Yogism Why Not Yoga Practices?

[Anoop]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

I think we respect to all of you who have responded, there are some persons in here who do not quite know what is meant by yoga, or it could be me, who knows. Ofcourse, We must all follow what it says in sikhism, but, all i am saying is, just because it says read gurbani, it doesn't mean you always have to read gurbani, Guru Nanan Dev Ji een mentioned that you didnt neeed to do paath or anything. You should hae noble acts. Now the yoga i am talknig about is slow breathing exercises, and it is not a way to escape reality. To carry on reality, we should have good health. Yoga is not allways about being physically strong, yoga means union with oneself, meaning, inner cleansing. There is nothing wrong with yoga, and just because it says none of these will take you to god, people are getting to wrong idea. I mean, dont become to fanatic with religions. Everything is right, its up to you if you think its good or not. If it makes you spiritually strong, then why not go for it. After all Yoga is really about slow breathing exercise to make your mind clear and stable.

I know that there hae been misused information in sikhism as Hinduism has been playing tricks with people, which i hae heard about. But yoga is safe, and it helps you keep an open strong mind. If it helps you, then go for it. You cant always pick and choose...

 

[sachchasoda]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Anoop Ji,

Sikhi is- FOLLOW GURU JI NOT YOUR MIND. THERE ARE NO TRICKS.

GURU NANAK DEV JI SAYS-

gurbwxI sd aucrY hir mMin vswieAw ]

Whoever utters the Word of the Guru's Bani - the Lord is enshrined in his mind.


jIB rswieix swcY rwqI ]

Their tongues are imbued with the True Lord, the source of nectar;

hir pRBu sMgI Bau n BrwqI ]

abiding with the Lord God, they have no fear or doubt.

sRvx sRoq rjy gurbwxI joqI joiq imlweI hy ]

Hearing the Word of the Guru's Bani, their ears are satisfied, and their light merges into the Light.



bhul chuk maaf karna ji

Satpartap Singh

 

[sachchasoda]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

21khalsa13 Ji

aren't these your words- "how can I as an individual even begin to understand gurbani - a language which is not well known or understood by my punjabi family or the local gurdwaras - this understanding is held by special people who have experienced these realities not by people who are blindly reciting.

If it is not gurmat to learn from experiences how do i learn??
experience right or wrong can still teach - it is the attitude of the student to learn that is important.

are we sikhs - learning
are not - simplying following??"

to me it seems like you saying -
you dont understand gurbani
experience is more important than Guru Ji's Word


And most importantly, 21khalsa13 ji, it doesn't matter what we all think and say. Only thing that is important for a Sikh is DO WHAT GURU JI TELLS US TO DO. And if we are not doing it that indicates we are not Gursikhs- not Gurmukhs. We are supposed to become what Guru Ji tells us to become. We need to do what Guru Ji tells us to do. Through Gurbani Vichaar, we need to cleanse our koor.

sorry for the Gurmukhi font.

Please read the thread -Test of Gurmukhi Fonts: may find the solution to your problem.

bhul chuk maaf karna ji

Satpartap Singh

 

[sachchasoda]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Veer ji

Being fair is ok, but not at the cost of TRUE SIKH VALUES- GURU JI'S WORD- GURBANI.

Not sure how this works.

Bhen Ji,

How can we ponder on Gurmat as well as we be equaly fair to manmat? I can understand being a moderator you think that everybody must feel comfortable.

BUT TRUTH HAS TO BE REPEATED- THIS IS WHAT GURMAT VICHAAR IS. We need to tell each other what Guru Ji is saying again and again untill it totally gets into our heads. Guru is always right- this is the attitude we need to adopt.

TELL YOU THE TRUTH, GURMUKH TE MANMUKH can never agree on things. Both go their seperate ways- one is totally under Guru's hukam and the other is totally living in his/her own mind's way(whatever apeases the mann).

bhul chuk maaf karna ji

Satpartap Singh

 

[japjisahib04]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Gurbani is not forbidding yoga, but rather questions its value without naam, surrender, prayer and meditation. Others are saying--- "Along with naam, with surrender, with prayer and meditation, I use yoga because it adds value to my experience."

It seems this point need little clarification. I do Yoga almost everyday as an exercise to reduce my belly and while exercising I switch on Naam simran tape. For me Yoga is just an exercise and not a mean to merge with God.
Regards Sahni Mohinder

 

[sachchasoda]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Sahni Mohinder Ji a question- let us think about this

you really made me think.

Our Guru's did naamsimran all the time.
And Gurbani is Dhur Ki Bani- So IS WRITTEN WHEN GURU JI HAS ALREADY ACHIEVED THE HIGHEST STATE OF REALIZATION.

then why GURU JI SAYS SO:
pwTu piVE Aru bydu bIcwirE invil BuAMgm swDy ]
pMc jnw isau sMgu n CutikE AiDk AhMbuiD bwDy ]1]
ipAwry ien ibiD imlxu n jweI mY kIey krm Anykw ]
hwir pirE suAwmI kY duAwrY dIjY buiD ibbykw ] rhwau ]

jog isD Awsx caurwsIh ey BI kir kir rihAw ]
vfI Awrjw iPir iPir jnmY hir isau sMgu n gihAw ]6]


please please throw some light on this.


We been repeatedly told by Guru Ji that MIND AND BODY both are purified with naam simran

Anidnu BgqI riqAw mnu qnu inrmlu hoie ]


Why need specfically yoga to stay fit.

Satpartap

 

[japjisahib04]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Our Guru's did naamsimran all the time.
And Gurbani is Dhur Ki Bani- So IS WRITTEN WHEN GURU JI HAS ALREADY ACHIEVED THE HIGHEST STATE OF REALIZATION.

then why GURU JI SAYS SO:
pwTu piVE Aru bydu bIcwirE invil BuAMgm swDy ]
pMc jnw isau sMgu n CutikE AiDk AhMbuiD bwDy ]1]
ipAwry ien ibiD imlxu n jweI mY kIey krm Anykw ]
hwir pirE suAwmI kY duAwrY dIjY buiD ibbykw ] rhwau ]

jog isD Awsx caurwsIh ey BI kir kir rihAw ]
vfI Awrjw iPir iPir jnmY hir isau sMgu n gihAw ]6]
Satpartap

For your query I can only recommend to read the first pauri of japjisahib 'sauchai sauch na hovai to hukam rajaaeei chalna' where Guru Nanak is logically explaining the futility of hollow rituals which were being practiced during his ministry. Guru Nanak though fully realized soul was not practicing these rituals. I think you should get the answer.

Your first pankti paath padeo ur baid, the answer lies in third line where Guru Arjan Dev is explaning the futility and says you cannot be merge with your beloved by reading Vedas or performing useless rituals. Guruji didn't do jog sidh asan or other rituals. He is simply explaining logically so we stay away from them.
I have chosen Yoga just it is being advertised in TV regularly to reduce the belly. And not for any other reason. I could select hundred of other means prevalent.
Regards Sahni Mohinder

 

[spnadmin]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Bhai ji

"BUT TRUTH HAS TO BE REPEATED- THIS IS WHAT GURMAT VICHAAR IS. We need to tell each other what Guru Ji is saying again and again untill it totally gets into our heads. Guru is always right- this is the attitude we need to adopt."

No problem with this. What needs to be explained is this, How after achieving Guru ji's attitude or the "right attitude" can we ever again want to be anything other than FAIR.

Has nothing to do with being a moderator.

 

[sachchasoda]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Respected Sahni Mohinder Ji,

Thanks for your reply.

my query was in reference to your statement:

"Gurbani is not forbidding yoga" and you say you use it to reduce belly.

you didn't say anything on this:

Anidnu BgqI riqAw mnu qnu inrmlu hoie ]

As a Sikh brother i suggest- help handicaped people instead of wasting your energy on controlloing breath and all that of yoga(get groceries for them, mow their lawn, clean their house, paint their house, unending services are needed)- imagine how many other things will be done- good health and Social Service.

Gurbani tells us again and again:

mn myry gur kI mMin lY rjwie ]
mnu qnu sIqlu sBu QIAY nwmu vsY min Awie ]

mnu qnu inrmlu hoieAw lwgI swcu prIiq ]

iciq AwvY Esu pwrbRhmu qnu mnu sIqlu hoie ]

mnu qnu sIqlu DIrju pwieAw ]
pRBu AibnwsI bisAw Gt BIqir hir mMglu nwnku gwvY jIau ]



bhul chuk maaf karna ji

Satpartap Singh

 

[sachchasoda]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Bhai ji

"BUT TRUTH HAS TO BE REPEATED- THIS IS WHAT GURMAT VICHAAR IS. We need to tell each other what Guru Ji is saying again and again untill it totally gets into our heads. Guru is always right- this is the attitude we need to adopt."

No problem with this. What needs to be explained is this, How after achieving Guru ji's attitude or the "right attitude" we can ever again want to be anything other than FAIR.

Has nothing to do with being a moderator.

Bhen Ji,

When we go on this path, we always face opposition. This is the nature of MANMAT. It happens. There is no way we can apease everybody, it is just not possible. That's why this maarg is called- khandeydhaar.

mwn moh myr qyr ibbrijq eyhu mwrgu KMfy Dwr ]
To forsake pride, emotional attachment, and the sense of 'mine and yours', is the path of the double-edged sword.


KMfy Dwr glI Aiq BIVI ]

This path is very narrow, like the sharp edge of a sword.

lyKw lIjY iql ijau pIVI ]
laekhaa leejai thil jio peerree
When his account is read, he shall be crushed like the sesame seed in the mill.

mwq ipqw klqR suq bylI nwhI ibnu hir rs mukiq n kInw hy ]
Mother, father, spouse and child - none is anyone's friend in the end. Without the Lord's Love, no one is liberated.


"Being Fair to all"- I am sorry but I thought you meant to honor everybody's word in Practice. In other words: agreeing to everybody in word even if they are totally against Gurmat.

We are supposed to follow Guru Ji- leave mine and your views, doesn't matter how good/perfect/right they may sound. If my thinking clashes with what Guru Ji tells me to do- I am supposed to STOP right there. If I see my brotheren do something against Gurmat my duty is to remind them GURU JI's WORD- It is their choice they want to listen to Guru Ji or not.


bhul chuk maaf karna ji

Satpartap Singh

 

[spnadmin]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

mwn moh myr qyr ibbrijq eyhu mwrgu KMfy Dwr ]
To forsake pride, emotional attachment, and the sense of 'mine and yours', is the path of the double-edged sword.

The path you describe is the path I choose for myself with the Guru's grace. Not the path I am permitted to impose on another. All have a right to speak, as long as they do not slander and do no harm. Nanaak shows us that there is no sense of "mine and yours". His father gave him 40 rupees to start a business. He gave every penny to starving yogis. That was his choice and he bore the consequences of his decision when he returned to his father. Nanaak did not absolve himself from basic decency (even to yogis).

For meditation this evening perhaps.

 

[japjisahib04]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Respected Sahni Mohinder Ji,

Thanks for your reply.

you didn't say anything on this:

Anidnu BgqI riqAw mnu qnu inrmlu hoie ]

Gurbani tells us again and again:

mn myry gur kI mMin lY rjwie ]
mnu qnu sIqlu sBu QIAY nwmu vsY min Awie ]
mnu qnu inrmlu hoieAw lwgI swcu prIiq ]
iciq AwvY Esu pwrbRhmu qnu mnu sIqlu hoie ]
mnu qnu sIqlu DIrju pwieAw ]
pRBu AibnwsI bisAw Gt BIqir hir mMglu nwnku gwvY Iau ]
Satpartap Singh

You are very right as Guru Nanak Sahib tells to Yogis in 27th pauri of Japjisahib it is all the game of mann only 'mann jeetai jaghjeet' and mann ka tosa har naam hai thus mann cannot be win by yog assan.
Please visit http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/japji-sahib/2301-japji-sahib-7th-pauri.html

Regards Sahni Mohinder

 

[sachchasoda]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

mwn moh myr qyr ibbrijq eyhu mwrgu KMfy Dwr ]
To forsake pride, emotional attachment, and the sense of 'mine and yours', is the path of the double-edged sword.

The path you describe is the path I choose for myself with the Guru's grace. Not the path I am permitted to impose on another. All have a right to speak, as long as they do not slander and do no harm. Nanaak shows us that there is no sense of "mine and yours". His father gave him 40 rupees to start a business. He gave every penny to starving yogis. That was his choice and he bore the consequences of his decision when he returned to his father. Nanaak did not absolve himself from basic decency (even to yogis).

For meditation this evening perhaps.

Respected Bhen Ji,

I agree that all have a right to speak, absolutely. My original concern was that THIS THREAD IS UNDER 'GURMAT VICHAAR'. Being a Sikh are we supposed to debate what Guru Ji is saying OR discuss what Guru Ji is saying.

FOR A SIKH - GURU JI IS ALWAYS RIGHT.

And Guru Ji's teachings are UNIVERSAL. Bani include the message of those Saints as well who didn't even adhere to the Sikh Faith. The message of ONENESS OF GOD is for ALL.

Sikhism being an organized religion- has its own boundaries. So many sikhs are and have been deviating from these established boundaries due to their own personal and some social reasons, and finally ending up doing all that is forbidden by Our Gurus. These kind of issues must be addressed time to time, in the light of Gurbani to avoid this deviation. Other infiltrators who purposely came into the Sikh fold to dilute and pollute the Sikh doctrine will be opposing it(through misinterpretations of Gurbani and all their other mischievious ways), will go to the extent of slandering it, but still Truth has to be spoken-Guru's Word.


I ask for forgiveness if I created any confusion.

AND MY MOM IS URGING ME OVER THE PHONE -better get off the internet and concentrate on studyyyyyyyyyyy


bhul chuk maaf karni ji

Satpartap Singh

 

[spnadmin]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Fateh!

Good to make amends. Your mother could be speaking to many of us who need to get off the Internet and "get a life" as they would say in the US. Here is what the best of all worlds can be like, was like, for a brief moment in time-- naturally too hard to sustain for long. Five thieves always getting in the way.

Keepers of the Inner Peace

Listen always to your mother!

 

[Randip Singh]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Anoop Ji,

Sikhi is- FOLLOW GURU JI NOT YOUR MIND. THERE ARE NO TRICKS.

GURU NANAK DEV JI SAYS-

gurbwxI sd aucrY hir mMin vswieAw ]

Whoever utters the Word of the Guru's Bani - the Lord is enshrined in his mind.


jIB rswieix swcY rwqI ]

Their tongues are imbued with the True Lord, the source of nectar;

hir pRBu sMgI Bau n BrwqI ]

abiding with the Lord God, they have no fear or doubt.

sRvx sRoq rjy gurbwxI joqI joiq imlweI hy ]

Hearing the Word of the Guru's Bani, their ears are satisfied, and their light merges into the Light.



bhul chuk maaf karna ji

Satpartap Singh

Bani on page 213 nicely sums up the entire issue of Yoga and other practices....notice what Guru Nanak does:

ਗਉੜੀ ਮਹਲਾ ੫ ॥
गउड़ी महला ५ ॥
Ga­oṛī mehlā 5.
Gauree, Fifth Mehl:

ਸਭਹੂ ਕੋ ਰਸੁ ਹਰਿ ਹੋ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
सभहू को रसु हरि हो ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥
Sabẖhū ko ras har ho. ||1|| rahā­o.
The Lord is the essence of all. ||1||Pause||

ਕਾਹੂ ਜੋਗ ਕਾਹੂ ਭੋਗ ਕਾਹੂ ਗਿਆਨ ਕਾਹੂ ਧਿਆਨ ॥
काहू जोग काहू भोग काहू गिआन काहू धिआन ॥
Kāhū jog kāhū bẖog kāhū gi­ān kāhū ḏẖi­ān.
Some practice Yoga, some indulge in pleasures; some live in spiritual wisdom, some live in meditation.

ਕਾਹੂ ਹੋ ਡੰਡ ਧਰਿ ਹੋ ॥੧॥
काहू हो डंड धरि हो ॥१॥
Kāhū ho dand ḏẖar ho. ||1||
Some are bearers of the staff. ||1||

ਕਾਹੂ ਜਾਪ ਕਾਹੂ ਤਾਪ ਕਾਹੂ ਪੂਜਾ ਹੋਮ ਨੇਮ ॥
काहू जाप काहू ताप काहू पूजा होम नेम ॥
Kāhū jāp kāhū ṯāp kāhū pūjā hom nėm.
Some chant in meditation, some practice deep, austere meditation; some worship Him in adoration, some practice daily rituals.

ਕਾਹੂ ਹੋ ਗਉਨੁ ਕਰਿ ਹੋ ॥੨॥
काहू हो गउनु करि हो ॥२॥
Kāhū ho ga­un kar ho. ||2||
Some live the life of a wanderer. ||2||

ਕਾਹੂ ਤੀਰ ਕਾਹੂ ਨੀਰ ਕਾਹੂ ਬੇਦ ਬੀਚਾਰ ॥
काहू तीर काहू नीर काहू बेद बीचार ॥
Kāhū ṯīr kāhū nīr kāhū bėḏ bīcẖār.
Some live by the shore, some live on the water; some study the Vedas.

ਨਾਨਕਾ ਭਗਤਿ ਪ੍ਰਿਅ ਹੋ ॥੩॥੨॥੧੫੫॥
नानका भगति प्रिअ हो ॥३॥२॥१५५॥
Nānkā bẖagaṯ pari­a ho. ||3||2||155||
Nanak loves to worship the Lord. ||3||2||155||

Should we not follow Guru Nanak?

 

[kds1980]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

dear randip singh ji

i think gurbani criticises yoga as method for reaching god.i don't think gurbani is against yoga if someone do it for health reason.it is just a light exercise.

 

[sachchasoda]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

Randip Veer Ji there is one from Dhan Guru Ram Das Ji:

Ang: 163

<> siqgur pRswid ]
One Universal Creator God. By The Grace Of The True Guru:

pMifqu swsq isimRiq piVAw ]
The Pandit - the religious scholar - recites the Shaastras and the Simritees;

jogI gorKu gorKu kirAw ]
the Yogi cries out, ""Gorakh, Gorakh"".

mY mUrK hir hir jpu piVAw ]1]
But I am just a fool - I just chant the Name of the Lord, Har, Har. ||1||



bhul chuk maaf karna ji

Satpartap Singh

 

[sachchasoda]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

kds1980 Ji,



ismrau ismir ismir suKu pwvau ]
Meditate, meditate, meditate in remembrance of Him, and find peace.

kil klys qn mwih imtwvau ]
Worry and anguish shall be dispelled from your body.



qnu sUcw so AwKIAY ijsu mih swcw nwau ]

That body is said to be pure, in which the True Name abides.


jw kau icMqw bhuqu bhuqu dyhI ivAwpY rogu ]
When you are plagued by great and excessive anxiety, and diseases of the body;

igRsiq kutMib plyitAw kdy hrKu kdy sogu ]
when you are wrapped up in the attachments of household and family, sometimes feeling joy, and then other times sorrow;

gauxu kry chu kuMt kw GVI n bYsxu soie ]
when you are wandering around in all four directions, and you cannot sit or sleep even for a moment

iciq AwvY Esu pwrbRhmu qnu mnu sIqlu hoie ]3]
-if you come to remember the Supreme Lord God, then your body and mind shall be cooled and soothed. ||3||



srb rog kw AauKdu nwmu ]
The Naam is the panacea, the remedy to cure all ills.


The secret for good health and medicine for all diseases also NAAM SIMRAN hai ji.


Guru Ji's prescription: TO DOs

srb Drm mih sRyst Drmu ]
Of all religions, the best religion

hir ko nwmu jip inrml krmu ]
is to chant the Name of the Lord and maintain pure conduct.

sgl ik®Aw mih aUqm ikirAw ]
Of all religious rituals, the most sublime ritual

swDsMig durmiq mlu ihirAw ]
is to erase the filth of the dirty mind in the Company of the Holy.

sgl audm mih audmu Blw ]
Of all efforts, the best effort

hir kw nwmu jphu jIA sdw ]
is to chant the Name of the Lord in the heart, forever.

sgl bwnI mih AMimRq bwnI ]
Of all speech, the most ambrosial speech

hir ko jsu suin rsn bKwnI ]
is to hear the Lord's Praise and chant it with the tongue.

sgl Qwn qy Ehu aUqm Qwnu ]
Of all places, the most sublime place,

nwnk ijh Git vsY hir nwmu ]8]3]
O Nanak, is that heart in which the Name of the Lord abides. ||8||3||



bhul chuk maaf karna ji

Satpartap Singh

 

[kds1980]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

The secret for good health and medicine for all diseases also NAAM SIMRAN hai ji.

so does it mean that we should do no exercise?

 

[sachchasoda]

Re: Why Not Yoga Practices

kds1980 Ji,

Nirmal karam -

may include:
providing help to those who are handicapped or old-GOOD EXERCISE
providing game coaching to kids
cleaning Gurdwara
Langar seva
Other Volunteer Work
and more


ALL THE ABOVE ARE BETTER EXERCISES THAN YOGA- as others benefit from these. and there is always some work needed to be done in any city of the world.

bhul chuk maaf karni ji

Satpartap Singh