• Welcome to all New Sikh Philosophy Network Forums!
    Explore Sikh Sikhi Sikhism...
    Sign up Log in

What Is God?

Aug 28, 2010
1,514
1,116
73
Veer Ji If you are merged who is there to listen to ? As you are part of it just feel it.

The merged one is going to tell others about what is being experienced .
I think the merged one cant be silent.His words and actions become source of inspiration for others to seek for similar merger and get the experience.
GuRu-Sikhu is a continueing process.

Prakash.S.Bagga
 

Ambarsaria

ੴ / Ik▫oaʼnkār
Writer
SPNer
Dec 21, 2010
3,387
5,690
prakash.s.bagga ji some comments.
The merged one is going to tell others about what is being experienced .
I think the merged one cant be silent.His words and actions become source of inspiration for others to seek for similar merger and get the experience.
GuRu-Sikhu is a continuing process.
Prakash.S.Bagga
Prakash.S.Bagga ji with due respect who,

  • Declares someone is merged
    • It cannot be self judgement by the person themselves to declare themselves
  • Surely the un-merged don't know or can judge the qualities of a merged one
    • You got to be one to know one
  • Say the merged declare the other as merged having the quality to know so
    • Why would the merged publicize the other merged?
I come to the conclusion that all this merging and un-merging business is a mirage in the name of higher living to avoid truthful and practical living and be called for our actions.

It is like a shield as few will disturb a chanting, swaying, eyes closed person irrespective of the state of their heart being of virtue or malice. I am sure you heard the childhood story of Bagla Bhagat/"devious crane" who stands in shallow water with one leg up and eyes apparently closed to fool the fish so that he can grab and eat them. Far from generalizing I am simply flagging. peacesign

Sat Sri Akal.
 
Aug 28, 2010
1,514
1,116
73
prakash.s.bagga ji some comments.Prakash.S.Bagga ji with due respect who,

  • Declares someone is merged
    • It cannot be self judgement by the person themselves to declare themselves
  • Surely the un-merged don't know or can judge the qualities of a merged one
    • You got to be one to know one
  • Say the merged declare the other as merged having the quality to know so
    • Why would the merged publicize the other merged?
I come to the conclusion that all this merging and un-merging business is a mirage in the name of higher living to avoid truthful and practical living and be called for our actions.

It is like a shield as few will disturb a chanting, swaying, eyes closed person irrespective of the state of their heart being of virtue or malice. I am sure you heard the childhood story of Bagla Bhagat/"devious crane" who stands in shallow water with one leg up and eyes apparently closed to fool the fish so that he can grab and eat them. Far from generalizing I am simply flagging. peacesign

Sat Sri Akal.
Thanks for your pragmatic views but,
Does Sun requires any declaration that Sun is Sinining.?
Merger ONE is like Shining Sun.

Prakash.S.Bagga
 

Harry Haller

Panga Master
SPNer
Jan 31, 2011
5,769
8,194
55
The merged one is going to tell others about what is being experienced .
I think the merged one cant be silent.His words and actions become source of inspiration for others to seek for similar merger and get the experience.
GuRu-Sikhu is a continueing process.

Prakash.S.Bagga

<table cellspacing="5"><tbody><tr></tr><tr><td> ਜੇ ਕੋ ਆਖੈ ਬੋਲੁਵਿਗਾੜੁ
जे को आखै बोलुविगाड़ु ॥
Je ko ākẖai boluvigāṛ.
If anyone presumes to describe God,
</td></tr> <tr bgcolor="#BABAC7"><td> ਤਾ ਲਿਖੀਐ ਸਿਰਿ ਗਾਵਾਰਾ ਗਾਵਾਰੁ ॥੨੬॥
ता लिखीऐ सिरि गावारा गावारु ॥२६॥
Ŧā likī▫ai sir gāvārā gāvār. ||26||
he shall be known as the greatest fool of fools! ||26||
</td></tr></tbody></table>
Page 6 Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji


Fleetwood Mac - Go Your Own Way (HQ) - YouTube

Pink Floyd - Another Brick In The Wall (HQ) - YouTube

Prakashji

this is how babas and sants get their foot in, better to discount anyone who claims they know and concentrate on your own relationship with Creator within
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Aug 28, 2010
1,514
1,116
73
HARRY HALLAR Ji,
Thanks for your warning views but

I differ with the interpretation given for the Quote. My understanding
goes like this

ਜੇ ਕੋ ਆਖੈ ਬੋਲੁਵਿਗਾੜੁ
जे को आखै बोलुविगाड़ु ॥
Je ko ākẖai boluvigāṛ

If any one says a Single Manipulated Word,

ਤਾ ਲਿਖੀਐ ਸਿਰਿ ਗਾਵਾਰਾ ਗਾਵਾਰੁ ॥੨੬॥
ता लिखीऐ सिरि गावारा गावारु ॥२६॥
Ŧā likī▫ai sir gāvārā gāvār. ||26||

Then Such shall be written as the greatest fool of Fools.

Prakash.S.Bagga
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Harry Haller

Panga Master
SPNer
Jan 31, 2011
5,769
8,194
55
HARRY HALLAR Ji,
Thanks for your warning views but

I differ with the interpretation given for the Quote. My understanding
goes like this

ਜੇ ਕੋ ਆਖੈ ਬੋਲੁਵਿਗਾੜੁ
जे को आखै बोलुविगाड़ु ॥
Je ko ākẖai boluvigāṛ

If any one says a Single Manipulated Word,

ਤਾ ਲਿਖੀਐ ਸਿਰਿ ਗਾਵਾਰਾ ਗਾਵਾਰੁ ॥੨੬॥
ता लिखीऐ सिरि गावारा गावारु ॥२६॥
Ŧā likī▫ai sir gāvārā gāvār. ||26||

Then Such shall be written as the greatest fool of Fools.

Prakash.S.Bagga

<table cellspacing="5"><tbody><tr bgcolor="#BABAC7"><td> ਜੇ ਹਉ ਜਾਣਾ ਆਖਾ ਨਾਹੀ ਕਹਣਾ ਕਥਨੁ ਜਾਈ
जे हउ जाणा आखा नाही कहणा कथनु न जाई ॥
Je ha▫o jāṇā ākẖā nāhī kahṇā kathan na jā▫ī.
Even knowing God, I cannot describe Him; He cannot be described in words.
</td></tr></tbody></table>
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Aug 28, 2010
1,514
1,116
73
HARRY HALLAR Ji,
Refering to your quoteas
ਜੇ ਹਉ ਜਾਣਾ ਆਖਾ ਨਾਹੀ ਕਹਣਾ ਕਥਨੁ ਜਾਈ
जे हउ जाणा आखा नाही कहणा कथनु न जाई ॥
Je ha▫o jāṇā ākẖā nāhī kahṇā kathan na jā▫ī.
Even knowing God, I cannot describe Him; He cannot be described in words.

My understanding is that here the reference GOD for knowing is a mere assumption.
I consider that this knowing is related to the HUKAMu .It is about the HUKAMu
that even if I know can not be described as Hukamu is beyond description.

It is very clear to me that GOD can not be descibed as GOD is reference of A WORD only.

From Gurbanee one can know about GuR as the WAVE OF GOD which is perfectly described
Gurbanee is all about WAVE/WAVES OF GOD as GuRu-GuR. Therefore it is to be clear what is required to be known from Gurbanee .It is GuRu/GuR.

Try to understand GOD and THE WAVE /WAVES OF GOD.

In Gurbanee the reference GOD is same as GuROO
The WAVE/WAVES OF GOD as GuRu/GuR

Prakash.S.Bagga
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Harry Haller

Panga Master
SPNer
Jan 31, 2011
5,769
8,194
55
HARRY HALLAR Ji,
Refering to your quoteas
ਜੇ ਹਉ ਜਾਣਾ ਆਖਾ ਨਾਹੀ ਕਹਣਾ ਕਥਨੁ ਜਾਈ
जे हउ जाणा आखा नाही कहणा कथनु न जाई ॥
Je ha▫o jāṇā ākẖā nāhī kahṇā kathan na jā▫ī.
Even knowing God, I cannot describe Him; He cannot be described in words.

My understanding is that here the reference GOD for knowing is a mere assumption.
I consider that this knowing is related to the HUKAMu .It is about the HUKAMu
that even if I know can not be described as Hukamu is beyond description.

It is very clear to me that GOD can not be descibed as GOD is reference of A WORD only.

From Gurbanee one can know about GuR as the WAVE OF GOD which is perfectly described
Gurbanee is all about WAVE/WAVES OF GOD as GuRu-GuR. Therefore it is to be clear what is required to be known from Gurbanee .It is GuRu/GuR.

Try to understand GOD and THE WAVE /WAVES OF GOD.

In Gurbanee the reference GOD is same as GuROO
The WAVE/WAVES OF GOD as GuRu/GuR

Prakash.S.Bagga

Beloved Prakashji

I am of the opinion that those that have felt the wave/waves of God would be better off keeping it to themselves. Let it shine from them from their actions, their words, their thoughts, let others be inspired from them, that is good. As soon as ego shines through, as soon as pride shines through, the best intentions go to pot, and what might have started as a genuine need to share with others becomes a desperate need for love and attention, and before you know it, your in the back seat of a black Audi 4x4, with your picture plastered all over posters, blessing people, I guess it is the final 'merger' when you become God,

However, if you know, if you feel it, then you would also know the best way to change peoples hearts, and it is not proclaiming yourself wise, it is discretely getting on with life and watching the effect it has on others, and silently watching your works grow.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Aug 28, 2010
1,514
1,116
73
Dear Harry Hallar ji,
There is no question of claiming for knowing anything different which
has already been known thru the messages of GuRu from Gurbanee.

It would be wrong to construe the views of any person to have been
brabded as his own.The views what we all share is the understanding of
the messages of GuRu only.

I think one should share the views in the right spirit of the views.
I never claim that this is what I know or say. I may be wrong even
in my understanding.
Can any one deny that Gurbanee is not refering to the wave/waves
of the CREATOR ?

One should be fair while sharing the messages of Gurbanee then only
there can be uniformity in understanding our GuRu as WAH GuROO.

Prakash.S.Bagga
 

Harry Haller

Panga Master
SPNer
Jan 31, 2011
5,769
8,194
55
Prakashji

I do not put you in this camp, apologies if my post intimated that.

I think we all have our views, and that is just what they, our views, sharing them is a good idea, it promotes thinking and understanding.

It is when one feels that ones own view is correct above all others.

You have a special place in my heart, although your views are like marmite, I either loathe them, or love them, depending on the view :)
 
Aug 28, 2010
1,514
1,116
73
Prakashji

I do not put you in this camp, apologies if my post intimated that.

I think we all have our views, and that is just what they, our views, sharing them is a good idea, it promotes thinking and understanding.

It is when one feels that ones own view is correct above all others.

You have a special place in my heart, although your views are like marmite, I either loathe them, or love them, depending on the view :)


Thanks Harry Hallar Ji,

Prakash.S.Bagga
 

Harry Haller

Panga Master
SPNer
Jan 31, 2011
5,769
8,194
55
Veer Ji It's emerging not merging ,If I knew more I would say more,but I guess if you are God you don't need an Audi.

In the spirit of taking the edge off what has no edge!

au contraire dearest SPji when you become God, the first thing you need is an Audi, with a little silly red light!
 

palaingtha

SPNer
Aug 28, 2012
270
295
93
Last edited by palaingtha; Yesterday at 14:52 PM. Reason: to correct the saying.

If you are going to correct something, it always helps to correct it with something correct.

I do not find the above incorrect statement (leopard/spots) within Sikhism at all, a Sikh is a student a learner, one who is constantly changing, evolving, reaching for the truth, can you provide any basis for the above statement that it is Sikhi? or is it just another of your personal bigoted opinions?

Creator is everywhere and in everything, there is no need to merge at a later stage, the merging has already taken place, all we have to do is listen.

I do not understand why a few lines I had posted yesterday do not appear in its wholeness.
The part where I asked you to give your comments on Giani Jarnail Singh's experience regarding 1000 currency note vanished from his joora and was found when the magician cut a durian which Giani ji bought at the magicians asking.
If you admit you have double standards you will avoid a reply to the affect that you agree or disagree with Giani ji.
You again and again taunt upon my true story even in unrelated threads. Are you scared to comment adversely on Gianiji's posts?
I agree with Gianiji that his experience is true.
 

Harry Haller

Panga Master
SPNer
Jan 31, 2011
5,769
8,194
55
I do not understand why a few lines I had posted yesterday do not appear in its wholeness.
The part where I asked you to give your comments on Giani Jarnail Singh's experience regarding 1000 currency note vanished from his joora and was found when the magician cut a durian which Giani ji bought at the magicians asking.
If you admit you have double standards you will avoid a reply to the affect that you agree or disagree with Giani ji.
You again and again taunt upon my true story even in unrelated threads. Are you scared to comment adversely on Gianiji's posts?
I agree with Gianiji that his experience is true.

I felt it was the wrong place to debate with you on the subject in the 'introducing myself' thread. This is for new forum members to be welcomed, not to witness petty arguments between existing members.

After giving the matter some thought, I am at a loss to explain two things, firstly how the note ended up in Gianijis joora, but more importantly, why on earth someone with such powers would waste their time in a market place doing such things in the first place. There are people dying, wars being made, starvation, famine, why then would someone of such 'magic' be wasting time acting as a freak show?

I have no enimity with your goodself, however, if you wish to put yourself on a pedestal, and rant and rave as to who should be excommunicated and who should not, and then give misleading information to others, in some cases without even checking first, then someone has a duty to point out that your view is your view only, not the Sikh view. This equally applies to me, my view is my view.

I do not wish to cause you any stress or anger, especially at your age, in fact, I have had an earful from my wife on the subject, and I apologise for taunting you about the imps. I am afraid I am a child at heart, so, ok, no more imp jokes.

However, if it takes my opinion to balance yours, I will continue to do so

Regards and best wishes


harry
 

palaingtha

SPNer
Aug 28, 2012
270
295
93
I felt it was the wrong place to debate with you on the subject in the 'introducing myself' thread. This is for new forum members to be welcomed, not to witness petty arguments between existing members.

After giving the matter some thought, I am at a loss to explain two things, firstly how the note ended up in Gianijis joora, but more importantly, why on earth someone with such powers would waste their time in a market place doing such things in the first place. There are people dying, wars being made, starvation, famine, why then would someone of such 'magic' be wasting time acting as a freak show?

I have no enimity with your goodself, however, if you wish to put yourself on a pedestal, and rant and rave as to who should be excommunicated and who should not, and then give misleading information to others, in some cases without even checking first, then someone has a duty to point out that your view is your view only, not the Sikh view. This equally applies to me, my view is my view.

I do not wish to cause you any stress or anger, especially at your age, in fact, I have had an earful from my wife on the subject, and I apologise for taunting you about the imps. I am afraid I am a child at heart, so, ok, no more imp jokes.

However, if it takes my opinion to balance yours, I will continue to do so

Regards and best wishes


harry

Since you have expressed regret in taunting me in unconnected posts or otherwise it is ok for me. I was seeking explanation if you taunt me why no comments on others for same type of posts.
Let the matter end here.
I am a very sober man. I neither belittle others nor bear lying down unproved verbal attacks.
With sincere regards.
KSL.
 

Luckysingh

Writer
SPNer
Dec 3, 2011
1,634
2,758
Vancouver
Prakashji, Maybe this wave theory makes more sense.
I mean all of matter, everything around us consists of waves of vibration.
We all make our own waves and when we interact with other matter, then the waves come together.
Even my communication with you and everyone else is setting off some waves of vibration that induce further wave responses.

Overall, all the waves of vibration help to make up the God Wave.
Thus, if we disrupt and interrupt any of the smaller waves, they will still affect the God Wave.
This is why any inbalances and forced interruptions into any part of creation result in a disruption to the whole universe!!
 
Last edited:
Aug 28, 2010
1,514
1,116
73
LUCKY SINGH Ji,

I would like to add a little to the part of your message as
Thus, if we disrupt and interrupt any of the smaller waves, they will still affect the God Wave.

GOD WAVE/WAVES are perfect and are not affected by disruption or intruption of smallar waves.
Rather smallar waves get alligned with GOD Waves.
GOD wave/Waves are OMNIPOTENT and OMNIPRESENT

And it is the GOD WAVE/WAVES as CREATOR what is being refered
in Gurbanee as
"JAATi MAAHi JOTi JOTi MAAHi JATAA .... SALOK Asaa Di Var

Sothe CREATOR is to be known as JOTi. The literal meaning of JOTi is Light but
intrinsic meaning of JOTi is WAVEs that is why the word JOTi is PLURAL NUMBER

Further important to understand is that there is SOMETHING which is common in all
creations . What is that? It is JOTi - Waves of GOD only.

Therefore one is required to Focus on the understanding of JOTi- WAVES OF GOD
conforming to the message of Gurbanee as
SIKHI SIKHIYA GUR VICHAARi.

Prakash.S.Bagga
 

Ambarsaria

ੴ / Ik▫oaʼnkār
Writer
SPNer
Dec 21, 2010
3,387
5,690
Luckysingh ji I respect your great contributions. However we need to take stock sometimes if we are too adrift of what SGGS teaches us about the undefineable infinite creation/creator. One comment in reference to below,
... This is why any imbalances and forced interruptions into any part of creation result in a disruption to the whole universe!!
What makes you or me an expert on the rules of creator/creation to such a degree of definitiveness? Why couldn't the "imbalances' and "interruptions" we view as deviations instead not be the rules by design of the creator or creation.

We keep constantly falling into the trap that we are going to define creator and all creation. SGGS keeps warning us to not waste time on it. Why such a simple instruction or advice of our Guru ji's so hard to understand?

When we make global or God/creator like conjectures about waves and all that I believe we need to humbly step back and take stock of our self esteem and egos in relation to the vastness of creator and creation.

It is OK to be led astray accidentally but let us not lead ourselves astray by design. This applies to me as much as anyone so it is not a personal attack but just a comment.

Sat Sri Akal.
 

BhagatSingh

SPNer
Apr 24, 2006
2,921
1,657
ਤੋਹੀ ਮੋਹੀ ਮੋਹੀ ਤੋਹੀ ਅੰਤਰੁ ਕੈਸਾ ॥ ਕਨਕ ਕਟਿਕ ਜਲ ਤਰੰਗ ਜੈਸਾ ॥੧॥ ਜਉ ਪੈ ਹਮ ਨ ਪਾਪ ਕਰੰਤਾ ਅਹੇ ਅਨੰਤਾ ॥ਪਤਿਤ ਪਾਵਨ ਨਾਮੁ ਕੈਸੇ ਹੁੰਤਾ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ ਤੁਮ੍ਹ੍ਹ ਜੁ ਨਾਇਕ ਆਛਹੁ ਅੰਤਰਜਾਮੀ ॥ਪ੍ਰਭ ਤੇ ਜਨੁ ਜਾਨੀਜੈ ਜਨ ਤੇ ਸੁਆਮੀ ॥੨॥ਸਰੀਰੁ ਆਰਾਧੈ ਮੋ ਕਉ ਬੀਚਾਰੁ ਦੇਹੂ ॥ਰਵਿਦਾਸ ਸਮ ਦਲ ਸਮਝਾਵੈ ਕੋਊ ॥੩॥

Lucky Singh ji and Prakash ji,
"You are me, I am You, what is the difference? The difference is like the difference between gold and bangles, like water and it's waves!" Bhagat Ravidas ji says, "those beings are rare who can understand this." Glad to know, I am acquainted with such beings! :grinningsingh:
 
📌 For all latest updates, follow the Official Sikh Philosophy Network Whatsapp Channel:
Top