Do You Believe In Reincarnation Or Transmigration?

[Satyaban]

^

Sure I agree to that.
But perhaps you have a different way of understanding why babies are born with defects, crippled or die at an early age.

 

[Satyaban]

Where has my signature gone?

 

[Satyaban]

How about this time?

 

[Harry Haller]

^

Sure I agree to that.
But perhaps you have a different way of understanding why babies are born with defects, crippled or die at an early age.

ahh that's a different sphere altogether, in Sikhism, we file that under the medical department, it has nothing to do with God or religion, in my opinion

 

[Gyani Jarnail Singh]

One may say anyway..and be in doaba or timbuktoo...PUNJABI is PUNJABI and its NAMASkaar in PUNJABI. There is no SH...its just a S...0

 

[Brother Onam]

One mistake in the statement below which needs correction.




To be changed to:

"The reason being that what we refer to as being results, i.e. the states akin to heaven and hell are in reality, the pleasant feelings that accompany either a wholesome state of mind or that which accompanies attachment and the unpleasant feeling that comes with aversion."

Paji, you know you can go back and edit the original post (correct it at its source)

 

[Brother Onam]

I believe in it because I heard about it in the gurdwara as true, like there was this story about this guy in the gurdwara who gives prashad to people and he purposly ignored one person who didn't get any and the prashad giver was a very angry person to and told the person who didn't get the prashad "stop dancing around like a bear" and the person was like "no you are" and laster in life he died and the guru ji meet the prashad giver as a bear dancer in the streets and I can't remember this part but his son (prashad giver) was there to and when the guru ji stopped and bought the bear and took it's life away as in sending him to saach khand the prashad giver's son looked at the guru ji and asked why he did that and then he explained this whole story again.. there was another story about baby crows in a nest and the guru ji told mardana(?) to get the one who creates the most noise down and he did and the guru ji took its life away ((sent to saach khand)) because it was a sikh in its past life but was a really cranky one.. I am not 100% which guru was in the first one I explained.

With all due respect, sister, please consider punctuation and paragraphs!

 

[Harry Haller]

With all due respect, sister, please consider punctuation and paragraphs!

oh and content! lol

 

[Satyaban]

One may say anyway..and be in doaba or timbuktoo...PUNJABI is PUNJABI and its NAMASkaar in PUNJABI. There is no SH...its just a S...0

Lord Shiva's name is spelled both ways I would leave out the "h" if I could use the proper accent mark. "Namaste" is perfectly serviceable.
Just sayin.

 

[Satyaban]

ahh that's a different sphere altogether, in Sikhism, we file that under the medical department, it has nothing to do with God or religion, in my opinion

So you consider it to be random from an non-caring god with no purpose. There has to be more to life. Anyway what you or I believe does not change reality.

 

[Sherdil]

So you consider it to be random from an non-caring god with no purpose. There has to be more to life. Anyway what you or I believe does not change reality.

Hukam bro. Hukmay andar sabh ko, bahar Hukam nah kohi. This means everything is dictated by the natural law. Nothing falls outside of it.

Guru Nanak, panna 7:

aakhan jor chupai neh jor ||
jor n ma(n)gan dhaen n jor ||
jor n jeevan maran neh jor ||
jor n raaj maal man sor ||
jor n surathee giaan veechaar ||
jor n jugathee shhuttai sa(n)saar ||
jis hathh jor kar vaekhai soe ||
naanak outham neech n koe ||33||

No power to speak, no power to keep silent.
No power to beg, no power to give.
No power to live, no power to die.
No power to rule, with wealth and occult mental powers.
No power to gain intuitive understanding, spiritual wisdom and meditation.
No power to find the way to escape from the world.
He alone has the Power in His Hands. He watches over all.
O Nanak, no one is high or low. ||33||

Why would God make people disabled for bad karma, if it was never in their control? We are all puppets on a string. He is the puppet master.

 

[Sherdil]

Also, remember if there really is no "good" and "bad", then the system of reward and punishment doesn't exist.

There is only action and reaction. That's why Buddhists think that by not acting, they can do no harm.

Sikhi isn't about getting a reward. It's about finding a greater purpose in life, by focusing on things that matter and cutting out the nonsense that doesn't matter.

We are all in our boats, trying to cross the world ocean. If we help each other along, and don't try to rock each other's boats, then the journey is that much better. You feelz?

 

[Satyaban]

That is what karma is a natural law of cause and effect. There is no good or bad there just is and as I said how we characterize our view of events is driven by our attachments to this temporal plane, a plane that is always changing and not permanent. This is not the absolute reality but has a purpose. This is what I believe

 

[Harry Haller]

So you consider it to be random from an non-caring god with no purpose. There has to be more to life. Anyway what you or I believe does not change reality.

non caring, purpose, random, are words that we use as humans to describe human events, I do believe that the God I follow falls outside these qualities, including all compassing love, punishment, reward,

The God I believe in has qualities I am unable to comprehend or describe, other than the limited information given in Mool Mantra.

Everything that occurs is completely in tandem with natural law, nature and science. We make our own karma by the actions we take, the words we speak, and the thoughts we have.

I realise I have misused the word karma, but that is the only meaning I am able to embrace, instant karma!. Drink during pregnancy, carry a bad gene, or just plain circumstance, but thats where your ill babies come from.

I do not recognise a God whom punishes people without the benefit of the memory that caused the crime. It is like a bad film, erase the memory before the punishment, so lets say I am a quadraplegic, my punishment is very real, the reasons for, to me, do not exist, what can I learn from this?

Guru Nanakji simplified this, live by the truth, become a Khalsa, and thats it. Sure saves time........

 

[Sherdil]

That is what karma is a natural law of cause and effect. There is no good or bad there just is and as I said how we characterize our view of events is driven by our attachments to this temporal plane, a plane that is always changing and not permanent. This is not the absolute reality but has a purpose. This is what I believe

Then we are in agreement. However, in your previous statement you said people have birth defects due to their previous karma.

How does one make this link? The mind has no recollection of past lives, yet the soul is made to suffer. Doesn't this create an imperfection in your view of the natural law?

If the soul plays no part in actions and reactions, then there is no purpose of a soul. It might as well not exist. If that is the case, then there is no credence to the notion that we attain our bodies based on our previous life actions.

You said that lack of this system would mean that god doesn't care and we have no purpose. But then why don't we remember what we did? It seems cruel to give a punishment, when person doesn't even know what they did.

 

[Sherdil]

Harry ji brings up another point:

What if the mother is an alcoholic and a druggy? Isn't it then her fault for her baby's defect?

My take is that who we are is based on the meeting between our parents. If they never found each other, then we wouldn't be here. There never was another me and there never will be one in the future.

Now is my one and only chance to realize Ik Oankaar.

 

[Sherdil]

non caring, purpose, random, are words that we use as humans to describe human events, I do believe that the God I follow falls outside these qualities, including all compassing love, punishment, reward,

The God I believe in has qualities I am unable to comprehend or describe, other than the limited information given in Mool Mantra.

Everything that occurs is completely in tandem with natural law, nature and science. We make our own karma by the actions we take, the words we speak, and the thoughts we have.

I realise I have misused the word karma, but that is the only meaning I am able to embrace, instant karma!. Drink during pregnancy, carry a bad gene, or just plain circumstance, but thats where your ill babies come from.

I do not recognise a God whom punishes people without the benefit of the memory that caused the crime. It is like a bad film, erase the memory before the punishment, so lets say I am a quadraplegic, my punishment is very real, the reasons for, to me, do not exist, what can I learn from this?

Guru Nanakji simplified this, live by the truth, become a Khalsa, and thats it. Sure saves time........

Harry ji, have you seen the film "Memento".

The main character keeps reliving his hell because he can't remember what he did.

no, I have not, but I will look it up!

 

[Ishna]

Memento is a pretty good, if a tad mind-bending, film.

 

[Satyaban]

Then we are in agreement. However, in your previous statement you said people have birth defects due to their previous karma.

How does one make this link? The mind has no recollection of past lives, yet the soul is made to suffer. Doesn't this create an imperfection in your view of the natural law?

If the soul plays no part in actions and reactions, then there is no purpose of a soul. It might as well not exist. If that is the case, then there is no credence to the notion that we attain our bodies based on our previous life actions.

You said that lack of this system would mean that god doesn't care and we have no purpose. But then why don't we remember what we did? It seems cruel to give a punishment, when person doesn't even know what they did.

I have not used the word punishment. Karma is a natural law which always works toward balance. The conscious mind we are communicating with has no memory.

I believe our purpose is for the atman to reunite with The Creator and the purpose of karma is to cause our atman to mature and evolve not as punishment.

As an example 2 years ago my apartment was consumed by fire along with most of what I owned. I almost welcomed it because I knew it was bringing my karma back towards being balanced.

My point is that some karma cannot be balanced in one lifetime, we continue rebirth until all karma is resolved. This happens by living increasingly more spiritual lives.

This is what I believe. I am not trying to convert you and I hope you are not doing that to me.

 

[Satyaban]

Harry ji brings up another point:

What if the mother is an alcoholic and a druggy? Isn't it then her fault for her baby's defect?

My take is that who we are is based on the meeting between our parents. If they never found each other, then we wouldn't be here. There never was another me and there never will be one in the future.

Now is my one and only chance to realize Ik Oankaar.

Why was the baby born to such a mother? Karma