Re: Allagation of sexual abuse by S. Gurbax Singh Ji Kala Afghana Ji.
I think I may have read this. Get the source. You are however missing my point. Whether he feinted or didn't is irrelevant. We are arguing about an irrelevant point.
if it's irrelevant, why do KA and that ghaggha fellow make such a big issue over it? could it be because they KNOW it will make many sikhs feel uncomfortable? could it be because they're trying to sow dissension in the panth?
I do not believe in miracles, and the Guru's own conduct confirms this. They did not perform miracles and did not ascribe to them.
have you read the speeches of Sant Bhindranwale? you say you respect him... he tells many stories of miracles, including the beheading and reviving of the panj piyare.
There is nothing insulting in calling Guru's Human Beings. They were just that. They were not Gods, Demi-God's, Alien BEINGS. They were Human beings, albeit Human Beings with a much higher level of conscience than the average human. Their bodies felt pain, they felt love, they felt anguish. What made them different from the average human was their ability to control their human emotions.
This game of playing miracles and one upmanship is the distasteful aspect I find in other faiths. The only way they can prove how great and religious their religious figures were is by stating how many miracles their own figures made. Luckily for us Sikhism does not play such a game.
you're right, our Gurus did not "play" miracles or use them for oneupmanship. that's the whole point! Guru sahib could have done anything. but they never did anything for personal gain, only to help others.
by calling them normal human beings, do you deny the jot of Waheguru passed from one guru to the next? i've had this discussion recently, i can't remember if it was with you or not. let me know if you need supporting gurbani.
I have a problem with all organisations that cause division in Sikhism, and in particular with those (like these), that have Vashnavite leanings.
AKJ is particular is responsible for a wave of intolerance, remanicent of Wahabism, that is plagueing Sikhism at the moment.
interesting. i've found AKJ to be the MOST tolerant of all the punjabi sikhs i've met. no other group of people is more accepting of any sikh, from any caste, nationality, etc... as long as one is honestly trying to become a good Sikh and find Waheguru, they accept everyone with open arms. AKJ smagaams are the ONLY Sikh events/gurdwaras i've been to, in the US, Canada, or India, where i'm not stared at like some sort of alien invader. i've been welcomed into homes, given food, a place to sleep... all of the things Sikhs are supposed to do, but don't when they see my "gori" face.
the idea that they are intolerant or "wahabiest" is contrary to everything i have experienced. so i guess i feel it a bit personally when someone makes these insulting comments about the most devoted group of Sikhs i have ever encountered.
i wonder if you're confusing tapoban.org with the Jatha in general? there does seem to be a bit of a difference.
I normally try not to get too involved in debates outside Bani and Bani interpretation, however, I find witch hunts of individuals such as KA by organisation such as AKJ, newspapers like Panthic Weekly (should be renamed Pathetic Weekly) etc distasteful. Even more than KA, these organisations and institutions, by their autocratic actions are undermining the Sikhism.
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KA has INVITED this criticism by questioning some of the foundations of our faith. he questions Guru. sikhs are supposed to learn, to question, but not question Guru! sikh isn't only a student, it's a student OF GURU. i know you know this. when the student questions his master, perhaps it's time to find a new master or go off on one's own. rather than drag down all the other students with him.
i don't see the "autocratic" actions of AKJ. they accept Sikhs of any caste, sect, colour, etc. they accept Akal Takht as the temporal authority of Sikhs, as created by Guru Hargobind Sahib. they don't tell the panth to follow their stricter rehet, they do that on their own. they may invite others to join them, but they don't enforce it.
AK and his ilk, on the other hand, flaunt their distain for Akal Takht. who is dividing the panth? i think the answer is clear.
I believe in giving people a fair chance, and demonising them and posting cases of sexual allegations are not the ways to do it. Lets debate the issue, not the person. It is not secret that Bhai Randhir Singh's fanatical followers have an axe to grind against KA. I think they will stoop to any lengths to try and discredit him, rather than challenge his beliefs. I have not seen anyone actually debate what this fellow wrote. The same happened with that Professor Ghaggha fellow.
it's not only "
Bhai Randhir Singh's fanatical followers", it's the majority of the panth. most sikhs i know in person don't even know who KA is, but when they read his positions... they're just as against him as any jatha or group.
i've seen multiple videos of debates, i've even posted a few. i'm sure you can find some.
of course, the fact that KA is banned from most gurdwaras in north america and is declared tankhaiya makes it difficult to debate him.
btw, in your effort to debate the issues, not the people, ********************
