that he should give a thought that then whole world is sinful including him too.
recently i read an article stating that plants also feel pain and how they performed scientific experiments to prove this
thought provoking for people who love eating saag (aur banao kut kut ke saag)
but ONE thing is sure according to guru nanak dev ji
"Maas Maas Kar Moorakh Jhaghrrey.
Gian dhian Nahin Jaaney.
Kaun Maas Kaun Saag Kahaavey
Kis Mah Paap Samaaney" which i myself witnessed many times
i dont find this shabad either encouraging or discouraging people from eating flesh ,but it is rather a direct comment on those people who dont know anything about spirituality and make up their own rules just as pandits and bharamins use to do earlier time at the time of Guru Nanak.Those people were good in religious studies only but spiritually they were blind and they would at that time just direct people blindly to perform certain rituals without even explaining the reason behined it as most of them themselves didnt knew .It was just used as a tool by bharamins to create a class so that they could rule over people by claiming them to be true knowledgeable of religion and god.Kings too use to come to these bharamins to seek help and guidance ,thats how they ruled people.
Hypocricy was mainy prevaling that time hidden behined religious robes.
i find Guru Nanak ji always rubbishing and directly attacking such hyporicy by putting up such questions to so called religious scholars and showing the world how we ourselfes sometimes sleep in this darkness of hypocricy not only by just closing our eyes but by then covering our eyes with blanket.Only by self examining we can know about ourselves and no one is perfect to claim what is right and what is wrong.We all make mistakes then learn from them in the journey of our lives for the better.
Gyani ji talked about pleasures in this thread relating to food items and i think he has a valid point regarding this.Addiction to pleasures including food items be it vegetarian or non vegetarian has always been our downfall.
Arshdeepji,
I do advise that you read through most of the posts on this thread as every single angle and argument does seem to be covered.
I know it's a lot of pages and takes a while to get through it, but in all honesty it was one of the threads that I learned the most from !
For me personally, it was quite an eye opener and I am sure you view will be the same as mine towards the end !
It is probably one of the reasons that I have stayed on this forum because the learning experience was the greatest on this one thread.
Bottom line, we should judge people for the actions and contributions to mankind and not for what they eat !
I do advise that you read through most of the posts on this thread as every single angle and argument does seem to be covered.
I know it's a lot of pages and takes a while to get through it, but in all honesty it was one of the threads that I learned the most from !
For me personally, it was quite an eye opener and I am sure you view will be the same as mine towards the end !
It is probably one of the reasons that I have stayed on this forum because the learning experience was the greatest on this one thread.
Bottom line, we should judge people for the actions and contributions to mankind and not for what they eat !
- Jul 11, 2012
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"The only judgement that should be given to foods is their nutritional value."
Where is the place then for mercy? Is this not perhaps also part of the judgement of saintly ones?
Are we to disregard the cries of panic and pain? I guess they're just low animals, incapable of really percieving fear and suffering. I remember that in WWII and also Vietnam, people were actively compelled not to be taken in by apparent 'human' expressions from the Asian enemies; they didn't really have the capacity to genuinely suffer, as they might appear to.
"The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by how its animals are treated" -Gandhi
Has Waheguru not been merciful to us? Time and again? Should we not also try to extend this blessing to others?
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Just this one line negates the entire post...Gandhi was the biggest FRAUD..and least interested in any animals - his mutterings on SIKHS is enough to show this. The Nehrus and the patels followed this GANDHI..and see what the SIKHS got in return...since 1947...1984...2013...the "animal" quote is out of place..Gandhis country cant even treat HUMANS properly... :happysingh: :happysingh: :interestedsingh:
Could we have a quote from SGGS please that supports GANDHI on Animals ?? Or we do beleive that the GURUS didnt give two hoots to the way animals were treated ??? Enough MERCY is demonstrated by the Love of Horses ....and eagles (hunters)..Gurus hunting LIONS ....and BHAI GHANIYAH Jis actions in battle. Did Gandhi ever keep an eagle..Did he ever kill a Lion that was terrorizing the villagers...did Gandhi ever have a Horse to ride ?? He ONLY ahd a BAKREE whcih he kept MILKING day and night..and his followers MILK INDIA day and night ever since.:grinningsingh:
Most of this
is tongue in cheek..no apologies..no offense..no replies required....
Most of this
is tongue in cheek..no apologies..no offense..no replies required....
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