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Islam Sikh-Muslim Marriages

spnadmin

1947-2014 (Archived)
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Jun 17, 2004
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Zahim ji

This statement in your post above "is there something you don't like about your own women ?" is the type of development that makes me think we are headed in the direction of dawah. In other words, we are at the stage of baiting forum members in the hopes they will become angered. We might not be to a full-blown dawah yet. I warned you about it on a different thread.
 

Lee

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May 17, 2005
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London, UK
Zahim ji

This statement in your post above "is there something you don't like about your own women ?" is the type of development that makes me think we are headed in the direction of dawah. In other words, we are at the stage of baiting forum members in the hopes they will become angered. We might not be to a full-blown dawah yet. I warned you about it on a different thread.


Indeed, the most frightening aspect of these words is the sense of ownsership.

'Your own woman'. What about 'Their own woman'?

I was at a family funeral last week, I asked my wife to come with me for support(mine that is) and she agreed to go with me.

During the meal after the survise my wife and I were joking around and she made some comment about not letting me have some cash. My cusion then made a comment a long the lines of after 20 years of marriage I still have not got her trained yet, to which I laughed, recived a playfull slap from the wife, and declared, 'Training? No sorry cuz, she is her own woman'.

Perhaps the poster merely meant a woman that belongs to the same faith?
 

Randip Singh

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May 25, 2005
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Indeed, the most frightening aspect of these words is the sense of ownsership.

'Your own woman'. What about 'Their own woman'?

I was at a family funeral last week, I asked my wife to come with me for support(mine that is) and she agreed to go with me.

During the meal after the survise my wife and I were joking around and she made some comment about not letting me have some cash. My cusion then made a comment a long the lines of after 20 years of marriage I still have not got her trained yet, to which I laughed, recived a playfull slap from the wife, and declared, 'Training? No sorry cuz, she is her own woman'.

Perhaps the poster merely meant a woman that belongs to the same faith?


Absolutely

The Tenth Master recognised women were equal but Independent in their own right.

He gave the title Singh to men and Kaur (which has come to mean Princess but actually means Prince) to women. Both Tigers and Prince's are rulers in their own right, and they rule in their OWN domains, and yet they are still subservient to the King, waheguru.
 
Jan 29, 2010
40
1
Tehran
Zahim ji

This statement in your post above "is there something you don't like about your own women ?" is the type of development that makes me think we are headed in the direction of dawah. In other words, we are at the stage of baiting forum members in the hopes they will become angered. We might not be to a full-blown dawah yet. I warned you about it on a different thread.

Narayanjot,

I was not trying to inflame people, but the question arises given the title of the thread and reading the first comment as you would.

I was giving you my observation about Muslim girls who were involved in prostitution or acts to that effect and had a tough job marrying with a partner of her choice in her community so they settle for something else..

Not trying to anger just trying to ask
 
Jan 29, 2010
40
1
Tehran
Prostitution? ? I doubt that very much. Immigrant families tend to be hard working and respectable for the most part, however I can see why families would label their children outside their faith (culture) with such terms.

I have met many Iranian Muslims and I must admit I do find them really cultured and a lot different from Arabs. Very broad minded people, and not like the stereo type you see in the media. Infact most Punjabi's are probably Iranian settlers who took lands from teh Dravidians. It could be said the caste system was set up to maintain that "Iranian/Aryan" racial purity. I know for a fact Iranians would go mental if their son or daughter married a non-Iranian (albeit a Muslim one). It would be seen as polluting their bloodlines.

As for the rest of the questions, I think every community have people will lax morals, and on the contrary.

Sikhs especially in the UK are prone to be the most endogamous when it comes to marriage (I will try and dig the report up).

PS

I don't think that thread was about how tasty Halal meat was btw, if you did think that, then you must learn to read more closely.

What ?
 
Jan 29, 2010
40
1
Tehran
Dear Dalsingh Ji,

Sat Sri Akal,

Your last comment [above] was: `Please take some time to explain why a Muslim women marrying a Sikh is forbidden by the Quran? Also why Islamic law sanctions murder for Islamic people who have converted to other faiths Nadeem'


Before answering your question, please kindly furnish me with the Quranic evidence against which your statement stands. I take it that you are aware that the Quran was written before the Sikh Dharma was manifested in the world and that you nevertheless wish me to take your request as sincere? The last thing I wish is to do is embarrass a Sikh for possessing insufficient knowledge of a subject on which he or she is willing to make a public statement.

Respectfully,

Nadeem

Wasalam Nadeem,

People of the book ie al-Qu'ran inclue Jews, Christians and Muslims, it won't mention the myriad of other religions as they were founded well after Islam..

Religions in the Modern World: Traditions and Transformations: Amazon.co.uk: Paul Fletcher, Hiroko Kawanami, Linda Woodhead, David Smith, Paul Fletcher, David Smith: Books

Allah Hafiz
 
Jan 29, 2010
40
1
Tehran
What you don't understand?:yes:

What you are trolling ?:tongue:

Or what you don't simply understand English?;)

If your telling me your some kind of Iranian :}{}{}:, forget it dude...(as if)

As for Arabs, the Iran-Iraq war دفاع مقدس was constructed by Reagan, Arab, Sh'ia and Sunni relations are only good when USA is not trying to grab its oil reserves. I'll leave your funny flying Scotsman theory to your imagination...
 

Bmandur

SPNer
May 15, 2008
198
235
Canada
:happykaur: Gurfateh to you Zahim JI & Nadeem JI

First Bhul Chuk Maaf Bolo Satnam Waheguru

I do not understand one thing why You & Other friends related to you doesn;t understand the real facts, There are over 300 girls in UK were involved with Muslim Boys and the Girls end in Pakistan.
One o f the girl escape and she told the story to all other girls to warn them
A Sikh girl or Muslim Girl shouldn’t be involve with any other religion than there own faith Religion they believe in.
The Tenth Master Guru Nanak Dev Ji to Guru Gobind Singh Ji recognised women were equal but Independent in their own right
We will never be able to sit and talk in as good peoples; we can go through with this topic like Bubblegum. Final word Grow up Live and let live :wah::wah::wah:
Gurfateh
 

spnadmin

1947-2014 (Archived)
SPNer
Jun 17, 2004
14,500
19,219
Narayanjot,

I was not trying to inflame people, but the question arises given the title of the thread and reading the first comment as you would.

I was giving you my observation about Muslim girls who were involved in prostitution or acts to that effect and had a tough job marrying with a partner of her choice in her community so they settle for something else..

Not trying to anger just trying to ask


Zahim ji

Your reply is appreciated, but it doesn't quite align with the observations I offered.

So -- I will be watching and reading and considering whether forum members are being baited to anger -- or not.
 

NALWA

SPNer
Feb 16, 2009
11
6
Surrey, BC, Canada
If any ***** girl (non Muslim girl ) has even a remote idea of marrying or even socialising with Muslim men,she will be well advised to know what the Quran and the Hadiths (stories from prophet Muhammad's life) say about a woman's position in society.In two simple words it's ' Bonded Slavery '. Do yourself a favor by going to jihadwatch.com or by reading 'The complete Infidels Guide to the Koran' by Robert Spencer.
 

Randip Singh

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May 25, 2005
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If your telling me your some kind of Iranian :}{}{}:, forget it dude...(as if)

I am a Sikh so why would I even care to think I am Iranian...to coin your phrase ...as if.

...and yes there are descendents of Iranians in India. Ever heard of Tata?


As for Arabs, the Iran-Iraq war دفاع مقدس was constructed by Reagan, Arab, Sh'ia and Sunni relations are only good when USA is not trying to grab its oil reserves. I'll leave your funny flying Scotsman theory to your imagination...

Actually hostilities between Arabs and Iranians pre-date religion or USA. Learn some history.

As for funny theories, again I suggest learn some history.
 
Jan 29, 2010
40
1
Tehran
Tata, yes they own Jaguar, and they are Pharsi not Shia Islam, and they are hardly the ancestors of Indian Sikhs...plus they probably equate to 0.0001% of the population which certainly does NOT qualify you to Iranian dude.

Before you teach me Islamic Iranian history learn about your own first dude I don't need to wear my religion on my sleeve or T shirt etc.. dude..:down:
 

Tejwant Singh

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Jun 30, 2004
5,024
7,183
Henderson, NV.
Zahim ji,

Guru Fateh.

I have a couple of questions for you for my own understanding of Islam and you are the right person to ask them.

1. How did Sunnis and Shias come into existence as two different sects of Islam and why is there an inherent hatred between them?

2.Who are the Aga Khanis and the Sufis and what is your opinion about them?

3.What is your personal opinion about the violence against the people of Iran by your government in your own country?

4.Did you participate in any of the protests? If yes, please share with us your experience and who did you vote for in the last elections?

Only by interacting we can build up an understanding.

Thanks

Tejwant Singh
 

Bmandur

SPNer
May 15, 2008
198
235
Canada
Zasim Nasir,
Gurfateh JI

Will you answer the questions asked ny Tejwant Singh ji Please

Also one more thing is it fare to kill others for blood
Is it fare to share a love of husband between three wives?
Is it fare to do not let the women in Mosq for prayer?
When a person is given a birth by women and she is not allowd to visit the Mosq?

Thank you
Gurfateh:happykaur:

Thank you
 

Randip Singh

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Historian
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May 25, 2005
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United Kingdom
Tata, yes they own Jaguar, and they are Pharsi not Shia Islam, and they are hardly the ancestors of Indian Sikhs...plus they probably equate to 0.0001% of the population which certainly does NOT qualify you to Iranian dude.

Err he's Indian. His ancestors have been there for over a thousand years when your Shia's forced them out. They persecuted their Zorastrian beliefs and the indians protected them.

..and I didn't say he was related to Indian Sikhs. Most Sikhs are termed as Indo-Aryans, possibly of Scythian origin. Nothing to do with modern day Shia Iran.

...and why the HELL the fixation with me being Iranian. Why the hell would I want to be called or even want to be associated with the biggoted Ahmendijad brigade or zealots?


Before you teach me Islamic Iranian history learn about your own first dude I don't need to wear my religion on my sleeve or T shirt etc.. dude..:down:

I know mine very well, and I also know about Islamic persecution of people who believe in Zorastrianism, the original Iranian religion.

Your Shia's are systematically destroying the old Iranian/Aryan culture.:yes:

Now thats a fact!!!!:happysingh:
 
Jan 29, 2010
40
1
Tehran
Zahim ji,

Guru Fateh.

I have a couple of questions for you for my own understanding of Islam and you are the right person to ask them.

1. How did Sunnis and Shias come into existence as two different sects of Islam and why is there an inherent hatred between them?

2.Who are the Aga Khanis and the Sufis and what is your opinion about them?

3.What is your personal opinion about the violence against the people of Iran by your government in your own country?

4.Did you participate in any of the protests? If yes, please share with us your experience and who did you vote for in the last elections?

Only by interacting we can build up an understanding.

Thanks

Tejwant Singh

Tejwent,

"There is no god but Alláh, Mohammed pbuh is the Messenger of Alláh, Alí is the Friend of Alláh. The Successor of the Messenger of Alláh And his first Caliph."
If you are already familiar with standard Sunni beliefs, you will immediately notice the addition to the shahadah regarding Imam Ali (ra), cousin of the Prophet (pbuh), husband of his daughter Fatima, father of Hassan and Hussein and the second person ever to embrace Islam. The term Shia derives from a shortening of Shiat Ali or partisans of Ali.

The so called 'differences' as you proclaim are nothing if you compare Islam to Christianity or Shia to one of your own Indian religions including Pharsis. The discord is usually magnified by Western media for their own interests, yet and as a former colonial state of British, I though you would have known better? But from my knowledge, the Sikhs usually sucked up to the British at the expense of their own countrymen...?

Aga khans are not Muslim and Sufis are usually seen an eccentric sect (every country has there share of fruitcakes) although most Sufi accept Shariat law.

The Situation in Iran is made worse by Western media as I said earlier, but you never hear the biggest voice in Iran and that is that all the main figures, Ahmadinejad, Mousavi, Rezaei have negative as well as positive points. I have to be careful about what I say, but Mousavi is considered a risk to Iran's nuclear capabilities, and since some of our neighbors including you lot have nukes, then to address the balance, its only right we have them too. India, China, Israel and even Pakistan for Alláh's sake even has them!! Personally Mehdi Karroubi was the best candidate but he's been overshadowed by the noise. If the US and Russians wont give up their weapons then why should Iran, I agree some mickey mouse states like Libya should be warned by the West but not us, we're Persian & proud :yes:

Merci
 
Jan 29, 2010
40
1
Tehran
Narayanjot,

You deleted, the post regarding equality of sikh women when it came to marriage to Muslim men and didn't answer the main point of this thread?

The only deletions (and there are no deletions on this thread) were related to your tendency to post off-topic comments. Narayanjot Kaur
 

Tejwant Singh

Mentor
Writer
SPNer
Jun 30, 2004
5,024
7,183
Henderson, NV.
Zahim Nasir,

Guru fateh.

Thanks for the response.

"There is no god but Alláh, Mohammed pbuh is the Messenger of Alláh, Alí is the Friend of Alláh. The Successor of the Messenger of Alláh And his first Caliph."
Thanks for sharing your belief. This world is full of them. The fact of the matter is that Allah came into existence for the Musilms much later than the God/s of the other two Abrahamic religions, Judaism and Christianity. Islam is the third one. This fact can not be denied no matter how much one tries.

As God is infinite, then once you give it/him/her a name, it ceases being infinite but becomes finite. So your claim that"There is no god but Alláh", makes Allah nothing but a finite one. Dogmas based on subjective truths make this happen which is very common in dogmatic religions.

So, if your God whom you call Allah sent a messenger then it shows that your God Allah is nothing but a personified deity, a being. Only a personified deity can send some so called messenger and that too only one claiming monopoly :) ,which itself makes no sense. And he came a bit too late in the picture of the existence of mankind. But as it is your belief and beliefs are not based on any truth, hence the name belief, I respect that.

If you are already familiar with standard Sunni beliefs, you will immediately notice the addition to the shahadah regarding Imam Ali (ra), cousin of the Prophet (pbuh), husband of his daughter Fatima, father of Hassan and Hussein and the second person ever to embrace Islam. The term Shia derives from a shortening of Shiat Ali or partisans of Ali.
Thanks for the history about your religion where hatred among Muslims is a norm not an exception but you have failed to respond to my questions for the reasons only known to you.

1. Why do Sunnis and Shias hate each other?

2. Why do they kill each other without any discrimination?

The fact is that suicide bombers are everyday occurrences in the Muslim world.

3. Do they consider each other infidels- kaffirs and yet serve the same personified deity called Allah?

4. Do they kill the fellow Muslims in the name of Allah?

5. Why all this hatred in the name of Allah when Islam is supposed to mean peace?

6. Is this some kind of self defeating prophecy in your claim,"There is no god but Alláh"?

The so called 'differences' as you proclaim are nothing if you compare Islam to Christianity or Shia to one of your own Indian religions including Pharsis.
Here, you are mixing apples with oranges and I hope it is an oversight rather than a deliberate attempt to mislead.

We are not comparing different religions here but we are strictly talking about Islam. So, let's stick to that otherwise it seems nothing but a cop out and some lame excuse and nothing but a dishonest attempt by a Muslim like you.

Aga khans are not Muslim and Sufis are usually seen an eccentric sect (every country has there share of fruitcakes) although most Sufi accept Shariat law.
In the above, you have done nothing but to play Allah, your personified deity. I am sure you have similar kind of feelings about the Sunnis. So, in other words, these factions have nothing to do with "There is no god but Alláh" but the men of Allah who hate each other. The suicide bombers are the factual manifestations of that and the killings happen daily. Do you deny that fact as a Muslim about the killings?


The Situation in Iran is made worse by Western media as I said earlier, but you never hear the biggest voice in Iran and that is that all the main figures, Ahmadinejad, Mousavi, Rezaei have negative as well as positive points.
It is easy to blame the Western media when there is a censorship and a shameless lie by the Iranian President when he was in the US and claimed that there were no gays in Iran which is hillarious to say the least.

Why do you think he lied about this trivial matter and why there is so much censorship in Iran and people being oppressed and getting disappeared?

Do Musilms usually lie in this shameless manner? Is this part of Islam?

And all this is thanks to the Western media called YOU TUBE that we can witness the massacre against the fellow Muslims daily, all in the name of Allah.

The fact is that Muslims are being killed by other Muslims in Iran and also around the world in other Islamic countries and you can not deny that fact no matter how much you try it and then Islam is called the religion of peace which is mocking the personified deity called Allah by his own followers.

I have to be careful about what I say, but Mousavi is considered a risk to Iran's nuclear capabilities, and since some of our neighbors including you lot have nukes, then to address the balance, its only right we have them too. India, China, Israel and even Pakistan for Alláh's sake even has them!! Personally Mehdi Karroubi was the best candidate but he's been overshadowed by the noise. If the US and Russians wont give up their weapons then why should Iran, I agree some mickey mouse states like Libya should be warned by the West but not us, we're Persian & proud
Here is my take about Nuclear energy. I am glad at least you are honest enough to say that this is all about making nuclear bombs which your own government has denied in a cowardly fashion.

No one can stop anyone from gaining knowledge which in this case is learning to have the nuclear capabilities. It is the wrong approach to do that and it is nothing but a defeatist attitude in my opinion by those who are trying this.

What the Europeans and especially The US could have done many years earlier if they had the vision is to offer the technology to all who wanted and could afford it. This would have created a better monitoring system and would have been the true pathway towards peace.

I think they should have this foresight even now and offer the nuclear technology to all the oil rich Sunni, Shias and other middle eastern countries, even Iraq because as I said before that no one can stop anyone to have knowledge so it is wise to offer it and be proactive rather than reactive.

Brasil, Argentina, South Africa have had the nuclear power plants for years and it has not created any rift there.

As far as Persians being proud is true for all the cultures and countries. So, for you to carry this pride flag on your own shows nothing but naiveté and ignorance.

And about Iran being a Mickey Mouse state, I agree with you. YOU TUBE daily images show that Iran is an oppressive state and daily kills its own Muslim people, all in the name of Allah.

I hope to get some honest answers about my questions to show me how proud a Persian you are in an honest manner.

Thanks & regards

Tejwant Singh
 
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