• Welcome to all New Sikh Philosophy Network Forums!
    Explore Sikh Sikhi Sikhism...
    Sign up Log in

Amrit Vela / Early Rising - What Does Gurbani Say?

Harry Haller

Panga Master
SPNer
Jan 31, 2011
5,769
8,194
55
Amrit means something after having which you dont die.

well, at least your honest! so its like a magic potion!

With all due respect i must say ,I dont agree with translation that you have provided. Where does the humanity come in from? Lets try n make our lives meaningful for us First. A more appropriate translation according to me would be "I am a sacrifice to the time when i meditate on the Lords name Within" .
can translations be rejected because you do not agree with them? does such a term as 'appropriate translation' actually exists, surely something is correctly translated or not.

I Offer my mind, body and wealth in other words everything to one who can make me meet the Lord.
Now this is interesting, few years back i posted a post somewhere and it had the content that we need external help from someone who has already walked that path so that we can be lead to the lord. Some guys made a mockery of it and said why do we need an intermediator to meet the lord? Now the above tuk clarifies and bolsters that point. Now, only guru sahib needed someone who could make them meet the lord? Obviously we also do.

and thats the reason Punjab is overflowing with deras.

Coming back to the subject Offering everything to the one who can lead to the lord means to start living in the will of the one who can lead you to the lord, obviously they don't need your wealth or body and how can one offer their mann to someone? That's done by living in their will. And this is not my point of view, this is guru sahibans.

and thats the reason Punjab is overflowing with deras.

Oh yes buddy outer jot has no significance at all and to have that light within we need to go within and to go within we need to meet someone who has already went within.

and thats the reason Punjab is overflowing with deras............
 

japjisahib04

Mentor
SPNer
Jan 22, 2005
822
1,294
kuwait
I think S. Tejwant Singh been kind to clarify difference between gurmat amrit vyla and morning time, otherwise guru sahib would not have said, 'ਕੁਰਬਾਣੁ ਜਾਈ ਉਸੁ ਵੇਲਾ ਸੁਹਾਵੀ ਜਿਤੁ ਤੁਮਰੈ ਦੁਆਰੈ ਆਇਆ ॥ or ਧੰਨੁ ਸੁ ਵੇਲਾ ਜਿਤੁ ਮੈ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੁ ਮਿਲਿਆ ਸੋ ਸਹੁ ਚਿਤਿ ਆਇਆ ॥.

In order to know what is 'ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਵੇਲਾ', let us go back to the source and in which context it is written:

ਸਾਚਾ ਸਾਹਿਬੁ ਸਾਚੁ ਨਾਇ ਭਾਖਿਆ ਭਾਉ ਅਪਾਰੁ ॥ True God is filled with inifinite love, This is the yardstick and concept of God

ਆਖਹਿ ਮੰਗਹਿ ਦੇਹਿ ਦੇਹਿ ਦਾਤਿ ਕਰੇ ਦਾਤਾਰੁ ॥ whosoever wish to be truthful, he cleans his vessel and attains the divine wisdom

ਫੇਰਿ ਕਿ ਅਗੈ ਰਖੀਐ ਜਿਤੁ ਦਿਸੈ ਦਰਬਾਰੁ ॥ In order to be truthful, for that he shift and tenders his thought process towards satguru (mind you over the word is 'ਫੇਰਿ ਕਿ' - shift your paradigm and not 'ਫਿਰਿ ਕੀ' what to place) or do we have anything of our to place before him.

ਮੁਹੌ ਕਿ ਬੋਲਣੁ ਬੋਲੀਐ ਜਿਤੁ ਸੁਣਿ ਧਰੇ ਪਿਆਰੁ ॥ It is not related with outer mouth like parroting but mental body's mouth. Just like 'ਮਨ ਕਰਿ ਕਬਹੂ ਨ ਹਰਿ ਗੁਨ ਗਾਇਓ ॥ it is the manh which sings, burning desire to speak sweet truthful language to evoke His love otherwise ' ਟੂਟਿ ਪਰੀਤਿ ਗਈ ਬੁਰ ਬੋਲਿ ॥ '

ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਵੇਲਾ ਸਚੁ ਨਾਉ ਵਡਿਆਈ ਵੀਚਾਰੁ ॥
To be sweet and speak truth, does it require any special timing? Guru sahib is telling if you live as per voice of truth, your whole life will be sweet and sehj. No more spiritual death.

ਕਰਮੀ ਆਵੈ ਕਪੜਾ ਨਦਰੀ ਮੋਖੁ ਦੁਆਰੁ ॥ with this you attain robe of satguru dee matt. Gurmat way is 'nanak nadree payeea - only by exploring the treasure we can be one with gurbani and not parroting, thus 'nadree' over here is the essence - tat gian. With tat gian we can achieve state of oneness.There is no SOS type grace in gurmat.

ਨਾਨਕ ਏਵੈ ਜਾਣੀਐ ਸਭੁ ਆਪੇ ਸਚਿਆਰੁ ॥੪॥ If we understand that it is only by, 'hukam rajayee chalna, then our life will be meaningful and truth.

Gurmat strictly forbids intermediatary and whereever the word sant, santo, sant sang, it is all related to virtues only.
I cite one example 'ਕਹਤੁ ਕਬੀਰੁ ਸੁਨਹੁ ਰੇ ਸੰਤਹੁ ਸਾਧਸੰਗਤਿ ਤਰਿ ਜਾਂਹਿਗਾ ॥੩॥੧॥ Over here word santo and saadh sanghat is also there. Do 'sant' also need the saadhsanghat' to cross over, that mean what type of this sant is who require another saadhsanghat.
 
Last edited:
Jan 18, 2011
39
19
37
well, at least your honest! so its like a magic potion!
And you thought its only something sweet? Now don't start searching this magic potion somewhere outside, it can be found within. Oh first let me guess are you even searching?

can translations be rejected because you do not agree with them? does such a term as 'appropriate translation' actually exists, surely something is correctly translated or not.

Yes, whatever is wrongly translated should be rejected upfront.

and thats the reason Punjab is overflowing with deras.

Oh yes!!! my friend Punjab is overflowing with deras like it was during the time of ninth Guru when so many fake gurus were saying that they were the true Gurus, but it doesn't mean the True one was not there. Can you imagine the fake ones were there that time too. But the true seeker will always find the true one just like Makhan shah lubana did that time, instead the true one manifests himself to the true seeker.
And the true one can manifest himself anywhere, not only in punjab i wonder why the deras and punjab came to your mind when talking of the true one.

Lets Widen our Horizons!!!! And follow the true teaching of the Guru sahiban.
 

Harry Haller

Panga Master
SPNer
Jan 31, 2011
5,769
8,194
55
And you thought its only something sweet? Now don't start searching this magic potion somewhere outside, it can be found within. Oh first let me guess are you even searching?

agreed!

Yes, whatever is wrongly translated should be rejected upfront.

ahhh ok, you don't mean appropriate, you mean correct!

Oh yes!!! my friend Punjab is overflowing with deras like it was during the time of ninth Guru when so many fake gurus were saying that they were the true Gurus, but it doesn't mean the True one was not there. Can you imagine the fake ones were there that time too. But the true seeker will always find the true one just like Makhan shah lubana did that time, instead the true one manifests himself to the true seeker.
And the true one can manifest himself anywhere, not only in punjab i wonder why the deras and punjab came to your mind when talking of the true one.

Lets Widen our Horizons!!!! And follow the true teaching of the Guru sahiban.

Personally, I think we can do that on our own,
 

japjisahib04

Mentor
SPNer
Jan 22, 2005
822
1,294
kuwait
With all due respect i must say ,I don't agree with translation that you have provided. Where does the humanity come in from? Lets try n make our lives meaningful for us First. A more appropriate translation according to me would be "I am a sacrifice to the time when i meditate on the Lords name Within" .
Strange! Do we have to meditate on Lords name within? The purpose is to make our life meaningful for others.
 

Original

Writer
SPNer
Jan 9, 2011
1,053
553
67
London UK
Dear All

It's a fundamental human value to respect others no matter how immature and ignobly one is dispositioned. Giving others their respect n dignity protects our very own integrity and honour. Showing respect to others and allowing them to vent their views is to believe in their pontential to grow and develop fruitfully as social beings albeit with alien ideologies. Whether I'm a theologian, secularist or a pragmatist doesn't mean I've the right to take the michael when the subject matter is of a "personal" way inclined.

Nanak's Sikhi can be lived with a variety of attitudes. For example, the contemplative, the dynamic, the ordinary and the extra-ordinary all can be made to measure and construct their own lifestyles. This type of liberalism would train people for living in a democratic society, and it would strengthen the development of this type of social and political organisation. A democratic society is one that is better able to confront new situations, and try new situations, since it does not have any rigid but flexible ideology. It is essentially a system of social organisation that is open to exploration of new means for meeting difficulties. It is designed to evolve, to meet change and to adopt to new developments. The disciplined Sikh is not only nurtured but trained in problem-solving with which he/she is able to be an active social being of such social organisation, utilising his/ her techniques for dealing with situations galore. Preferred methodology would be cooperation over conflict where n when possible with the larger segment of society in its common search for harmonious well being of all of its members.

Moving on to the real deal this morning brings me to the point of Amrit Vela. A lot can be said but best not to [vast subject], early morning engagement with anything is on the common a rewarding enterprise. To talk about Gurbani and to understand its value n wisdom it is important to know something about its authors, that is, their personal, social, religious, economic, etc. outlooks and dispositions in general. It provides us with a healthy toolkit to reconstruct the past.

I've said in the past that Nanak was more of a social than a religious reformer. His contempt of the social organisation and the calamities of religious belief is well documented on page 722 of SGGSJ. But since having that divine intervention at Sultanpur Lodhi, he went out to proclaim the word of God and lead humankind in that direction.

His mode of expression of his new find was very important. He chose poetry over literature, but that too had to be contemporairarly approved in terms of convention. His idea of mool mantar followed by 38 stanzas was very carefully thought through. In the mool mantar he portrays God with its characteristics and in the body below, a series of questions and answers intended to bring out the relationship of humankind in its social, religious, personal and metaphysical world. It's prescriptive as well as poetic in both emotional and doctrinal meaning of the word Sikh.

To capture Nanak's mood n influence re AV, let's go directly at the heart of the preceding question !

Question:
What then, we humans could offer to get a glimpse of Almighty's court ? What words could we utter that would move Almighty to love us ? [phir ka aga rakhee'ai jit dis'ay darbaar.....].

Here Guru Nanak metaphorically relies on the current socio-religious workings of the ordinary citizen attending mandirs, mosques, temples, etc to militate his point to the alternative, that is, Amrit Vela.

Answer:
In the ambrosial hours of early dawn, meditate on the true name and reflect on his greatness [amrit vela sach naa'o vadiaa'ee veechar].

Baba Nanak Ji explains, we can only offer something which we ourselves possess, and, that is our ego, for everything else belongs to God. This means relinquishing one's will and accepting God's, to be able to see and love him. True praise of God is to set aside time, preferably in the early hours of the morning to meditate just like you would for a social event or personal preoccupation. Why early morning ? Common sense coupled with evolutionary workings favoured AV over other times because the morning after a night's sleep the body is fully relaxed and fresh. And, since the objective of this exercise is to be in total n complete isolation from the hustle bustle of the noisy dictates of the wakeful life and to anchor the wandering mind in one sitting it's not rocket science to work out way Nanak and the gang chose 3 am over 3 pm. This for the then society was a way to an unconditional relationship of love n devotion founded very much on practical rather than metaphysical terms. Guru Arjun On page 1099 suggests, "at dawn meditate n contemplate rewards are too good" [parbhaate prabh nam jap...].

From a personal view point, I've always been an AM [watch it H] guy. Everyday, I'm up without fail because it has been "conditioned" [read up pavlov] within the human me. In my case it was never religious but more physical. Attending to agricultural duties back at home, we were in the fields by 4 the very latest and 3 the earliest. Social conditions favoured early bed early rise to avoid roasting n toasting out in the fields had it been left any late. So from that perspective, some of us are conditioned as opposed to making a choice.

The results for me personally have been phenomnial in the sense, after a good physical work out in the early hours of the morning due to the body's endorphin release mechanism, I'm on a high already before sitting to rake the mind on to home turf for gur shabd connection. And, for me it doesn't always bear fruit, but I get a good start to the day together with my moral compass aligned to reflect the good Sikh values are practised daily.

It wasn't until late in life when I was able to migrate from a mere physical activity to spiritual contemplation. And, like all arts n crafts it takes time to master. That is not to say, those who don't meditate are any less of the well-to-citizens of the state, far from it, I come across loads of people who hasn't the faintest and yet they are equally if not more jolly and prosperous in all aspects of "life". It all depends what you want from meditation, for example, an experiment was carried out on meditating monks and the findings were truly remarkable. It was found after an EEG test that the four primary brain waves were almost completely synchronised, which otherwise in the ordinary joe bloggs appear out of synch, but in the case of these monks they aligned almost perfectly. What does that mean ? It meant that these monks were found to be living in a state of constant bliss, of happiness, of empathy for the world around them. They lived in the moment -

At the end of the day, what matters most is your personal disposition, if you're a meditator or a gladiator and happy, so be it, because the true enjoyer is the soul and in whatever capacity she finds peace, tranquility, joy, happiness n all the rest is the place for you to be. Says Nanak, "higher than truth is truthful living".

Amrit Vela nam simran is a recommendation and not a statute cast in stone.

Sorry for the condensed write up - lot more where this came from.

Good day !
 

chazSingh

Writer
SPNer
Feb 20, 2012
1,644
1,643
Chaz Ji

I only just saw this part of your post. If you can't understand my posts, then don't read them. There's no reason to be so rude.

Thank you for sharing as many early morning posts as you already have, however I am finished discussing it with you.

Thanks

Huh?

i think you've misunderstood what i wrote...i was being sarcastic...and it wasn;t aimed at you...it was aimed at GOD lol :)

in your interpretation of the shabad, you stated that you think the shabad was portarying the uselessness of early morning Amrit Vela...

and i was saying why on Gods good earth would he describe the early morning risers as the 'PERFECT KINGS" if what they were doing was useless...

IT MAKES NO SENSE WHATSOEVER?

so in a sarcastic way i was saying to GOD....".you are confusing us and we are wasting precious time wondering what you are saying.."

of course what i really meant was...GOD DOESN'T confuse us...he is describing them as PERFECT KINGS...because it is through their practice of starting the day with Amrit Vela Simran that they are able to tackle their 5 thieves, and wondering mind and remeber god 24/7 in all their actions and deeds and thoughts...

but it;s ok...somehow you interpreted my reply as being an attack on you or something like that..

appologies for the capital letters and bold comments...but i felt i needed to so that there is no confusion with my reply.

God Bless...
 

chazSingh

Writer
SPNer
Feb 20, 2012
1,644
1,643
Chaz ji,

Guru Fateh.

As you are a passionate lover of Simran, have you heard about a group called Dodra?

They are all around the world. If you have not, you should check them out. You will love their Simran gatherings.

i am indeed a passionate lover of Simran...

i get my proof of Gods Existence from God alone...no need for gathering with certain groups...which believe me...is the only proof i need :)

So tejwant ji...god bless you on your journey to Waheguru. i wish you all the best on that journey.

i like many others...being inspired by a new generation of truth seekers, we will continue to bath in the light during AMrit Vela and serving humanity during the day as best we can whilst fighting to conquer our 5 thieves...and this also includes daytime contemplation/mediation...thus making the 24/7 Waheguru Contemplation closer to reality as possible..

There is no need to reply to my message...i'm sure anything you need to know...any direction you need to take can be taken from your Guru.

All the best Ji.
 
Last edited:

chazSingh

Writer
SPNer
Feb 20, 2012
1,644
1,643
Guru Fateh to all.

I think the Pro Amritvela group has misunderstood what the other side of the fence is trying to convey. I would like to add something to it rather than having a sabre match with bamboo sticks.

I understand you think that Amritvela is early in the morning and I respect your stance although I do not agree with that. But as far as getting up in the early morning is concerned, no one is disputing about that, when the birds begin to chirp, the dew drops are sitting on the petals, like the pearls in the open oysters before the first rays of the Sun gulp them all up at once while they are still rippling with life.

It is the moment of contemplation when the ex- marathoners and now the power walkers like me start their stroll at 3:30am while listening to Kirtan for two some hours. The beads of sweat seem like dew drops on the petals of life.The moments are like having a board meeting with the self for what lies ahead and how to use the Gurmat values to tackle the winding roads of life. These moments are full of serenity while one can feel one's own breath exhaling to be free.

The dispute here is that for many of us Amritvela is anytime of the day with or sans dew drops. So, it is futile to become the gladiators in the open arena where the only spectators are ourselves waiting for the lions to devour us when they are let loose. Let's not let that happen. Some people do like their morning slumber.

Do not forget to set up your morning wake up body clocks.

Tejwant Singh

I think you are also misunderstanding the pro-amrit vela point of view..

no where has anyone said it is Amrit Vela and thats it :)

24/7 living under Waheguru's guidance, 24/7 contemplation, 24/7 serving etc etc are the way forward...

but what i found myself...when i read Guru Ji's words of Contemplation with IK MAN...single pointedness...which are words used over and over by Guru Ji...

i just couldn't do it with all my heart...that single mindedness just didn't happen when i was at work...driving the car...shopping etc etc...there was too much going on...

and when i tried the early morning hours....BOOOM....i had found that place and time where i could do this...it may not be the best time for everyone...but it fell into place for me...and i know others..

that IK MAN...that single pointedness for the first time i had achieved...and i was over the moon...like a kid walking into the sweet shop...

my dreams came true...all my calls to waheguru....they were heard...that feeling of finally knowing what you've been seeking actually exists...and my mind failed in taking that precious moment away...i gained single pointedness on waheguru...and waheguru made His presence known.

that is why that time of day is special to me...it made the impossible....possible...for me

But yes of course it can be anytime during the day....i hope we;re all able to get our minds under control and use the full power of our mind to focus on His shabd and light...

From the bottom of my heart i pray we can keep progressing to the state of being of god consciousness.
 

japjisahib04

Mentor
SPNer
Jan 22, 2005
822
1,294
kuwait
In the ambrosial hours of early dawn, meditate on the true name and reflect on his greatness [amrit vela sach naa'o vadiaa'ee veechar].
I am wondering why will guru sahib contradict himself and suggest to mediate to the true name early dawn. Why will guru sahib ask us to waste our time unnecessarily in momentarily meditation, as after waking up of meditation ਜਬ ਕਛੁ ਪਾਵੈ ਤਬ ਗਰਬੁ ਕਰਤੁ ਹੈ ॥ ਮਾਇਆ ਗਈ ਤਬ ਰੋਵਨੁ ਲਗਤੁ ਹੈ ॥੧॥ But when his wealth is gone, then he cries and bewails. ||1|| Please note gurmat smadhi is 24x7 and i.e. after listening when one accepts and follow, his mind gets stablised for ever i.e. gurmat smadhi. Once manh accept satugur dee matt then as guru sahib says, 'ਅਬ ਮੋਹਿ ਨਾਚਨੋ ਨ ਆਵੈ ॥ ਮੇਰਾ ਮਨੁ ਮੰਦਰੀਆ ਨ ਬਜਾਵੈ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ it wanders no more.
[phir ka aga rakhee'ai jit dis'ay darbaar.....].
When guru sahib have already asked us to tender our thought process in first pauree of japjisahib why will guru sahib raise another question and fix time. Guru sahib is reminding us that we have shown our back to truth, shift your manh towards guru dee matt.
 

Tejwant Singh

Mentor
Writer
SPNer
Jun 30, 2004
5,024
7,183
Henderson, NV.
I think you are also misunderstanding the pro-amrit vela point of view..

no where has anyone said it is Amrit Vela and thats it :)

24/7 living under Waheguru's guidance, 24/7 contemplation, 24/7 serving etc etc are the way forward...

but what i found myself...when i read Guru Ji's words of Contemplation with IK MAN...single pointedness...which are words used over and over by Guru Ji...

i just couldn't do it with all my heart...that single mindedness just didn't happen when i was at work...driving the car...shopping etc etc...there was too much going on...

and when i tried the early morning hours....BOOOM....i had found that place and time where i could do this...it may not be the best time for everyone...but it fell into place for me...and i know others..

that IK MAN...that single pointedness for the first time i had achieved...and i was over the moon...like a kid walking into the sweet shop...

my dreams came true...all my calls to waheguru....they were heard...that feeling of finally knowing what you've been seeking actually exists...and my mind failed in taking that precious moment away...i gained single pointedness on waheguru...and waheguru made His presence known.

that is why that time of day is special to me...it made the impossible....possible...for me

But yes of course it can be anytime during the day....i hope we;re all able to get our minds under control and use the full power of our mind to focus on His shabd and light...

From the bottom of my heart i pray we can keep progressing to the state of being of god consciousness.

Chaz Singh ji,

Guru fateh.

think you are also misunderstanding the pro-amrit vela point of view..

no where has anyone said it is Amrit Vela and thats it :)

I do not want to rehash this anymore because in many many posts of yours since you joined SPN, you said Amritvela is getting up at the "Ambrosial hour" which itself is an incorrect translation.

Time to move on.

Thanks & regards

Tejwant Singh
 

Tejwant Singh

Mentor
Writer
SPNer
Jun 30, 2004
5,024
7,183
Henderson, NV.
i am indeed a passionate lover of Simran...

i get my proof of Gods Existence from God alone...no need for gathering with certain groups...which believe me...is the only proof i need :)

So tejwant ji...god bless you on your journey to Waheguru. i wish you all the best on that journey.

i like many others...being inspired by a new generation of truth seekers, we will continue to bath in the light during AMrit Vela and serving humanity during the day as best we can whilst fighting to conquer our 5 thieves...and this also includes daytime contemplation/mediation...thus making the 24/7 Waheguru Contemplation closer to reality as possible..

There is no need to reply to my message...i'm sure anything you need to know...any direction you need to take can be taken from your Guru.

All the best Ji.
Chaz Singh ji,

Guru Fateh.

It is sad to notice that you did not even bother to read my post and started defending yourself about your simran. I was trying to help you with your Simran. I apologise if that offended you. Let me repeat again:

Tejwant Singh said:
Chaz ji,

Guru Fateh.

As you are a passionate lover of Simran, have you heard about a group called Dodra?

They are all around the world. If you have not, you should check them out. You will love their Simran gatherings.

This group is in your ballpark for your Simran. I used to belong to the Dodra Group or as it is also known "Vaheguru Group" many years ago. Your response to my post seems very puzzling and has nothing to do with what I asked you.

In this group, only the normal people lead others to Simran an do Keertan. There are no Raagis. Their way of doing Simran and Keertan is mesmerizing.

You should try it.

Good luck!

Regards

Tejwant Singh
 

chazSingh

Writer
SPNer
Feb 20, 2012
1,644
1,643
Chaz Singh ji,

Guru Fateh.

It is sad to notice that you did not even bother to read my post and started defending yourself about your simran. I was trying to help you with your Simran. I apologise if that offended you. Let me repeat again:



This group is in your ballpark for your Simran. I used to belong to the Dodra Group or as it is also known "Vaheguru Group" many years ago. Your response to my post seems very puzzling and has nothing to do with what I asked you.

In this group, only the normal people lead others to Simran an do Keertan. There are no Raagis. Their way of doing Simran and Keertan is mesmerizing.

You should try it.

Good luck!

Regards

Tejwant Singh


In the past i think you have mentioned that you had a bad experience with this group...

thanks for the suggestion...but my Simran is done alone...at home. i Say 'alone' but i'm never actually 'alone' :)...my sangat is at the Gurdwara or online with like minded individuals i have met on this forum and other forums...

why change a winning formula?

Thanks again for the suggestion ji

God Bless
 

chazSingh

Writer
SPNer
Feb 20, 2012
1,644
1,643
Chaz Singh ji,

Guru fateh.



I do not want to rehash this anymore because in many many posts of yours since you joined SPN, you said Amritvela is getting up at the "Ambrosial hour" which itself is an incorrect translation.

Time to move on.

Thanks & regards

Tejwant Singh


good suggestion....time to move on...all Simran is a good thing...god bless
 

Tejwant Singh

Mentor
Writer
SPNer
Jun 30, 2004
5,024
7,183
Henderson, NV.
Chaz Singh ji,

Guru Fateh.

You write in post#72
i get my proof of Gods Existence from God alone...no need for gathering with certain groups...which believe me...is the only proof i need :)

If the above what you claim is the Sikhi way, then why do we recite the following two Shabads daily in the evening called Soh Dhar-Rehraas? I have not included the explanation by Prof. Sahib SIngh in the following because I did not get the response how good your Gurmukhi is. Hence, I just added Sant Singh Khalsa's literal translation.

BTW, the word Sangat comes 717 times in SGGS, our only Guru which contradicts your claim above. Do you claim that you know better than our Gurus or you misspoke?

The above is not a criticism in any way or form what you do but the fact of the matter is your stance above contradicts the principles of Sikhi and I am wondering why you have this stance. Would appreciate if your clarify that.

ਰਾਗੁ ਗੂਜਰੀ ਮਹਲਾ
Rāg gūjrī mėhlā 4.
Raag Goojaree, Fourth Mehl:

ਹਰਿ ਕੇ ਜਨ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਸਤਪੁਰਖਾ ਬਿਨਉ ਕਰਉ ਗੁਰ ਪਾਸਿ
Har ke jan saṯgur saṯpurkẖā bina▫o kara▫o gur pās.
O humble servant of the Lord, O True Guru, O True Primal Being: I offer my humble prayer to You, O Guru.

ਹਮ ਕੀਰੇ ਕਿਰਮ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਸਰਣਾਈ ਕਰਿ ਦਇਆ ਨਾਮੁ ਪਰਗਾਸਿ ॥੧॥
Ham kīre kiram saṯgur sarṇā▫ī kar ḏa▫i▫ā nām pargās. ||1||
I am a mere insect, a worm. O True Guru, I seek Your Sanctuary. Please be merciful, and bless me with the Light of the Naam, the Name of the Lord. ||1||

ਮੇਰੇ ਮੀਤ ਗੁਰਦੇਵ ਮੋ ਕਉ ਰਾਮ ਨਾਮੁ ਪਰਗਾਸਿ
Mere mīṯ gurḏev mo ka▫o rām nām pargās.

O my Best Friend, O Divine Guru, please enlighten me with the Name of the Lord.

ਗੁਰਮਤਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਮੇਰਾ ਪ੍ਰਾਨ ਸਖਾਈ ਹਰਿ ਕੀਰਤਿ ਹਮਰੀ ਰਹਰਾਸਿ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ
Gurmaṯ nām merā parān sakẖā▫ī har kīraṯ hamrī rahrās. ||1|| rahā▫o.
Through the Guru's Teachings, the Naam is my breath of life. The Kirtan of the Lord's Praise is my life's occupation. ||1||Pause||


ਹਰਿ ਜਨ ਕੇ ਵਡ ਭਾਗ ਵਡੇਰੇ ਜਿਨ ਹਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਸਰਧਾ ਹਰਿ ਪਿਆਸ
Har jan ke vad bẖāg vadere jin har har sarḏẖā har pi▫ās.
The servants of the Lord have the greatest good fortune; they have faith in the Lord, and a longing for the Lord.

ਹਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਮਿਲੈ ਤ੍ਰਿਪਤਾਸਹਿ ਮਿਲਿ ਸੰਗਤਿ ਗੁਣ ਪਰਗਾਸਿ ॥੨॥
Har har nām milai ṯaripṯāsahi mil sangaṯ guṇ pargās. ||2||
Obtaining the Name of the Lord, Har, Har, they are satisfied; joining the Sangat, the Blessed Congregation, their virtues shine forth. ||2||


ਜਿਨ ਹਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਰਸੁ ਨਾਮੁ ਪਾਇਆ ਤੇ ਭਾਗਹੀਣ ਜਮ ਪਾਸਿ
Jin har har har ras nām na pā▫i▫ā ṯe bẖāghīṇ jam pās.
Those who have not obtained the Sublime Essence of the Name of the Lord, Har, Har, Har, are most unfortunate; they are led away by the Messenger of Death.


ਜੋ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਸਰਣਿ ਸੰਗਤਿ ਨਹੀ ਆਏ ਧ੍ਰਿਗੁ ਜੀਵੇ ਧ੍ਰਿਗੁ ਜੀਵਾਸਿ ॥੩॥
Jo saṯgur saraṇ sangaṯ nahī ā▫e ḏẖarig jīve ḏẖarig jīvās. ||3||
Those who have not sought the Sanctuary of the True Guru and the Sangat, the Holy Congregation; cursed are their lives, and cursed are their hopes of life. ||3||


ਜਿਨ ਹਰਿ ਜਨ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਸੰਗਤਿ ਪਾਈ ਤਿਨ ਧੁਰਿ ਮਸਤਕਿ ਲਿਖਿਆ ਲਿਖਾਸਿ
Jin har jan saṯgur sangaṯ pā▫ī ṯin ḏẖur masṯak likẖi▫ā likẖās.

Those humble servants of the Lord who have attained the Company of the True Guru, have such pre-ordained destiny inscribed on their foreheads.


ਧਨੁ ਧੰਨੁ ਸਤਸੰਗਤਿ ਜਿਤੁ ਹਰਿ ਰਸੁ ਪਾਇਆ ਮਿਲਿ ਜਨ ਨਾਨਕ ਨਾਮੁ ਪਰਗਾਸਿ ॥੪॥੪॥
Ḏẖan ḏẖan saṯsangaṯ jiṯ har ras pā▫i▫ā mil jan Nānak nām pargās. ||4||4||
Blessed, blessed is the Sat Sangat, the True Congregation, where the Lord's Essence is obtained. Meeting with His humble servant, O Nanak, the Light of the Naam shines forth. ||4||4||

ਰਾਗੁ ਗੂਜਰੀ ਮਹਲਾ
Rāg gūjrī mėhlā 5.
Raag Goojaree, Fifth Mehl:

ਕਾਹੇ ਰੇ ਮਨ ਚਿਤਵਹਿ ਉਦਮੁ ਜਾ ਆਹਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਜੀਉ ਪਰਿਆ
Kāhe re man cẖiṯvahi uḏam jā āhar har jī▫o pari▫ā.
Why, O mind, do you plot and plan, when the Dear Lord Himself provides for your care?


ਸੈਲ ਪਥਰ ਮਹਿ ਜੰਤ ਉਪਾਏ ਤਾ ਕਾ ਰਿਜਕੁ ਆਗੈ ਕਰਿ ਧਰਿਆ ॥੧॥
Sail pathar mėh janṯ upā▫e ṯā kā rijak āgai kar ḏẖari▫ā. ||1||
From rocks and stones He created living beings; He places their nourishment before them. ||1||


ਮੇਰੇ ਮਾਧਉ ਜੀ ਸਤਸੰਗਤਿ ਮਿਲੇ ਸੁ ਤਰਿਆ
Mere māḏẖa▫o jī saṯsangaṯ mile so ṯari▫ā.
O my Dear Lord of souls, one who joins the Sat Sangat, the True Congregation, is saved.

ਗੁਰ ਪਰਸਾਦਿ ਪਰਮ ਪਦੁ ਪਾਇਆ ਸੂਕੇ ਕਾਸਟ ਹਰਿਆ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ
Gur parsāḏ param paḏ pā▫i▫ā sūke kāsat hari▫ā. ||1|| rahā▫o.
By Guru's Grace, the supreme status is obtained, and the dry wood blossoms forth again in lush greenery. ||1||Pause||


ਜਨਨਿ ਪਿਤਾ ਲੋਕ ਸੁਤ ਬਨਿਤਾ ਕੋਇ ਕਿਸ ਕੀ ਧਰਿਆ
Janan piṯā lok suṯ baniṯā ko▫e na kis kī ḏẖari▫ā.
Mothers, fathers, friends, children and spouses-no one is the support of anyone else.


ਸਿਰਿ ਸਿਰਿ ਰਿਜਕੁ ਸੰਬਾਹੇ ਠਾਕੁਰੁ ਕਾਹੇ ਮਨ ਭਉ ਕਰਿਆ ॥੨॥
Sir sir rijak sambāhe ṯẖākur kāhe man bẖa▫o kari▫ā. ||2||
For each and every person, our Lord and Master provides sustenance. Why are you so afraid, O mind? ||2||


ਊਡੇ ਊਡਿ ਆਵੈ ਸੈ ਕੋਸਾ ਤਿਸੁ ਪਾਛੈ ਬਚਰੇ ਛਰਿਆ
Ūde ūd āvai sai kosā ṯis pācẖẖai bacẖre cẖẖari▫ā.
The flamingoes fly hundreds of miles, leaving their young ones behind.


ਤਿਨ ਕਵਣੁ ਖਲਾਵੈ ਕਵਣੁ ਚੁਗਾਵੈ ਮਨ ਮਹਿ ਸਿਮਰਨੁ ਕਰਿਆ ॥੩॥
Ŧin kavaṇ kẖalāvai kavaṇ cẖugāvai man mėh simran kari▫ā. ||3||
Who feeds them, and who teaches them to feed themselves? Have you ever thought of this in your mind? ||3||

What do you understand from the part that is in bold above?


ਸਭਿ ਨਿਧਾਨ ਦਸ ਅਸਟ ਸਿਧਾਨ ਠਾਕੁਰ ਕਰ ਤਲ ਧਰਿਆ
Sabẖ niḏẖān ḏas asat sidẖān ṯẖākur kar ṯal ḏẖari▫ā.
All the nine treasures, and the eighteen supernatural powers are held by our Lord and Master in the Palm of His Hand.


ਜਨ ਨਾਨਕ ਬਲਿ ਬਲਿ ਸਦ ਬਲਿ ਜਾਈਐ ਤੇਰਾ ਅੰਤੁ ਪਾਰਾਵਰਿਆ ॥੪॥੫॥
Jan Nānak bal bal saḏ bal jā▫ī▫ai ṯerā anṯ na parāvari▫ā. ||4||5||
Servant Nanak is devoted, dedicated, forever a sacrifice to You, Lord. Your Expanse has no limit, no boundary. ||4||5||

Regards

Tejwant Singh
 
Last edited:
📌 For all latest updates, follow the Official Sikh Philosophy Network Whatsapp Channel:

Latest Activity

Top